Intel Claims DRM'd Chip Is Not DRM, It's Just Copy Protection

from the um,-that's-the-same-thing dept

Fri, Jan 7th 2011 12:44pm — Mike Masnick

There's been a lot of talk this week about Intel building DRM into its Sandy Bridge chip. I had initially passed on writing this story, as we seem to hear the same thing every few years. Back in 2005, for example, there were similar stories about Intel planning DRM built into its chip. However, what got me interested enough to actually write about this is Intel's bizarre response to the press coverage, in which they play one of the most ridiculous games of corporate doublespeak in ages. First, they insist it's not DRM. They say that right up in the headline: "No, It's Not DRM" Then they kick it off with an explanation of what DRM is, followed up by again saying: "I am not going to get into a discussion about the pros and cons of DRM in this blog; but I will say that Intel Insider is NOT a DRM technology." Ok. So what is it. That's in the next paragraph:

Intel Insider is a service that enables consumers to enjoy premium Hollywood feature films streamed to their PC in high quality 1080P high definition. Currently this service does not exist because the movie studios are concerned about protecting their content, and making sure that it cannot be stolen or used illegally. So Intel created Intel insider, an extra layer of content protection.

Um. So it is DRM. You just said it's not, and then described DRM. Content protection is DRM. I'm not sure exactly what Intel thinks it's doing here. If they say it's not DRM and then explain how it is DRM, they think people will think it's not DRM? If you're going to include DRM, just admit that it's DRM. Then we can argue about whether or not it's smart (and, no, it's not).

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Filed Under: copy protection, drm, hollywood
Companies: intel

101 Comments

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Killer_Tofu (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 12:36pm

Kowtowing
Isn't Intel a little far removed from the MAFIAA to have to kowtow to their requests and pressures to "help us save our business from half a century ago!"?

What do they possibly have to gain by helping those groups? I must have missed some news somewhere because I just can't see anything they have to gain, aside from maybe being paid off to do so.

I doubt their sue the 3rd party efforts could manage to get far enough to actually sue Intel or others and not get thrown out of court.

I must have missed something. Anyone care to fill in the blank for me here?
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:Lobo Santo (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 12:49pm

Re: Kowtowing
Like the song lyric says:

Money money money money mo - - ney!
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Nastybutler77 (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 12:51pm

Force Fail
These aren't the droids you're looking for.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Poster, 7 Jan 2011 @ 12:51pm

Sounds like DRM to me.
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Matt Polmanteer (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 12:56pm

Haha
I was just about to send this link over so everyone could get a good laugh. I was actually looking at building a new computer and was looking leaning towards Intel but now I'm going with AMD. Glad this came out now.
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:03pm

They don't give you much info in that article, what the describe could be accomplished using encryption that the user has 100% control over, which wouldn't be DRM. The fact that they are skimping on the details makes me think that probably isn't the case though.
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Matthew (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:04pm

The explanation is not really about DRM...
The explanation is not really about DRM - it's a preemptive cry for mercy from the antitrust investigators.

For the record, they aren't kowtowing - they're trying to put in a piece of DRM that will be so attractive to the MAFIAAs that their competitors get frozen out of the market for any device that plays audio or video, which these days, is pretty much everything. Bending the customers over and stuffing their rights where the sun don't shine is just part of doing business (and government) these days.
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Derek, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:10pm

Best line from Intel Blog
This technology is built into the new Intel chips and will become even more important once wireless display technology like Intel�s WiDi become more popular, as it would prevent pirates from stealing movies remotely just by snooping the airwaves.
As if there are pirates snooping around every rock trying to STEAL YOUR MOVIES!
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:10pm

I am shocked it took this long for TD to jump all over this one.

Hint: The future is coming, and it won't be wide open. Deal with it.
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Mario, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:12pm

Re: Kowtowing
"Isn't Intel a little far removed from the MAFIAA to have to kowtow to their requests and pressures to "help us save our business from half a century ago!"?"

