Mexican Senate Calls On President To Reject ACTA

Homeland Security Finally Admits To Latest Domain Seizures; Arrests Guy For Selling Unauthorized 'Sons Of Anarchy' T-Shirts

from the feeling-safer? dept

Thu, Jul 28th 2011 7:02pm — Mike Masnick

A few weeks back, we wrote about a bunch of new domain seizures by Homeland Security's ICE division, and wondered why ICE hadn't said anything publicly about them. Well, it's finally put out an announcement about these domain seizures, including the fact that it had the operator of one site arrested for selling counterfeit Sons of Anarchy apparel. That guy, Ryan Breen, now faces 10 years in jail and fines up to $2 million. It seems there's a fair bit of irony in the fact that DHS/ICE is so thrilled about busting a guy selling apparel for a TV show that plays up an outlaw motorcycle gang known for its illegal weapons trafficking. Let's celebrate the gun runners... and punish the guy who made some t-shirts with 10 years in jail, huh? I have to admit that I'd much rather see Homeland Security and ICE actually focus on protecting the country, rather than some guy in upstate NY selling some t-shirts to fans of a TV show. And, of course, once again, it appears that most of the domains seized were taken without any notice, without any opportunity for the domain holders to respond. ICE has made it abundantly clear that they don't care about due process or the First Amendment in seizing domains, and frankly I find that a lot more troubling than some guy selling t-shirts online.

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Filed Under: counterfeiting, domain seizures, homeland security, ice, trademark

104 Comments

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Marcus Carab (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 6:23pm

This just in: the DHS has bombed Canal Street.
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Jay (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 6:59pm

Re:
TSA has been sent in to grope around for survivors.
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TDR, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:16pm

The new national anthem of the US: The Imperial March.
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Ima Fish (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:17pm

And I for one welcome our trademark protecting overlords.
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ken (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:18pm

We are becoming an extremely repressive society. Homeland Security was originally designed to fight terrorists but apparently has too much time on their hands so they have become the secret police of the copy-privilege industry.
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TDR, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:18pm

Question is, if the US is the Empire, which senator would be Palpatine?
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Jay (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:31pm

Re:
There is no question about it. As the second senior member of the Senate, a strong proponent of the Patriot Act, a man that has his hand so dirty from the money of AT&T, Comcast, DHS and lawyers in general...

A man that has proposed COICA along with Protect IP "for the good of American ingenuity"...

A man that has said that infringement is theft without any worry of either one...

A person promoting Grateful Dead as his favorite band, but seems to be woefully against the EFF (where the president was a member of the band!)...

There's someone that is as evil as Palpatine. His name starts with the same letter.

Patrick Leahy.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:42pm

Bets on when they start going after political sites
How many of you remember the details surrounding Online Policy Group v Diebold ?

Any bets on when ICE takes down their first political site?

I don't think they'll go that far for at least a year. It'll take 'em awhile to get the public and the judges used to the seizures. Then, after there's no more controversy, the goons will start pushing the boundaries.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:48pm

From The ICE bulletin:

"It is estimated that intellectual property theft costs American industry billions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of jobs every year."

Anybody can make an estimate. Doesn't mean shit.
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Liz, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:49pm

Re:
Sorry, that anthem has been copyrighted by Lucasarts.
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Eileen (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:49pm

Re: Re:
That made me ACTUALLY lol. Rare these days, thanks.
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Jesse (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:52pm

Security? pffft
I have to admit that I'd much rather see Homeland Security and ICE actually focus on protecting the country, rather than some guy in upstate NY selling some t-shirts to fans of a TV show.

...and yet:

In 2009, the US Department of Homeland Security released an important report on the threat of right-wing extremism. The report would later be "withdrawn by the department after criticism from conservatives" and, according to the author of the report, who not surprisingly no longer works at DHS, "the number of analysts assigned to non-Islamic militancy of all kinds was reduced to two from six."
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/07/2011726861255428.html

How many people do you think they have on non-violent offences like copyright and trademark infringement?
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:52pm

If they're really sons of anarchy, they shouldn't be arrested by the police because the real "Sons of Anarchy" are against police anyways.
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MrWilson, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:55pm

Re:
It is estimated that ICE domain seizures further erode faith in the American justice system, if there is any left amongst the citizenry.
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out_of_the_blue, 28 Jul 2011 @ 7:59pm

It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
That's the unidirectional sum of reports on Techdirt. The copyright maximalists ARE winning, and it's high time to be admitted here. You may think that selling T-shirts is innocent, but when in jail and looking at 10 years, or 35 years for "liberating" information, you'll wish that you'd backed off. The thugs are happy to be thugs and don't at all take notice that you have ANY rights.

