Former RIAA Lobbyist, Now Judge, Says Lowest Possible Statutory Damages For Single Case Of Infringement Is $3,430

from the punishment-does-not-fit-the-crime dept

Mon, Sep 12th 2011 5:46am — Mike Masnick

Remember Judge Beryl Howell? She's one of the only judges who's received one of these copyright troll cases involving hundreds, if not thousands, of totally unrelated John Does in a single case to refuse to sever the unrelated defendants (and bizarrely tried to claim it was to their benefit to be sued together). It only later came out that Howell was very recently an official lobbyist for the RIAA. At the very least, that calls into question her objectivity on copyright cases.

Anyway, late last week, Judge Howell also made an interesting ruling in one of US Copyright Group's cases, involving the movie Call of the Wild. Like her earlier ruling, this one will have many more copyright trolls filing cases in her district, hoping to get a judge so amenable to the arguments of copyright trolls. The ruling was a default judgment, meaning that the guy being sued simply did not respond to being sued (a dumb move). Of course, with a default judgment, the court still has some leeway in ordering what kind of award is given, and in this case, Judge Howell has apparently decided that the absolute minimum anyone could pay if found in default on a copyright case is not the $200 for innocent infringers, nor the $750 amount that is the official minimum listed in the law... but, rather $3,430, which is the $750 amount plus another $2,680 in lawyer's fees. That's a bit strange since it's not all that common to award attorney's fees in such cases, and considering that US Copyright Group is a factory of sorts, pumping out tons of these cases, and suing tens of thousands of individuals without much effort to ascertain the legitimacy of the lawsuits, it's difficult to see how it could have cost them that much at all.

Still, have no fear that this particular default judgment will be waved around by USCG and others in their shakedown letters to people who are being pressured into paying up.

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Filed Under: beryl howell, copyright, default judgment, statutory damages

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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 5:36am

I think the phrase is 'lolno'. Is it possible to get a mistrial in civil cases?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 5:50am

Judge Beryl Howell lets dogs screw her in the butt.
she loves doggie sex.loves to have orgies with RIAA & MPAA Officials.
they have a secret club where they all screw each others pets.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:03am

Today's word is Court
As in Kangaroo Court.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:15am

Is it time to start murdering the corrupt yet?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:23am

Of course, with a default judgment, the court still has some leeway in ordering what kind of award is given, and in this case, Judge Howell has apparently decided that the absolute minimum anyone could pay if found in default on a copyright case is not the $200 for innocent infringers, nor the $750 amount that is the official minimum listed in the law... but, rather $3,430, which is the $750 amount plus another $2,680 in lawyer's fees.

"Innocent" infringement has to be proved by the defendant. Since the defendant here didn't put on a defense, as a matter of law, $200 in damages was not available. So when you WHINE about Judge Howell not awarded $200, IT IS PURE FUD. The fact that you should know better makes it MANIPULATIVE LIES. Instead, she did in fact award the minimum, which is $750. So when you whine that she didn't award the minimum, IT IS MORE FUD.

That's a bit strange since it's not all that common to award attorney's fees in such cases, and considering that US Copyright Group is a factory of sorts, pumping out tons of these cases, and suing tens of thousands of individuals without much effort to ascertain the legitimacy of the lawsuits, it's difficult to see how it could have cost them that much at all.

Now, of course you're going to WHINE and spread FUD on the attorney's fees. That's a given. If Judge Howell rules in any way, shape, or form in a copyright case, Mike will WHINE about it no matter what facts, law, or reasoning are. Rather than look at the court filings to see how USCG justified the amount of attorney's fees being claimed here, Mike just goes with his gut. And WITHOUT ANY PROOF OR BASIS whatsoever, Mike has declared that the amount awarded here is wrong. Mike, if you want to understand how this number was arrived at, look it up. The fact that you don't PROVES (once again and for the millionth time) THAT YOU WORK BACKWARDS. Such idiocy. You truly are an IDIOT.