Well, actually, Intel is quite an important part of the MAFIAA cartel because they're the ones who created HDCP for the content arm of MAFIAA. For those that aren't familiar with HDCP, HDCP is the encryption mechanism used to "secure" data going over HDMI connections. HDMI is just the classic DVI with HDCP on top.
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AW, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:15pm

Re:
Hint: it's called Anti-trust laws, deal with it.
Locking out an operating system, which is what it would do to linux is illegal. Microsoft already got tagged for this kind of practice.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:17pm

Re: Re:
Ahh, so you are saying that companies don't have the right to choose their business partners. Got it!
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:17pm

Re:
Nah, they will try to go all 1984 on us, but it's not gunna work. Common get real people have already tasted freedom, they aren't going to eat anything else.
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Simon, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:18pm

Re:
Just like BluRay encryption and HDCP is secure...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:20pm

Re:
Hint: The future is coming, and it won't be wide open. Deal with it.

Heh. Heheh. No, sorry. Hint: The present is here, and it's already wide open. Accept it.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:20pm

Re:
"Deal with it."

People will deal with it by breaking it. Those who cannot participate in this will do their part by complaining loudly.

Don't like people complaining? Deal with it. That part isn't going away either.
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:21pm

Re: Re: Re:
I think that really is pretty much the root of the anti-trust laws actually. At least not the unrestricted right.
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skyrider, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:22pm

a pile of crap, by any other name, still stinks
Fritz chip anyone?

took them ten years, but they finally got their wish, and they didn't even have to ... donate any more money to congressional campaigns.
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Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:24pm

Here's the crux of their ridiculous position, FTA:

"DRM is a piece of software, not hardware."

That's a rather obscure way to look at it (or, well, a rather self-serving way to look at it) and they are nutty if they think anyone will accept it. That article can be summarized as saying "It's not DRM, it just does all the exact same things as DRM."

Shit by any other name...
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The Invisible Hand (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:26pm

Re: Re:
The punchline? HDCP was also developed by Intel.
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The Invisible Hand (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:35pm

Intel is digging itself a hole. They aren't the only ones that make CPUs and the competition is not sticking restrictive measures into their CPUs. In fact, AMD has been releasing open-source drivers for their CPUs and GPUs recently, so, contrarily to Intel, they are expanding their market and making the community happy.

Intel is going all-or-nothing on the super-performance and overclocking crowd (read: kids with rich parents or console-spawns), and expect to coax these into spreading their DRM.

I myself will keep buying AMD. At least they know how to do floating point math and don't put remote kill switches on their CPUs.
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Yogi, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:36pm

Careful!
I'd be very careful buying a computer with an Intel chip inside it.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:40pm

Time to quit Intel or quit Hollywood, take your pick.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:41pm

Re: Re:
BUT COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT!!!
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:42pm

That is not even the best part the best part is the security feature that apparently enables someone at a distance to disable the chip, they say it is for when it is stolen but one has to wonder if there is no backdoor there to make possible for them or the authorities to do it too.
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Jason, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:43pm

Re: Best line from Intel Blog
"Get out now! The popcorn is popping from INSIDE THE HOUSE!!"
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:45pm

Re:
I think the crux of their position in reality probably comes down to:
"It's just a feature available to programers to use how they will, for DRM purposes or not"
Without any info, I'd say it's likely probably just some sort of encryption or compression handling technology. What makes it DRM I'm guessing will come when they give some sort of key or special control over the technology to *IAA and not to the owner of the chip.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:46pm

Re:
I will laugh a lot when pirates use the same technology to lock law enforcement out of their networks LoL
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:48pm

Re: Re: Re:
Actually no, it would go against the law to do so.
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Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:48pm

Re: Re:
Intel Insider is a service that enables consumers to enjoy premium Hollywood feature films streamed to their PC in high quality 1080P high definition. Currently this service does not exist because the movie studios are concerned about protecting their content, and making sure that it cannot be stolen or used illegally. So Intel created Intel insider, an extra layer of content protection.

Nothing about that sounds neutral or programmer-friendly to me. They know exactly what this is for and how it will be used - and they announce it right off the bat. They clearly already have plans to use this for DRM straight out of the gate.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:52pm

If they say it's not DRM and then explain how it is DRM, they think people will think it's not DRM?