Standard disclaimer: NO, I'm not FOR draconian sentences.

But when enforcement -- not necessarily the law -- is so increasingly draconian, nattering about the fine points of what copyright was in last century's civil society is useless. You now live in a police state where there are no laws, only power.

It's time to start focusing on those who drive the increase of police state because benefit from it: The Rich. And another standard disclaimer: you are not among The Rich, won't at all be harmed by taxing the hell out of them, in fact your life will be improved. Limiting the money that tyrants get is the only way societies ever gain or maintain freedom.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:01pm

Goodbye USA
$15 trillion in debt and growing.
The space program is dead.
Corporations are running the government.
Housing bubble
High unemployment
Further transfer of manufacturing jobs overseas
Primary growth sector is copyright litigation.
the government breaking its own laws, spying on its own citizens.
Goodbye USA. You had a good run of it, but the party's over.
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Jay (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:12pm

A question
I am beginning to wonder. How much do these domain seizures cost the US taxpayer? They seem to be awfully against us, the citizens and woefully ineffective. How much has their spending increased for the war on the populace?
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:19pm

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
It's time to start focusing...

�By the time you wake up and realize you're living in a totalitarian state, it's already too late.�

��attributed to Hannah Arendt, but probably somewhat misquoted
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fb39ca4, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:21pm

Re: Re:
u suck. i was going to say exactly that.
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Zot-Sindi, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:33pm

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
The copyright maximalists ARE winning, and it's high time to be admitted here.

at what? making theirselves looks like a bunch of manically stubborn, culture-hoarding control-freak money fetishists hitching an ego-trip on the Hindenburg to self-destruction?

you're absolutely right! i don't think there is a single soul on this earth who would disagree you're utterly destroying us in that department, it must take hard work to get that completely severed from reality
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Zot-Sindi, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:38pm

Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
...and, that's all i could understand from that post, i admire OOTB's ability to change points/stances across their various posts like some sort of virtual chameleon, or maybe the part where they have like 20 different (often conflicting) points and stances going on in one big primordial soup of the internets
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Zot-Sindi, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:41pm

Re: Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
so, yeah, if anyone knows how to speak scrambled could they translate that for me?
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Zot-Sindi, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:42pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
...it that even the same OOTB? something's fishy here
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dev, 28 Jul 2011 @ 8:47pm

great show
where can i buy one of his t-shirts now?
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Jacob Cooper (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 9:24pm

Besides my HUGE problem with "Homeland Security" enforcing what are basically civil matters, I don't understand why these companies don't just work a deal with the "pirates" and create an authorized product.

Did they contact the t-shirt seller? I'd bet that they just need to contact the seller and offer a contract in which they share the profits, you know... licensing. Unless the seller is unreasonable, the whole deal could be done in less than a week.
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circuitSnap (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 9:48pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
I speak a tiny-little scramble.

...... I believe in just laws stop
...... Lawmakers are now purchased stop
...... Mass media is owned stop
...... Frenzies are fabricated to establish new law stop
...... Money stop
...... The rich are winning stop
...... The fight never happened stop

or something like that I think.

ess-ka-pay - escape
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 9:50pm

If we don't protect Anarchy, the nation will descend into anarchy!
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Karl (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 10:11pm

Re:
which senator would be Palpatine?

He's not a senator anymore, but my vote would be for Joe Biden.