Another moronic hit-piece from Pirate Mike the Pirate Apologist.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:29am

Re:
Mike, why are so many of your loyal fans and devotees such homicidal sociopaths? Your flock is truly a wonder to behold. They'd fit in well at the maximum security lockup, I should think. You must be SO PROUD that you foster such a lovely following of rejects.
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Butcherer79 (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:32am

Re:
For the millionth time, I will not exagerate
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Another AC, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:36am

Re:
Just RTFA, please. For your own sake. Then re-read your post :)
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:37am

I'm not sure what the problem is. It sounds like US Copyright Group connected with fans (rightsholders) and given them a reason to buy.
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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:41am

Re: Re:
Hey, I'm the only homicidal sociopath here! All the others are just digital clones.
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ramjet57 (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:41am

Re:
I'm just curious..are you always an asshole or do you just become one for our amusement? Since you obviously have a problem with this forum and it's moderator why don't start your own? You can then be an asshole to your hearts content and not bother the adults...
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:43am

Re: Re:
"homicidal sociopaths"

Erm, citation needed I think...

"such a lovely following of rejects"

I think the AC trolls are more in this category. At least those who tend to agree with Mike actually discuss the issue at hand instead of trying to attack Mike persoanlly with every post...
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:44am

Re: Re:
If we don't have all sides to an argument, this site turns into a bunch of yes-men (and women). No discourse can be had. Just because you don't like his articles or the way he presents them doesn't mean he should take a hike. It just means that you want to cover your ears to anyone's point of view that isn't yours.
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:44am

Re: Re: Re:
Oh, and by "citation needed", I clearly mean people who have actually tried doing such a thing rather than posting a semi-sarcastic comment on a message board.
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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:44am

Re:
Do you have a link to prove Mike wrong? After all, your ilk like to pretend that they are always right, in spite of a body of evidence to the contrary.

It's only FUD if it's provably false.
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Prisoner 201, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:46am

Re:
U mad bro?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:47am

Re: Re:
These sorts of psychotic comments about murdering the so-called "corrupt" and Judge Howell and beastiality only reveal to lawmakers the character and mental state of opponents to reasonable copyright measures. Thanks Mike for hosting a forum where true substance of the opposition can be put on full display.

P.S. Costco is having a sale on aluminum foil this week. Stock up now.
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anonymous, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:49am

i hope the person concerned can get some sort of appeal. this judge/lobbyist is of the opinion that she can make up laws as she goes along. why on earth is she not questioned by her peers on her rulings and the reasons used? why on earth was she made a judge in the first place, given her former 'occupation'? there has to be bias here without doubt!
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Prisoner 201, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:49am

Re: Re: Re:
All sides?

Do we really need the "angry swearing name calling" side of every argument?

I'm not sure we have enough trolls for that.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:50am

Re:
Remember, there is the law, and then there is what is people feel is just. $3430, despite where it comes from, dose not fit the crime.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:53am

Beryl Howell seems to have lost her damn mind. I refuse to call her a Judge any more, because Judges are supposed to be impartial and uphold the law.

It is nice that she quotes the law allowing the recovery of costs, can she quote the portion of the law that says they have had the case open for more than 4 months and there are still Does on the docket and that is a violation? She's only extended it several times and looks to do so again, why should the court cut them a break because they filed against to many people to process at once?

I'm trying to work through recap to see how Jason Smith was served, this would not be the first time that a copyright troll buried the notice to be overlooked. (The case of the woman in NJ who comes to mind who was able to get the court to reopen the case against her because the letters to her were unbelievable so she ignored them.)

I think there is something VERY hinkey here...
Can someone with PACER access please access Document #61?
"AFFIDAVIT FOR DEFAULT re: Defendant Jason Smith by CALL OF THE WILD MOVIE, LLC. (Attachments: # 1 Affidavit (Military))(Kurtz, Nicholas) (Entered: 07/20/2011)"

Is it possible he didn't answer because mail service to military personnel might be a little hit or miss?
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YR a MORON, 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:53am

Re:
Said the asskissing riaa/mpaa asshole...
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:56am

Re: Re: Re:
They reveal nothing. It's someone's expressed opinion albeit heavy on sarcasm.

It's neither someone's "character" nor mental faculties, when you can't understand a joke and want to justify demonizing someone's viewpoint in order to continue ad hominem attacks.

That's all and nothing more.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:05am

Re:
I'll send the requested doc to you shortly.
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Bengie, 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:10am

WTF
How is a former lobbyist allowed to rule on cases for which they were paid lobbied from the very people who are suing?

Isn't that a clear conflict of interest?

I know, lets let a former rapist rule on rape cases. SHE DESERVED IT, DRESSED LIKE THAT! NO FAULT!