Piracy is theft. Sounds familiar ?
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Greevar (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:52pm

Re: Haha
I was just thinking about that. Homebrew system builders are going to drop Intel like a hot potato when this new DRM comes out.
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Greevar (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:55pm

If it walks like a duck...
quacks like a duck, it DRM.
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JMT, 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:55pm

Just like the US government did with the term "Global War On Terror", Intel realised the term "DRM" had developed a huge negative association, so they've dumped it and come up with a different term to describe the same unsuccessful practices.
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Greevar (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:56pm

Re:
I've been a happy AMD customer for years. Black Edition rocks!
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Christopher (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:56pm

Re: Re: Haha
No, they won't. The fact is that I have NEVER had a situation where DRM such as this interfered with my doing anything on my computer, even 'illegal' stuff like ripping DVD's and Blu-Ray's.

You also forget that this DRM will ONLY BE USED IF THE APPLICATIONS IN QUESTION ASK FOR IT TO BE USED!
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Greevar (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 1:57pm

Re: Careful!
You can buy it, but only to kill it with FIRE!
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Christopher (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:01pm

Re:
Actually, it's probably an added layer of protection (probably easily broken) that will only be used if applications call for it to be used, as with the stuff that Microsoft included in Windows Vista and 7, which caused no problems to most if not all people.
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:10pm

Re: Re: Re:
It definately sounds like the intent is to make DRM stronger, but that doesn't make it DRM by itself we really don't have any info about it. They kindof make it sound like it is some sort of encryption to protect HD video in transit

It doesn't really matter if it's friendly, it has to be controlled somehow. For me, the question comes down to who has the keys, the customer, everyone, intel, *IAA?
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The Invisible Hand (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:11pm

Re:
Piracy involves raiding towns, boarding ships, drinking grog, singing pirate-y songs, saying "ARRR!" a lot, insult sword-fighting (among other insult sports), burying (and finding) treasure and going on seemingly pointless errands that, ultimately, will allow you to find and not so pointless object that will aid you in completing you main quest.

These activities may or may not involve theft. So just slapping the "thief" tag on pirates not only shows your ignorance, it also perpetuates the notion that pirate are mere petty crooks and overlooks their diverse array of activities and their positive impact on society (like eliminating evil pirate ghosts, for example).
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Haywood (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:12pm

Re: Re: Haha
My last several builds have been AMD and I couldn't be more pleased. I'm up to a 6 core, and while it may not be quite as fast as the fastest Intel, but it easily does everything I ask, at a lot better price, without trying to take over the world.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:19pm

Re: Kowtowing
"What do they possibly have to gain by helping those groups?"

Relevancy. With their continued loss of the mobile and low-power industry (like set top boxes) and now the announcement that Windows is going to run on non-Intel hardware, they need new and inventive way to keep people buying their chips. If they have a tech that the MAFIAA buys in to, they can then license that tech to other chip makers to take a cut of their profits, or keep it all to themselves and ensure people keep buying their chips.

They have no real alliance with them, they just need to keep them buying in.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:29pm

regardless of it DRM or not

why would i A. buy a shitty Intel chip and B. change my MB and RAM, just so i can pay industry to watch movies i can download for free.

This is begging to be DOA, to bad industry has a good life support system it can put things on, including itself.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:34pm

Re:
"Copy Protection" isn't a new term, and it doesn't really have any less of a negative association...
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James, 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:39pm

Its not DRM...
it just makes your content "less" useful :P
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Anonymous, 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:40pm

I don't see any issues here as long as you don't want to steal stuff without paying for it. We can now watch new movies directly on pc instead of theater. The Studios and Intel want to make sure its protected, whats wrong with it.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:41pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Let them tbh, intel tried with processor serial numbers before and the whole market rejected them, they almost lost the sales of a whole processor series before motherboard vendors figured out how to disable the serial from being reported to the operating system.
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el_segfaulto (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:47pm

Re: Re: Haha
I've always found Intel to be a bit overpriced compared to AMD. Granted I'm not a gamer and most of the graphics work I do gets handed off to a high-end GPU. I couldn't be happier with AMD. My laptop (non-custom build), server, workstation, and media center are all custom builds and all run with an AMD chip.
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The Mighty Buzzard (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:51pm

Re: Re: Kowtowing
Now now... HDMI is also a smaller and less clunky cable too.
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BigKeithO (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:52pm

Re: Re: Kowtowing
HDMI is just the classic DVI with audio and HDCP on top.