This is a man with possibly the worst record of privacy abuses of any Senator, and certainly the worst record regarding tech issues. His advocacy of wiretapping was so great, that legislation he authored spurred Phil Zimmerman to create PGP, and led to the creation of the CDT. Details here:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10024163-38.html

(It should be noted that Zimmerman is a democrat... as am I, for non-tech issues.)
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techflaws.org (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 10:26pm

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
The copyright maximalists ARE winning,

Again your obvious reading comprehension troubles. The copyright maximalists are getting laws changed in their favor, however they are not making people buy their products nor stopping piracy. Try to keep up.
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Atkray (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 10:31pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
I had the same thought, the first line seemed right but the rest...not so much.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:00pm

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
The only way to have Liberty is to gut the purse of government.
The rich will always have their freedom and liberty, they can buy it.
True tyrants can only be limited by the nose.
Taxing the rich only empowers the tyranny of government.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:15pm

Re:
Homeland Security was originally designed to fight terrorists...

You really believed that? Really?
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The eejit (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:20pm

Re: Re:
Fine, I'll use the Public domain bversion. NO ROYALTIES FOR YOU!
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Michael Lockyear, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:25pm

Breaking news: An American politician has called for your arrest (or worse) on the grounds of disseminating information considered vital to national security...
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:30pm

eBay
All sorts of "unauthorized" items have been sold through eBay. So, why hasn't DHS seized *their* domain without any notice or opportunity for them to respond? Could it be that the laws obviously don't apply the same to everyone? Such selective enforcement means that DHS has no moral authority, leaving fear as the only reason to obey them.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:30pm

Re:
Obama
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Chris Rhodes (profile), 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:30pm

Re:
The answer is clear: Joe Lieberman
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:35pm

Re: Re:
Patrick Leahy is a Democrat. I could believe your lies if they were about Republicans. I believe all the lies about Republicans. But putting any blame for anything on a Democrat is just wrong. We, the people of the left, just want everyone to be equal. This is why President Obama cancelled the Mars program. He said it was so the rest of the world can catch up with us technically. We all need to work towards this equality. And it doesn't even matter if Democrats do anything wrong, it's better than letting some stupid tea party have their way. I don't even know how they are allowed to gather together! We need to stifle them. A good way is to call them racist. LOL, then they spend all their time defending themselves and no matter what they say they really look bad.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:35pm

Re: Re:
Patrick Leahy is a Democrat. I could believe your lies if they were about Republicans. I believe all the lies about Republicans. But putting any blame for anything on a Democrat is just wrong. We, the people of the left, just want everyone to be equal. This is why President Obama cancelled the Mars program. He said it was so the rest of the world can catch up with us technically. We all need to work towards this equality. And it doesn't even matter if Democrats do anything wrong, it's better than letting some stupid tea party have their way. I don't even know how they are allowed to gather together! We need to stifle them. A good way is to call them racist. LOL, then they spend all their time defending themselves and no matter what they say they really look bad.
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:37pm

Re: Goodbye USA
And it's mostly due to corruption of the majority of the people. They deserve no pity.
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Athomahawk, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:38pm

Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
Its Autocratic not Totalitarian. Yet.
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Dwayne, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:42pm

Obviously selling counterfeit Sons of Anarchy t-shirts is a security risk to the United States. If we don't lock these animals away pronto, their copyright infringing message might start to spread and then the US will be in a state of anarchy.
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-, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:45pm

it appears that most of the domains seized were taken without any notice, without any opportunity for the domain holders to respond

Most? Does it mean that some had a chance to defend? That would be a news to me.
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Nicedoggy, 28 Jul 2011 @ 11:56pm

Re: Re: Re:
British Royal Band - Imperial March

The British have seized that too.
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G Thompson (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:09am

Re:
Good News Ima,

You have infringed on Futurama's proprietary trademark statement.

Please stay tuned to this channel for a message from HypnoToad
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G Thompson (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:11am

Re:
What part of the statement by DHS that equates Piracy to Terrorism didn't you understand?

:P
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Ed C., 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:14am

Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
Who do you think is driving the government to tyranny? It may surprise you, but the rich were the tyrants long before modern government. They were overthrown by the will of the people, who then created new governments. It only took awhile for the rich to regain control again. So no, gutting the government will do nothing to stop the rich from being tyrants.
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Hephaestus (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Nicedoggy, for being mean to the brits ... no cookie for you ;)
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Hephaestus (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:46am

Re: Re:
Karl ... what in the hell are you talking about? Palpatine is Obama. "For six months these guys at the DOJ will not work on entertainment related issues.", "Transparency", "Open government", "saving the future of this nation", "A bright outlook", telling the ISP's to do the six strike thing, need I go on? I get this "TRUE EVIL", corrupt to the core, vibe off him.
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Hephaestus (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:53am

Re: Re: Goodbye USA
And it's mostly due to corruption of the MINORITY of the people. They deserve no pity.