Yep, no bias.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:11am

Re:
Here it is: http://www.scribd.com/doc/64681650/10-Cv-00455-BAH-Document-61-Affidavit-in-Support-of-Default
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Karl (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:14am

Re:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_provocateur
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:20am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
@Jay

So now you're a psychic? You understand the motivation and intent of each and every post? Sorry, these kinds of posts are generally taken a face value by legislative staffs who monitor the discussion of proposed bills.

I haven't seen proponents of the copyright or the Protect IP bill suggest killing pirate site operators or stating that judges who render copyright decisions they disagree with have group sex with animals. Perhaps copyright proponents just lack the wacky, sophisticated sense of humor of the apologists. I hope they keep it up though, it discredits them far more than anything else I can think of.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:21am

Although I wholeheartedly agree on TAC's assessment of judge Beryl, and, given the fraudulent evidence, the amount should be zero (or even negative), I don't think that in this particular case it it such a big win for trolls: threatening anyone with 3.5K, and only in a case of default is ridiculous since the amount is basically the same as settlement.

If a default fine is that low, being a defendant, I would expect that if I file an answer to complaint to avoid default, I would expect a lesser fine or no fine at all.

An yes, not replying to court (not a troll!) is stupid: www.fightcopyrighttrolls.com/faq
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:21am

Re:
The problem being that there's rarely a considered, thoughtful, even truthful opposition. Sure, Mike isn't right 100% of the time but every post is full of stupid trolls trying to paint everyone who doesn't toe the corporate line as a pirate.

Look at your post, for example.

You scream and shout at Mike in all caps, which generally say nothing except LOOK AT ME I'M AN ATTENTION WHORE. Unless there's a word or two that need to be emphasised and you don't have time/knowledge to use html, there's no excuse and it makes you look obnoxious.

Then, there's the core of your argument. You take the (possible insightful) objection to Mike's opposition to the fees, suggesting that the defendant's failure to defend makes these fees impossible to avoid. But in doing so, you miss a couple of his central issues (the judge is a former RIAA lobbyist, these accusations are so scattershot and often so baseless that ordinary people can't effectively defend). and fail to address them in favour of your chosen narrative. A total strawman, and stupid childish name-calling to boot, not to mention exactly what you're trying to accuse Mike of doing in the first place - "FUD".

Once again, if you have a reasonable objection to the post, act like an adult. Point out your objection and cite the reasons why. Don't start strawman building or namecalling. Then, you might find more people willing to engage you, and perhaps even agree with you. As it is, you're driving away your own potential allies by your own actions, then pretending that Mike's controlling everyone and/or a pirate.

All this achieves it make you look stupid. Try subtlety and/or intelligence and then you might get somewhere.
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DOlz (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:24am

I recuse!
This seems like an obvious case where the judge should recuse them self. The fact that this judge did not should be prima facie evidence of lacking judicial temperament and should be removed from the bench.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:24am

Re: Re: Re:
"If we don't have all sides to an argument"

You mean like how the mainstream media and big corporations abuse their wrongfully granted government established monopoly power over public airwaves and cableco infrastructure to present one side, and only one side, of the IP debate (the indefensible, pro-IP side) while refusing to allow critics, like MM, to respond?

For example, see

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20091101/1818186751.shtml

http://www.techdirt.com/article s/20100727/10432810380.shtml

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20101005/12204511290/why-won-t-univ ersal-music-let-you-see-the-20-20-report-from-1980-about-how-the-music-industry-is-dying.shtml

ht tp://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110603/02385514537/why-is-federal-government-running-ads-secretly-c reated-owned-nbc-universal.shtml

Among others.
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Karl (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:24am

Re:
You really have no idea what FUD actually means, do you?

Here's a hint: Every time you use a phrase like "Pirate Mike the Pirate Apologist," you are spreading FUD.

Having said that: I think the award is not even remotely unexpected. And under the letter of the law, it is not unreasonable either.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:26am

Re: Re:
Thank you Jane, it appears that there is just a special addendum on the affidavit saying that he is not in a military according to their research.

I am more interested that they would personally serve someone rather than just mail it. Also troubling is its just one of the lawyers claiming its true and there is no proof of service other than his say so.
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:26am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"I haven't seen proponents of the copyright or the Protect IP bill suggest killing pirate site operators or stating that judges who render copyright decisions they disagree with have group sex with animals. "

... Are you absolutely sure about this? I'm giving you your ONE chance to back away from this statement.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:31am

Re: WTF
No conflict at all she lobbied for the RIAA not the MPAA.