There, I fixed it for you. :D
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The Mighty Buzzard (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:57pm

Re: Haha
AMD currently has the best price to performance ratio anyway. Unless you absolutely have to have the fastest processor on the market, AMD will give you significantly better performance vs an Intel chip of the same price.
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BigKeithO (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 2:58pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
I understand it as sort of another HDCP scheme. Just like how HDCP will not allow the video signal to travel from a secured video card to an unsecured monitor, Intel Insider will not allow the CPU to send data down an unsecured bus.

It is all really quite vague right now though.
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The Invisible Hand (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:01pm

Re:
Your software is only as good as your hardware is. If your hardware comes crippled from the factory, no amount of software is going to compensate.

But if you want to have your hardware decide when it is going to die on you (read: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_bridge#Other_Details second paragraph), by all means, go ahead and buy that piece of crap.
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BigKeithO (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:03pm

Re:
It's not like these chips won't play any old xvid or divx file from bittorrent. Nothing is protected except for the stream authorized by the studios. You make it sound like you can't get any movie online right now, what are you trying to say?

People who want to "steal stuff without paying for it" will continue to be able to do so. All that will happen is some soccer moms somewhere won't be able to figure out why the movie they just bought won't work properly. Want to know what version of the movie will work properly? The one from bittorrent.
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Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:20pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
It doesn't just "sound" like that's the intent - they clearly state that's the intent! The very first thing they say is that it will enable streaming movies - that the studios are worried about rights management, and "so" they created this chip.

You can argue the technicalities of whether the processor feature, in itself, qualifies as DRM - but given that they have explicitly said that its purpose is to enable "content protection" for film studios, I think it's pretty fair to call it DRM technology.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:23pm

Re: Re: Kowtowing
To seems more like testing the waters, they are also launching a series without that.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:27pm

Hmmm...there is so concern about those processors, the "feature" that can disable your processor remotely is just scary. It is being trumpeted as anti-theft device, but I wonder if law enforcement doesn't have a backdoor there somewhere and how long until copytards start to ask for Intel to put scanners directly into the silicon and disable "criminals" LoL
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:28pm

Re:
I so no issues with the technology but as Mike pointed out, the claim that it is not a DRM is just plain silly because it is one.

It is just one of those silly features that will never get used because it will be cumbersome LoL
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:38pm

Re: Re:
Sure caused me problems until I figured out how to disable it. That stuff is terrible, does anyone actually try to run with it on?
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:38pm

Re: Re:
"entirely developed in Intel's research center located at Haifa, Israel."

"include the ability to remotely disable a PC or erase information from hard drives. ... commands can be received through 3G signals, ethernet, or internet connections"

Cyberwar aluminium foil hats at the ready then.
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Richard (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:40pm

Re:
Hint: The future is coming, and it won't be wide open. Deal with it.

Now who should one listen to on this issue, you or widely respected security expert Professor Ed Felten of Princeton?

Writing in his review of predictions for 2009:

"DRM technology will still fail to prevent widespread infringement. In a related development, pigs will still fail to fly.

By tradition this is our first prediction, and it has always been accurate. Guess what our first 2010 prediction will be? Verdict: right."
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:43pm

The idiocy of an entire industry is just amazing.

When barriers to the products have broken down and you no longer control the distribution channel what do you do?

If you are an idiot you try to put an artificial barrier that will be ignored by the masses and will devalue your product because it is clunkier than the competition.

Right this will work wonders. That and the "Ultraviolet" thing will fail miserably in the near future, but don't just believe me, watch and see it happen before your eyes.

They then will try to make it work through legislation, when the people already proved they don't care and will happily ignore it.

Not to mention the drive that this puts on the creation of legal free alternatives that could become mainstream in the next decade, then it will be game over for them.
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Bull Puckey, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:48pm

it passes the duck test
"If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck." - James Whitcomb Riley
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crade (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:54pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Meh, they could be reinventing PGP for all the info they have given us. I wouldn't call it DRM just because the reason they are working on it is to strengthen DRM, all that means is that one of the uses for it (if they succede in their intentions) will be to strengthen DRM.
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The Invisible Hand (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:54pm

Re: Re: Re:
I actually meant the third paragraph of that link:

"In addition, Sandy Bridge processors will implement security features that include the ability to remotely disable a PC or erase information from hard drives. This can be useful in the case of a lost or stolen PC. The commands can be received through 3G signals, ethernet, or internet connections."

and, WTF is that about your first quote? It could have been developed in Mars for all I care. What I don't like is the fact that anyone besides me can erase my data and neutralize my CPU remotely. If you are ok with this, then please, apply a brick to your forehead until you regain your senses.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:57pm

"Intel Claims DRM'd Chip Is Not DRM, It's Just Copy Protection

Tobacco companies claiming cigarettes don't kill people, they're just unhealthy.