FTFY
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 1:05am

I've been hearing from some friends overseas that 40 or so warez websites are off line. I'm assuming ICE has or had something to do with it. So far I haven't really been checking to see what sites or verification that some sites are now down. Might be something Mike would want to check on or see if he comes up with some new activities ICE hasn't gotten around to claiming.
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The eejit (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 1:48am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
So it's mine anyway.

Dom dom dom dom domdom dom domdom. Dom dom dom dom domdom dom domdom.
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Mike Masnick (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 1:50am

Re:
I've been hearing from some friends overseas that 40 or so warez websites are off line. I'm assuming ICE has or had something to do with it. So far I haven't really been checking to see what sites or verification that some sites are now down. Might be something Mike would want to check on or see if he comes up with some new activities ICE

At the very least it does not appear that ICE has seized any new URLs since last week. Any time it does, it changes the domain to point to seizedservers.com and you can check any changes here:

http://www.dailychanges.com/seizedservers.com/

So you can tell whenever ICE seizes new domains. The last seizures were July 23rd.
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athe, 29 Jul 2011 @ 1:57am

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
The thugs are happy to be thugs and don't at all take notice that you have ANY rights.

By this, I assume you're talking abuot the Govt and big business, right?
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Prisoner 201, 29 Jul 2011 @ 2:06am

Re: Re:
All hail Hypnotoad.
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NotMyRealName (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 2:16am

I worked legit t-shirt vending at shows as a side gig a few years back. We were given instructions that went something like this, presumably they were cleared with the higher-ups.

On our sweeps of the parking lot before and during the show, if we spotted anyone else selling t-shirts or other merch we were to grab a couple of security guys and confiscate their stuff. If they didn't put up too much fuss we didn't need to bother calling the police. Then we sold their shirts at our stall if they were decent quality.

Remember this is a legit business working 10,000+ capacity shows and their policy is to steal and profit from illegal merch.

So anyway: 10yrs in jail seems a little excessive to me.
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Richard (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 2:31am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
British Royal Band - Imperial March

Was rupert Murdoch visiting the Queen?
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 3:10am

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
Wow, you do miss the point pretty much entirely.
If that's intentional, then kudos to you.

The point, is that there are no technological or legal means to put the genie back in the bottle. You can as those in favour of strong copyright do, get more and more legislation passed, spend more and more on DRM, spend more and more on court cases and achieve nothing more than chopping one head of the hydra and making the perceived problem worse.

Or you can relax about it, change business models to maximise it's benefit to you and reap the rewards.

This site is about where people are going wrong and in what ways they are going wrong in coping with the simple fact that non physical digital files are infinite in supply.

The references to the original intentions of copyright are to show some wrongheaded people what the purpose of copyright actually is rather than the benefit train that it is for only the tiniest handful of creators, a train that, to extend the metaphor, the publishers hijacked quite some time ago and they not the creators are the primary beneficiaries of.

In their tantruming about the realities of the information age, they are not only wasting a lot of time and resources (all finite) but wasting a lot of government time and resources (also finite) and our time and resources (also finite)

Everyone will be better off, when they finally grow up and take a mature view on things, but as with many a tantruming toddler, to switch metaphor again, people are going to have to keep, alternately ignoring them and occasionally putting them on the naughty step until they calm down and start behaving like big boys and girls.
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mike allen (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 3:30am

Re: Re:
Seems like the homeland security have no brain between to believe the mafiaas lies on posters.
AMERICANS and Brits wake up smell the coffee you have nothing to lose you have no freedoms left!!!!
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The eejit (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 3:38am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Only on Sundays - her real name is Rebekah Brooks.
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The eejit (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 3:39am

Re: Re: Re:
Someone's doi-ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD!
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The eejit (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 3:40am

Re:
Again: good artists copy, great artists steal.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 4:07am

What
10 years in jail for selling a T-shirt?