/sarcasm
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Chris Rhodes (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:34am

Re: Re:
so many

How many?

Also, how do you know said AC was a "loyal fan and devotee"? For all we know, it was you . . .
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:38am

Re:
Well it can turn a crap film into a blockbuster.

The Numbers for Call of the Wild 3D (2009)

Gross
$28,024 (USA) (28 June 2009)
$24,691 (USA) (21 June 2009)

Weekend Gross
$987 (USA) (28 June 2009) (3 Screens)
$6,179 (USA) (21 June 2009) (12 Screens)

source - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1192620/business
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:46am

Re: Re: Re:
"If we don't have all sides to an argument"

There are many sides to every argument that don't involve trolling, name calling, misrepresentation of others' opinions and outright lies. That we rarely get dissenting arguments here that don't consist of some (or all) of those is hardly Mike's fault.

Try presenting an opposing argument that doesn't contain any of those, and be prepared to back up assertions if challenged. That's all that's needed for a debate that includes "all sides".
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:47am

Re: Re: Re:
The "proof" is here:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/64684718/10-Cv-00455-BAH-Document-65-Proof

And as you've said, it's just the attorney's word. These scumbags save even on mailing - summons were sent via first-class. My troll, Sperlein, bothered to send certified mail with a proof of delivery (signature), which he had subsequently filed.

Unfortunately, in civil cases the bar of proof is very low: as far as I know sending something via first-class mail is enough.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:48am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
I don't remember saying that they were right for suppressing a side either. Can you point out where I did?

Mike provides this forum and if some guy wants to come in with his rant against what Mike says, then that's Mike's call to let him/her to do so. Even if the person acts like a fool, there may be some insight into what they are saying. I'm not talking about this specific case, but in general.

Note: Calm down, buddy. I'm not on their side or your side. I'm just reading and seeing a lot of people who don't own the server space telling someone to go somewhere else. That'd be like me seeing some guy in a privately owned park and telling them to leave. That's up to the owner of the property.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:49am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Also I noticed that the filing is unsigned. Is it acceptable?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:52am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
The person above disagrees. Sure, they did it in a bit of a hateful way, but it's a disagreement with some specific points. Respond to those.

There are enough trolls to accomplish anything.
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:57am

Re: Re: Re:
Bestiality? The comment that's been voted down by the community already? Both comments made by ACs (who get painted as "Techdirt staffers" if they say something sensible pro-TD, but are apparently unquestionable when they act like fools).

Oh, and it's hardly tin foil hat time to suggest that a judge who has worked as an RIAA lobbyist might have a conflict of interest when working on a verdict that directly profits the RIAA. That seems pretty direct, even if it's not a deliberate conflict.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 7:59am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
the /s/ is used on electronically filed documents.

I do not think first class mail is actual real service.
It is an apartment building, and from a quicky Google search it has a bad bed bug problem, it could be possible Mr. Smith no longer lives there and did to get the letter.

They have no proof to show it was ever gotten, this qualifies as service? I think there is a real problem brewing here.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:06am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
bah

"mailing it to the person�s last known address � in which event service is complete upon mailing;"

http://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/frcp/Rule5.htm

But it is still possible the person no longer lived there as this case has been running for a very long time. It could be why he was picked for the special treatment. He is a defendant who is completely unaware of any actions against him, the perfect patsy.
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out_of_the_blue, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:10am

Mike's title is FALSE.
"... Lowest Possible Statutory Damages For Single Case Of Infringement Is $3,430" -- No, it's 750 plus attorney fees.

Now, you freetards can defend your position -- actually you don't: 90 percent of freetard comment above is sheerly ad hom, "shut up", and prim lecture -- anyway, it's FACT that Mike began this with a title that is simply not true, not even with a stretch. That falsehood sets the tone here.
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Prisoner 201, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:11am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Fuck you, asshole, in principle I agree with your stinking fat ugly rapist ass, but personally I find that asshole cunt reading and digesting fuckwad crap bumyeast hateful, swearing posts and filtering out the fucking frogmuppet crap is just too fucking assrape tedious and frankly, motherfucker, annoying.

So yeah, you are correct, but I dont have the energy for it.

Asshole.