Obama claiming that going after embarrassing leaks and resisting most FOIA requests doesn't contradict his promises for transparency, it just ensures national security.

They're all lies and we know it.
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ladyserenakitty (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 3:59pm

Think of Open Source
If there's DRM embedded within the processor to appease the movie industry, then what's to stop a PC manufacturer like HP to use that DRM to prevent other non-Windows operating systems from running on that hardware? Additionally, when coupled with Intel's remote shut-off capability, what's to stop said manufacturer from remotely disabling the processor when they find out you're running Linux, BSD, or Solaris on a machine they built?
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 4:20pm

Re: Re:
Get under your rock and go ask what people think about "copy protection" anywhere.

If you come back and say they are ok with it with a straight face you may deserve and Oscar.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 4:25pm

Re: Think of Open Source
I think that should also concern national security for other countries, what country will let their IT run on hardware that another country controls and can shut them down?

Time to buy from AMD or the lesser evil(compared to Intel apparent intentions) the Chinese, although I hear Koreans have a x86 microprocessor too.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 4:29pm

Imagine Senator Lieberman calling Intel to ask them to disable all computers in the list he gave them because they are upholding the freedom of speech.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 4:43pm

Thinking about it, this is the most stupid idea ever.
This DRM stuff and remote disabling of hardware could lead to severe decline of sales in that particular sector for Intel.

If I was a government I would not buy Intel ever because of the risks involved.

If I was a company I wouldn't buy that either, since with the easy for misguided actions, errors in procedure or any other reason could lead to total loss of data.

As a user that scares me and I'm going to stay away from Intel because I don't want them controlling what I do with my computer.
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BBT, 7 Jan 2011 @ 7:23pm

This is actually good news- it shows how much of a dirty word "DRM" has become in society.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Jan 2011 @ 7:30pm

Intel: "We have always been at war with AMD"
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techflaws.org (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 10:22pm

Re: Re: Re:
So you say customers don't have the right to not buy DRM crap?
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techflaws.org (profile), 7 Jan 2011 @ 10:27pm

Re:
Now, we could watch movies directly on the PC for ages. Not authorized by the industry though so they didn't see a dime for it.
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Anonymous Coward, 8 Jan 2011 @ 1:53am

DRM = DIGITAL RENTAL MEDIA

So with this chip it turns your entire computer into a warehouse of RENTAL MEDIA.

Guess I will NOT be upgrading to these new chips
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Mario, 8 Jan 2011 @ 3:39am

Re: Re: Re: Kowtowing
"HDMI is just the classic DVI with audio and HDCP on top.

There, I fixed it for you. :D"

Yes, you're right:). I knew that but I didn't considered it would make a difference to my point. More likely, it would have made an unknowing reader think "Ooooh, but it adds audio as well, that really cool!", which would be completely missing the point. The point I was trying to get across was that HDMI is just Intel taking an open technology (the DVI standard interface) and locking it down with HDCP.
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hmm, 8 Jan 2011 @ 4:53am

hold on a second...
So this ISN'T a form of Digital Rights Management eh?

Cool bananas! this means cracking it isn't protected by the DCMA!!!!!

Time for Intel to do 1 of 2 things:

1. Admit this IS DRM and seek DCMA protection (embarassing)
2. Give up the ghost on the whole idea.....
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Anonymous Coward, 8 Jan 2011 @ 8:06am

Boehner is pronounced Boner not Bayner no matter how you sugar coat it. No matter how much the media says it it is what it is.
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abc gum, 8 Jan 2011 @ 8:39am

What if I do not want

"a service that enables consumers to enjoy premium Hollywood feature films streamed to their PC in high quality 1080P high definition."

... I guess in that case I should purchase an AMD cpu/mobo
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Androgynous Cowherd, 8 Jan 2011 @ 9:49am

1080p HD on a PC
Intel Insider is a service that enables consumers to enjoy premium Hollywood feature films streamed to their PC in high quality 1080P high definition.