What is next, life sentence for crossing the street in the wrong place?
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The Devil's Coachman (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 4:17am

Re: Goodbye USA
Since the majority of the populace seems to care not a whit about anything anymore, then they deserve their fate. Our government seems to think that if they avoid some of the mistakes made by the Nazis, they can then proceed to establish a true Thousand Year Reich. We are well along on that path now. Be prepared for the mandated implantation of GPS tracking devices, so they will know where you are when they decide to arrest you on bogus charges of some kind.
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The Devil's Coachman (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 4:21am

Re: What
Yes.
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excellent compromiser, 29 Jul 2011 @ 5:03am

Response to: TDR on Jul 28th, 2011 @ 7:18pm
Harry reid..the guy who pushed the usa patriot act through again..
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abc gum, 29 Jul 2011 @ 5:06am

A longer sentence for selling t shirts than that for murder ...
I feel safer already
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DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 5:56am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Hey now, the brits' country is not built upon a fascination, ummm, no, an obsession about dick size, so why are you defending them?
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DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 5:58am

Re: Re:
> Futurama's proprietary trademark statement.

Wasn't that from The Simpsons?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 6:08am

Re: Goodbye USA
You forgot rising fuel prices while oil companies are rolling in profits.
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DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 6:33am

Re: Re: Goodbye USA
> Since the majority of the populace seems
> to care not a whit about anything anymore,
> then they deserve their fate.

I disagree.

Everyone seems to care. Everyone is loudly complaining about how things are.

People just feel powerless to do anything. They perceive, and correctly I believe, that their vote doesn't really matter.

The cleverness of our two party system is that it keeps the population approximately evenly split. The parties fight over diametrically opposite polar extremes. The Vorlons vs. the Shadows. The genius of it is that on any given issue, one party, seemingly almost chosen at random, is on the "correct" side of the issue. By "correct" I mean that on some issues it is easy to sympathize with the arguments on both sides of the issue -- but the issue merely is used by the two parties to divide the voters -- and most importantly, to keep them riled up.

Now just waiting for president Clark to dissolve congress by executive order. It will make things so much simpler.
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DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 6:37am

Re:
> . . . 40 or so . . . websites are off line.

Are the sites offline, or are their domain names merely redirected?

The sites may still be up and running perfectly if you know the IP address.

I'm not condoning piracy, merely pointing out the fact. Of course, that alone may be a criminal act, like linking.
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DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 6:43am

Re: What
> What is next, life sentence for crossing the street in the wrong place?

Laugh, all you want.

Fascists will eventually impose the death penalty. First on seemingly big things, like subversive and dangerous political ideas or writings that threaten our very national security.

Since losses to "piracy" are so gigantically huge ($74 Trillion just from one program!) capital punishment will seem appropriate. After all, the losses to the economy caused by lime wire alone could have paid off the national debt about five times over, made us all rich and living like kings.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 6:51am

Let's celebrate the gun runners... and punish the guy who made some t-shirts with 10 years in jail, huh?

They're not celebrating gun runners, Mike. They're protecting people's rights from being violated. Funny how you don't support this.

ICE has made it abundantly clear that they don't care about due process or the First Amendment in seizing domains, and frankly I find that a lot more troubling than some guy selling t-shirts online.

Sigh. Of course you support the pirates, Mike. Of course you do.
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hegemon13, 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:05am

Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
Wrong. The only way to have Liberty is to gut the power of government. As long as the government has power over every aspect of our lives, they will always have the purse. As long as they are allowed to partner with a central bank to print unlimited money out of thin air, they will have the purse.

At this point, taxation is not really worth discussing. The real power of government comes from their ability to transfer purchasing power away from the citizens to themselves through a process they call "quantitative easing." Anyone who believes "stimulus" exists to help poor people get jobs is a laughable fool. It exists to steal the purchasing power from the dollars they allow you to keep.
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Trails (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:07am

Re: Re:
Tsk, tsk. That was Simpsons.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_Space_Homer#Reception
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hegemon13, 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:14am

Re: Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
The government is the tool that the uber-wealthy elite use to exact oppression. As long as the government is powerful, money will corrupt it. The only way to restore liberty is to truly level the playing field. This means:

1. Eliminate most government departments, regulations, AND all the private corporate subsidies that go with it. Why eliminate regulations? Because when you implement everything I list below, failure is a much stronger regulator. Government regulations are mostly knee-jerk reactions to something that has already happened, and they do not address poor practices that they haven't thought of yet. They are also full of loopholes for the companies the government likes. Market regulations occur naturally, and they punish highly risky practices regardless of what form they take.
2. Allow companies to fail, regardless of their size.
3. Eliminate the Federal Reserve so that everyone has to compete for resources equally. The fact the the Fed can arbitrarily pick and choose who gets the cheap (0.25%) credit is a travesty.
4. Eliminate the CIA, Homeland Security, ATF, and all other unconstitutional government enforcement departments.
5. Amend the Constitution to close the loopholes that have allowed the massive expansion (as best we can, anyway).

Pie in the sky? Yeah, probably. But if you want liberty, this is the only way it will happen and stick around for more than a couple years.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:19am

"Sigh. Of course you support the pirates, Mike. Of course you do."

Drama Queen!
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hegemon13, 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:22am

Re: Re: Re: Goodbye USA
"The parties fight over diametrically opposite polar extremes."

Hah! No, they fight over minutia, over the inconsequential and arbitrary differences that those in power hold up as the pet issues. Little do most people know that, as they are fighting over insignificant right-left differences, both parties are racing at top speed toward a single point: the Authoritarian south pole. There is more than one axis in the political spectrum, and the recognition of the libertarian-authoritarian axis is much more important to our liberty and way of life. Unfortunately, most people are so wrapped up in the right-left squabbling that they don't even notice how authoritarian we have become. Rather than fighting over whose way of life we want the government to enforce, how about we just gut the government's power and allow people to have their freedom back?
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hegemon13, 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:27am

Re: Re: Goodbye USA
Again, should we vainly attempt to tax and regulate that away, which will only end up raising the price to consumers and further empowering a government that is in bed with big oil? Or, should we eliminate the oil subsidies, easy credit, and special priveleges given to the oil companies and force them to compete on the same terms as anyone else? Also, by eliminating the Fed, you would immediately eliminate the majority of futures traders, which is where the cost of oil is really decided. Futures trading is extremely risky, and if credit were no longer virtually free, most investors would either minimize their involvement in it or be devastated by the consequences of an overly risky portfolio.
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Jesse (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 7:43am

Re:
How do you take abusing due process and the First Amendment and say that is supporting pirates?

I suppose you think that murderers shouldn't have defence attorneys or fair trials. "If they were innocent, they wouldn't have been charged, now would they?"
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 8:17am

Re:
"Besides my HUGE problem with "Homeland Security" enforcing what are basically civil matters, I don't understand why these companies don't just work a deal with the "pirates" and create an authorized product."

You know, that is exactly what the Grateful Dead did when fans wanted to sell merchandise at shows. They made it easy for them to become authorized dealers. They didn't want to fight with there fans, they tried to work something out that was beneficial to all. Of course this won't work here, they were not greedy power hungry hypocrites.
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Jay (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 8:27am

Re: Re:
Actually, he might be changing a few stripes...

He at least knows how to hold the book rightside up
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Marcus Carab (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 8:31am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
It was actually pretty brilliant. There was a middle eastern dignitary (I forget who off the top of my head) visiting and the Royal Band objected to his presence because of his politics (really sorry I'm blanking on all the details). However they were required by centuries-old tradition to play for him.

Their solution? Play the imperial march. The visiting dignitary had no idea and just thought they were honouring him, while everyone else in England giggled.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 8:51am

Re: Re:
How is seizing the domain name of a website that sells counterfeit goods violating anyone's due process or First Amendment rights?
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Chosen Reject (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 9:06am

Re: What
Well, there was the lady who faced more jail time for jaywalking than the drunk driver that killed her son in the hit and run that happened during said jaywalking.
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DannyB (profile), 29 Jul 2011 @ 10:15am

Re: Re: Re: Goodbye USA
I do not have, nor was I suggesting a solution.