The above swearing and name calling is included for educational purposes only, no emotions were wasted on this post, and no offense intended. No animals, humans or keyboards were harmed in the making of this post. This post is rated PG13 for foul language. Parental discretion is advised.
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out_of_the_blue, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:14am

Re: Re: PaulT, prim schoolmarm.
This quickly became the usual "comments on comments" tangle that you freetards evidently don't grasp doesn't help your case, either.

By the way, I seem to have suppressed a certain Techdirt "Insider" from making bizarre sexual references here, but do I get any thanks for it? Was there ever any of the regulars (say, Jay, who lectures above) who called for that to end? -- Did Mike? -- No, so long as one agrees with Mike, anything goes.

So phooey on your schoolmarm reprimands, PaulT, unless equally and PRIOR-LY directed to freetards.
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:17am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
If he's military, he won't be able to receive the summons until he finishes his mission.

This may come to backfire on the plaintiff as well as Beryl...
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:18am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
More interesting is I found a hit for the name and almost the address in Spokeo...

Still something really not right here...
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:19am

Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
": 90 percent of freetard comment above is sheerly ad hom"

Ootb just saved 50% by switching his name to Mr. Pot...
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:20am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
I would suggest the EFF get involved. This is very important to them, to ensure justice on a case like this and showing ways that she's not an unbiased judge can severely dampen her credibility.
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Thomas (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:20am

Wow...
So now judges are more concerned with industries that pay them money under the table rather than the law? How much does it take to get a judge to make a ruling? $10,000? $20,000?

Are there any honest judges anymore? I know that it reaches even to the SCOTUS, but it would be nice if there were some honest judges around.
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:21am

Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
So, are you saying that it's somehow possible to make the $750 payment without paying the legal fees, or that the title is factually correct? You seem to be confusing yourself here.

Not surprising for someone who uses the term "freetard", which usually indicates kindergarten-level debating skills, but still...
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theDude, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:22am

Re: Re:
You just made the list buddy!
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:23am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
I certainly don't recall any death threats or allegations against judges regarding beastiality. But feel free to prove me wrong. Right now your side are the ones with shit on their faces.
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:29am

Re: Re: Re: PaulT, prim schoolmarm.
So you can't even respond to me without having an ad hominem attack in the very subject of your post? No cites or references to when your imagined slights might have taken place?

Yet, you expect me to take you at your word. See how silly that is? At least, unlike the average AC, you provide a name that can be mostly tracked via Google (though not a login that can be looked at via a post history directly). You still commit most of the sins described above, though.

"freetards"

Oooh and you end with an ad hominem as well. How symmetrical.
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Greg G (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:30am

Re:
When someone doesn't really have a fact-based argument, two things tend to happen:

1. The accusation of FUD by whoever they disagree with.
2. The overcapitalization of WORDS throughout the POST in order to try and EMPHASIZE their point so that the reader won't have to THINK too much to UNDERSTAND what they are TRYING to say.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Paul, why don't you read the bios of some federal judges. You'll discover that 100% had legal careers before taking the bench. The federal government is lousy with former Googlers in senior policy positions. It shouldn't be a surprise that people had careers in the private sector before becoming judges or senior policy people.

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9133954/Growing_White_House_ties_to_Google_draw_protest
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PaulT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:38am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
" if some guy wants to come in with his rant against what Mike says, then that's Mike's call to let him/her to do so"

Do you have any examples of when this was not allowed, other than times when someone did so and was piled on for acting stupid? I've never seen examples of times when Mike has been proven to block someone for their opinion.

Bearing in mind, of course, that acting like a moron and then having 10 people saying "you're a moron" is not censorship.
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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:41am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
So one person clearly represents all of humanity in the (im)moral crusade against other people with less money.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:42am

Re: Wow...
Hahahaha... now the Techdirtbag accusations that federal judges accept bribes for rendering decisions. Thanks Thomas!!!!
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:44am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Exactly. IP maximists tend to lock the comment sections of their blogs down, Techdirt opens them up for anyone to see.

The IP maximist mainstream media blocks IP criticisms from seeing the light of day, abusing their government established monopoly power to do so no less, while IP critics welcome criticism.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:44am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
the affidavit said he wasn't military, was just odd how it was entered into the docket.
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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:44am

Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
Why should attorney fees be awarded without any evidence (such as a Military Discharge/Recuitment form) and no other attempts to contact the defendant?
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Atkray (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:45am

Re: Re: Re:
LIAR!!!