That's funny. I've recently watched a Hollywood feature film on my PC in 1080p HD, and I did it without any help from "Intel Insider". (eMule, on the other hand ...)

I have over 3TB of disk storage here, broadband, and a will to use it. I'm pretty sure I'm not alone.

The morons at the film cartel better wise up or step down soon or they'll run their whole oligopoly nose-first into the Pacific and we'll have another big economic crisis on our hands. "Intel Insider" won't save them. (Watching that copy, which probably came from a screener Bluray or a cracked HDMI device, would not be affected by it.) COICA won't save them. (eMule does not depend on any particular web sites staying up and is quite comfortable using raw IP addresses.) Only business model innovation can save them.
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abc gum, 8 Jan 2011 @ 12:26pm

Re: 1080p HD on a PC
I'm beginning to think that piracy is simply a distraction and from the actual goal and is an excuse for their feabile attempts to control every aspect of everyones life.
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ladyserenakitty (profile), 8 Jan 2011 @ 1:17pm

Re: Re: 1080p HD on a PC
My mom said something similar.
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Anonymous Coward, 8 Jan 2011 @ 3:59pm

Intel Inside
Clearly an "Intel inside" sticker is a warning label!
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Cynyr (profile), 8 Jan 2011 @ 7:48pm

Re: Re: Re: Kowtowing
I'm considering switching to HDMI cables for my DVI monitors for just that reason, my DVI cable is as fat as my thumb.
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Androgynous Cowherd, 9 Jan 2011 @ 12:01am

Re: Intel Inside
http://www.ecis.com/~alizard/images/bigbro.gif
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zygmunt, 9 Jan 2011 @ 8:05am

DRM
The sooner DRM arrives the better. It'll keep a lot of rubbish at bay. We are best off without the rubbish, Audio (noise), Video (snow) and Media (press).
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TPBer, 9 Jan 2011 @ 9:39am

Re:
If that's the case then breaking the hardware, that is yours and not bound to a EULA, is not circumvention :)
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ladyserenakitty (profile), 9 Jan 2011 @ 9:43am

Re: DRM
zygmunt, DRM within the processor is inherently a bad thing. I don't like the idea of having to circumvent DRM just so I can do the odd things I usually do with a computer.
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Shirkie01, 9 Jan 2011 @ 10:34am

DRM isn't the full issue here
I might not have the entire aspect down, but from what I understand:

When Intel says this is not DRM, they probably are using EA's and Ubisoft's definition of DRM. If you want to look it up, you'll see that these have been patched, due to the DRM increasing the amount of pirating, since people didn't want the DRM to control their computers. Intel Insider, though, is a hardware aspect to do the same thing, so technically not DRM, but still serves the same function.
So, what are the difficulties and costs associated with a hardware recall and a revamp of your production line in addition to scrapping processors that are on shelves compared to issuing a software patch, anyone?

If programmers can use this for DRM or not, according to their will, what's to stop viruses from using this "feature" to kill your processor or erase all your data? If the law authorities are the only ones who can access it, they're going to have pretty big headaches fixing it when the average Joe buys a pre-assembled computer and gets a virus of that type.

Additionally, I don't see any protection against someone purchasing this as a second computer solely for the video streams, then simply recording them and uploading them to file-sharing programs. It wouldn't be streaming, but you would still have the quality given the right recording program.

When this shit hits the fan, Intel deserves to be kicked down a couple notches, hopefully making chips at comparable prices to AMD, instead of a difference of ~$800 for the top models.
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rec9140, 9 Jan 2011 @ 1:36pm

Re: Re: Haha
I've not used intel for my personal machines, all 100% personally built, nor for any clients custom built machines, or any even when purchasing items from OEM's like Dell for well over 20 years.. Since the AMD line came out I've been firmly an AMD user, and never will go back.

AMD - CPU
nVidia - graphics

no thanks on intel or ati graphics (and yes I know who owns them, and I still WONT USE THEM!!)

This just solidifies my stance against intel... now if AMD would just release a dual core atom like processor I would be good to go!