I was just pointing out one more thing people are (IMO legitimately) complaining about.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 10:26am

Re: Re: Re: Goodbye USA
And it's mostly due to corruption of the MINORITY of the people. They deserve no pity.
FTFY

No, it's the majority who keep voting the same way.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 10:46am

Re: Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
The point, is that there are no technological or legal means to put the genie back in the bottle.

They don't want to. What they want is to ratchet up copyright laws and create a whole "war" on copyright infringement that will eventually exceed the "war" on drugs and make lots of money for them. The taxpayers will even get to pay for it (when they aren't in prison).

Or you can relax about it, change business models to maximise it's benefit to you and reap the rewards.

I just described their changing "business model".
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 11:06am

Re: Re: Re: Goodbye USA
Everyone seems to care. Everyone is loudly complaining about how things are.

Unfortunately, the comments here on Techdirt don't seem to reflect the general population. For the most part, the general population is more interested in supporting the "winning team", i.e. party, than anything else. It's the "sports" mentality at work.

They perceive, and correctly I believe, that their vote doesn't really matter.

It doesn't when they act like sports fans and just vote for their "team".

The cleverness of our two party system is that it keeps the population approximately evenly split.

That's the way team sports are usually played: 2 teams. It keeps the fans from having to think about too much at once.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 11:09am

Re: Re: What
Fascists will eventually impose the death penalty. First on seemingly big things...

"We kill people who kill people because killing people is wrong."
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 11:22am

Re: Re: Re:
How is seizing the domain name of a website that sells counterfeit goods violating anyone's due process or First Amendment rights?

New "due process": Guilty until proven innocent.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:13pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
You have to think real world.

A guy is selling crack out of his car. The police stop him, they seize the drugs (horrors!) and impound the car (goodbye fourth amendment) and then take him to jail (oh no, due process is dead!).

You guys are just to frigging funny to be believed.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 12:31pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
New "due process": Guilty until proven innocent.

Probable cause was demonstrated to a judge who then issued a seizure warrant. That's due process. That's how it's worked for over two centuries. That's got nothing to do with innocent until proven guilty. If there's probable cause that you committed a crime, you get arrested. You're still presumed innocent.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 9:06pm

Re:
From The ICE bulletin:

"It is estimated that intellectual property theft costs American industry billions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of jobs every year."

Anybody can make an estimate. Doesn't mean shit. [citation needed]
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jul 2011 @ 9:22pm

Re:
"Sigh. Of course you support the pirates, Mike. Of course you do."

Drama Queen!

Drama Queen? Then what do you call Masnick with his hysterical half-truths, paranoid conspiracy theories and wild conclusions? He's a blathering, tinfoil hat wearing, nutjob.
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Anonymous Coward, 30 Jul 2011 @ 4:37am

Re: Re:
"It is estimated that intellectual property theft costs American industry billions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of jobs every year."

It is also estimated that DHS has the largest number of sexual assailants and child molesters of any organization in the US.
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The Devil's Coachman (profile), 30 Jul 2011 @ 4:58am

Re:
That idiot never interrupts his relentless stream of meaningless drivel. What a lack of a life he must have!
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The Devil's Coachman (profile), 30 Jul 2011 @ 5:00am

Re: Re:
Time to go change your Depends, and take your meds. Maybe your outlook will improve afterward. At least your aroma should,
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abc gum, 30 Jul 2011 @ 7:01am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Bad analogy

Copyright infringement is not on par with the sale of illicit drugs - Duh!
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abc gum, 30 Jul 2011 @ 7:06am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"Probable cause was demonstrated to a judge who then issued a seizure warrant. That's due process."

Agreed. However, there seems to be a general dislike for the hassle of actually getting the warrant prior to the "processing".
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abc gum, 30 Jul 2011 @ 7:08am

Re: Re:
"Drama Queen? Then what do you call Masnick with his hysterical half-truths, paranoid conspiracy theories and wild conclusions? He's a blathering, tinfoil hat wearing, nutjob."

Why do you continually refer to yourself as "Masnick" whilst looking into a mirror?
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Jay (profile), 30 Jul 2011 @ 10:21pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
In terms of failure rate? It is. :p
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redrum, 13 Oct 2011 @ 11:32am

Re: It's no longer safe to push at the bounds of copyright.
Limiting the money that tyrants get is the only way societies ever gain or maintain freedom. - [citation needed]
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