Costco is not having a sale. I checked their site, the local store, and the mailer my wife hid from me last week.

Here I was all excited to stock up.

I really wish the the IP crowd would hire at least one researcher.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:46am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
The problem is if the address on the summons was incorrect he will still be unaware he was ever served. He might be unaware anyone was looking for his information in the first place.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:46am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
For anyone to participate *
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:56am

Re: I recuse!
Of course the judge would have recused herself is she or her prior lawfirm had represented the plaintiff in the action. However, the plaintiff is not the industry organization known as the MPAA, and the MPAA is certainly not the RIAA, recusal in a bogus issue for those here bent on coming to the aid and lending support to the defendants.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:58am

Re: Re:
True, it does not appear unreasonable under the circumstances. If anything, the judge gave the defendant a break by selecting the low end of the statutory damages range.
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el_segfaulto (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 8:59am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Heck, I'd be happy if the IP crowd could hire one flunky with an IQ over 80.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:01am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Should have been rated R for the words cunt, fucking, and motherfucker. I'm not sure what a frogmuppet is but I think I want one.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:04am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Since you obviously have a problem with this forum and it's moderator why don't start your own? You can then be an asshole to your hearts content and not bother the adults..

Here. This is where people are telling him to go away. This is what I have a problem with. It does not say 'You're a moron'. It says 'GTFO'.

We're supposed to be better than this. I'm being attacked for no reason other than I think that people should be allowed to state their mind unless the person that owns the property tells them to go away.

I feel a strong need to include the words 'Leave Brittany alone!' in here somewhere.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:06am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Bestiality? The comment that's been voted down by the community already?

Yes. Nice Streisand effect too!
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el_segfaulto (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:06am

Re: Re: Re: PaulT, prim schoolmarm.
Isn't there somewhere else you'd rather be? Shaking down schoolchildren or waving your reproductive organs at traffic? You seldom have anything intelligent to add to a conversation (you do have your moments though) and usually come off as a complete ass. Especially when you litter your ramblings with "freetard", a moniker I would wear with pride but one which others may find offensive, especially if they have to deal with a loved one with a mental handicap.
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Timmy, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:10am

Am I missing something
How does the sharing of a single file with one other person equate to several thousand dollars in damages? Did the RIAA somehow manage to lose interest in stock to that amount when one file was shared???? Uh.. This isn't justice. This is stealing from the poor to give to the wealthy. This judge has fewer brain cells than a five year old.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:21am

Re: Re: I recuse!
except she lobbied on laws about this and getting them changed to make these types of cases easier.

she has ruled that the Does have no right to question this case on issues of misjoineder, lack of jurisdiction because they are not named yet.

She has extended the limit for the plantiffs to name Does and move forward an several occasions deciding the rules of federal procedure should be bent for people who attempt to sue more people than they can possibly handle.

She has refused to look at the questionable evidence and the agreement with the firm supplying the information, this same firm has had its "evidence" throw out of courts in Germany. The firm uses multiple names to appear to be different groups, which also might be a tactic to protect the business model if one of the cases collapses.

She has provided every opportunity for plaintiffs, while making it near impossible for the Does to have any consideration.

Her actions are "questionable" at best, and when framed with her former position lobbying in this arena there is the appearance of impropriety. Any Judge when faced with things looking improper should recuse themselves to remove any doubt about the case being handled properly.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:21am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
There are many sides to every argument that don't involve trolling, name calling, misrepresentation of others' opinions and outright lies. That we rarely get dissenting arguments here that don't consist of some (or all) of those is hardly Mike's fault.

If I came off sounding like I was blaming The Maz, then I apologize. Didn't mean to come off that way.

I agree with you about the 'many sides to every argument', but I haven't seen Mike tell the guy that he needs to go away and be an asshole somewhere else. Until then, I assume he's a welcome commenter just like everyone else here.
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Zot-Sindi, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:26am

Re:
...wtf...
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:27am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Once again, there's more than two sides to an argument.

Also, I find it ironic that you talk to Senators all day and don't remember the one Senator who became infamous for wanting to destroy computers left and right.

There have been death threats in filesharing.

And who could forget that once upon a time, copyprivilege was punishable by death?