With this DRM, and YES THIS IS DRM! Lack of Linux drivers for features which require practically bleeding edge if not development versions of libs etc.. FAIL, EPIC FAIL.
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Christopher (profile), 9 Jan 2011 @ 11:10pm

Re: Re: Re:
Yeah, I'm calling bullshit. I do things that are not strictly 'legal' on my machine, and I have NEVER had the DRM in Windows 7 bother me one little WHIT!

I have had DRM on some games that I have downloaded or bought bother me, but that isn't Windows 7 nor is it the in-built DRM of that OS bothering me.
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Christopher (profile), 9 Jan 2011 @ 11:13pm

Re: Re: DRM
Who says that you will have to circumvent the DRM? The fact is that this DRM will ONLY BE USED IF THE APPLICATIONS ASK FOR IT TO BE USED!

If you are using a program that DOESN'T call for the DRM to be used, you are golden. Windows 7 does N O T automatically call for all the DRM stuff in it to be used, it waits for individual applications to ask for it to use it.

I would assume this would ALSO be true with this processor-based DRM.
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Christopher (profile), 9 Jan 2011 @ 11:17pm

Re: Re: 1080p HD on a PC
That is part of it, to be honest. However, with all due respect, I really have NEVER had these DRM protections ever bother me on my computer, and that is WITHOUT trying to actively disable them.

These 'protections' will only be used if applications ask for them to be used, so if the applications don't ask for them to be used? You won't even notice them, it will be like they are not even there.
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Eldakka (profile), 9 Jan 2011 @ 11:44pm

Re: Re: Re: Kowtowing
Not quite right either.

HDCP is not a part of, or a requisite for HDMI.

HDMI is the physical connector and digital signalling standards for transmitting audio and video over a cable.

The digital signalling of video is an enhancement of DVI, as it allows for greater bandwidth.

HDCP is a device level layer (nothing to do with the cable) that adds encryption/authorization.

You can have HDCP over DVI, you can have HDCP over HDMI, hell you can probably have HDCP over ethernet.

You can have DVI and HDMI without HDCP.
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Killer_Tofu (profile), 10 Jan 2011 @ 7:15am

Re: Re: Kowtowing
Ah, I did not recollect that Intel had such a large role in the HDCP development. Thank you for the refresher.
I still am unclear why they even got into that to begin with, short of Lobo Santo's explanation above.

Sorry about the late reply. I usually avoid the internet on the weekends and didn't get back on TD on Friday there.

One would think that even with HDCP being broken and cracked and worked around so much, Intel would have perhaps learned some sort of lesson about how DRM does not work.
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Killer_Tofu (profile), 10 Jan 2011 @ 7:24am

Re: Re: Re: DRM
You can say that all you want, but the history of DRM shows that most will mess with you even when you don't want them to. The largest culprits of this are those put in place by the MAFIAA, just as this is .. on a CPU. Horribly idea.
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Killer_Tofu (profile), 10 Jan 2011 @ 7:27am

Waste of Money
All the time the spend researching and developing this DRM junk like HDCP and this probably help contribute to their inflated pricing.
Maybe if they stopped they could lower prices and compete with AMD for power per price point. ALways been an AMD loyal and this is only more reason for me to be.
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Jan 2011 @ 7:53am

Re: Haha
Ah, but by using AMD you won't be able to play the movies that are exclusively available to those lucky consumers with Intel chips and their non-DRM DRM. This is also a reply to the first poster, who wonders why Intel would bother. It's for the exclusivity, of course. Intel is thinking down the road, to a utopic day when *they* control the chips that can decode the movies. And, conversely, nobidy else does. Call me paranoid, but...
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ltlw0lf (profile), 10 Jan 2011 @ 7:53am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Yeah, I'm calling bullshit.

I have to as well. Vista had bugs in it related to DRM, such as when I'd place a pre-written CD-R in the drive and it would tell me that the disc wasn't formatted and would overwrite the CD-R, but I haven't had Windows 7 do anything like that to me. The only thing that I've experienced with Windows 7 has existed since WindowsXP (file transfers via SMB are abnormally slow,) but I am not sure this is related to the DRM issue that has been published and not just bad network coding. (FTP takes about 30 seconds to transfer a file which takes 8 minutes to transfer using SMB.)
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ltlw0lf (profile), 10 Jan 2011 @ 7:55am

Re:
Sounds like DRM to me.

What does Direct Rendering Manager (DRM) have to do with this discussion?

I'm taking back the acronym!
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