Feel free to go ahead and debate them and minimize them all you want. I'm sure the point will be lost on you that this really isn't a huge issue to me, because the thoughts and opinions of one anonymous speaker wanting to Donkey Punch Beryll, doesn't mean that everyone in the world who supports filesharing, or speaks out against it, feels the same way.
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Zot-Sindi, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:28am

Re: Re: Re:
P.S. Costco is having a sale on aluminum foil this week. Stock up now.

well, i tried, but it seems the pro-copyright group has already bought out the entire supply, now what?
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Zot-Sindi, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:32am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Right now your side are the ones with shit on their faces.

er, you mean the shit you threw on our faces? that's nothing new, just a drop in the ocean of poo-flinging your side has done for years and is still doing today

for all i know, one of yours could've posted that, it's friggin' anonymous, who knows what side their on
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Vincent Clement (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:34am

The damn lawyers made more money than the supposed artist. How do these lawsuits help the artist again?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
He's welcome to stay, but his constant complaining suggests that he doesn't like it here. If he doesn't like it here, perhaps a good suggestion would be for him to leave. He doesn't have to leave, but why stay if he doesn't like the blog? Why stay if he doesn't like the commenter or the comments? Why stay if he doesn't like it here? Instead of always complaining, maybe a better option for him would be to leave and start his own blog that he would be happy with. Just a suggestion. No one is forcing him to leave.
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Zot-Sindi, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
I hope they keep it up though, it discredits them far more than anything else I can think of.

*shrug*

not worried about that, really, you'd have to be like an expert at losing credibility to beat what the MAFIAA has already accomplished

...or a spy sent by them to discredit the other sides...

good thing i already had a supply of tinfoil hats premade
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
(IOWs, we're not forcing him to leave, we're merely giving him advice).
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Mike Masnick (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:39am

Re: Re:
Mike, why are so many of your loyal fans and devotees such homicidal sociopaths? Your flock is truly a wonder to behold. They'd fit in well at the maximum security lockup, I should think. You must be SO PROUD that you foster such a lovely following of rejects

As opposed to the people who have called for my death, regularly lied about me, attacked me and my family?

Btw, the comment you're responding to? It's from someone who normally attacks us. Yes, that's right, it's someone on your side of the debate who posted that as an exaggeration pretending to be one of the people who support us.
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Ed C., 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:40am

Re: Re: I recuse!
It's about having a fair trial. Or do you think the RIAA is never wrong? The argument against the judge is hardly bogus when she has previously demonstrated a clear bias on IP issues. Has she yet to give a judgement in favor of the defense, or raise questions like other judges have about the sort of shoddy evidence typically used in these cases? In this case, she wasn't required to favor the prosecution because the defense didn't show. She still has to judge the evidence that is presented. There have been cases dismissed without any defense, based solely by the evidence submitted by prosecution.
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Zot-Sindi, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:41am

Re:
mike this mike that
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Manabi (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:46am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Not to sound too tinfoil hat-ish, but the affidavit stating that is filed by the plaintiff's lawyers (aka, the troll) and not a single one of them are exactly known for being thorough in their research of... well, much of anything. So the guy may, or may not, be in the military but the only thing saying he isn't is based on the lawyer saying he isn't.

Personally I don't give much credence to what any of the copyright troll lawyers say, we've seen time and again that they'll stretch the truth if not outright lie as long as it benefits them.
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Manabi (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:49am

Re: Re: Wow...
You seem to have problems with reality. Thomas is simply a commentor on Techdirt, as am I, as are you. What he's saying isn't Techdirt saying anything. And the law agrees with this, there are provisions in the law (upheld plenty of times in court) that sites aren't responsible for what their commentors say.

So stop making stuff up, you're just making yourself look childish.
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A Monkey with Atitude, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:50am

Re: Re: Re:
Mike, your using logic again! how dare you, don't you know every time you do that he falls over from brain lock!!!

Next on the RIAA/Movie list BAN LOGIC... It gets in the way of our profits....
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out_of_the_blue, 12 Sep 2011 @ 9:59am

Re: Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
"So, are you saying that it's somehow possible to make the $750 payment without paying the legal fees," -- YES, if you had READ Mike's post, you'd see that he states attorney's fees are optional: "That's a bit strange since it's not all that common to award attorney's fees in such cases".

Man, this is the sort of snowballing wrongness that Techdirt fosters. First Mike inflates his claim. After I call him on it, you leap in to defend and only end up showing that you haven't even read the piece!
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Austin (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:26am

I wish
As a paralegal working in an actual law firm that does primarily civil corporate contract law, I can say with certainty that at best we get 45% on any given case, and usually 1/3 or even less if by-the-hour. In Alabama, any lawyer asking for more than 45% is pretty much going to be hit with an automatic state bar complaint as this violates the standard in the Rules of Civil Procedure for a "reasonable attorneys fee" so anyhow...yeah, I really wish we could collect 4x the amount of a judgment as Attorney's fee but it ain't happening here. Don't know about other states but this is insane.
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Bengie, 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:27am

Re: Re: WTF
I know it was sarcasm, but I had this pop in my head as a "rebuttal"

MPAA/RIAA: Same wolf, different sheep outfit.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:32am

This woman is a disgrace, she doesn't care about the law she cares about her buddies in the entertainment industry and think that by creating the right financial incentives justice will be served when it will not, justice should be hard, justice should be painful for both parties so people don't abuse it make it easy to overcome the burdens of it for one party and not the other and we have a focking disaster.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
@Jay

I would suggest the EFF get involved.

You'll have to wait for Google to snap their fingers before that will happen.
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:36am

Re: Wow...
I asked elsewhere how much does it cost to sell out the Constitution?

I'm sad that it only costs $3430 to sell out certain inalienable rights...
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:44am

Re: Re: Re: Wow...
You seem to have problems with reality. Thomas is simply a commentor on Techdirt

Note the term "TechdirtBAG" as opposed to Techdirt. I think everyone (except perhaps you) understands that Thomas is just another apologist and does not speak officially for Techdirt.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:50am

Re: Re: Wow...
Perhaps you ought to switch careers from being a failed creator to a failed attorney.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:51am

Re: Re: Wow...
Perhaps you ought to switch careers from being a failed creator to a failed attorney.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:02am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Quote:
"A smart man solves the problem, an intelligent one avoids it"

Source: Albert Enstein.

Quote:
In the brief moments that genesimmons.com was back online on Sunday, Simmons posted the following threat against Anonymous. (via slyck)

Some of you may have heard a few popcorn farts re: our sites being threatened by hackers.
Our legal team and the FBI have been on the case and we have found a few, shall we say "adventurous" young people, who feel they are above the law.
And, as stated in my MIPCOM speech, we will sue their pants off.
First, they will be punished.
Second, they might find their little butts in jail, right next to someone who's been there for years and is looking for a new girl friend.
We will soon be printing their names and pictures.
We will find you.
You cannot hide.
Stay tuned

Source: http://www.urlesque.com/2010/10/19/ddos-attacked-gene-simmons-lily-allen-officer-bubbles/
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Rikuo (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:03am

Re: Am I missing something
Absolutely. What if the guy being talked about actually does walk into court one day with the DVD of the movie in question? Can he say the disc was scratched and he simply downloaded a replacement copy?
Oh wait. I forgot. Apparently you buy a LICENSE to the movie. Which is something that is never actually told to you at the till. I always thought it was an out and out sale.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:11am

Re: Re: Re: I recuse!
"Doe" pleadings aside, this is a case against just one named individual.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:25am

Re: Re: Re:
@Masnick

Btw, the comment you're responding to? It's from someone who normally attacks us. Yes, that's right, it's someone on your side of the debate who posted that as an exaggeration pretending to be one of the people who support us.

Interesting assertion from the guy who suggests that an IP address alone is insufficient to create a link to an individual for the purpose of an indictment or civil action. Tell us Mike, could someone have spoofed his IP address? Or maybe hacked his wireless router. Or maybe his router isn't password protected.

H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-E
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:26am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Do you ever get tired of trolling? I mean, just once, can there be anything substantial to your post than "everything is the problem of CDK, Google, and the EFF for not doing what we copyrightists want them to do"?

Your routine is just old now, Bucko. Please. Get a new one.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:30am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
That was in 2010 it is almost one year waiting for the names and pictures, I guess "soon" is a different deal for some folks.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:32am

Re: Re:
You really have no idea what FUD actually means, do you?

Here's a hint: Every time you use a phrase like "Pirate Mike the Pirate Apologist," you are spreading FUD.

I believe that Mike knows that the $200 damages for innocent infringement are not even a possibility here as a matter of law, but he throws that in anyway to deepen the FUD. This whole article is just plain FUD, Karl. I don't know how you could consider it to be anything but. From the headline (which is just plain wrong and intentionally misleading) to the very last period. It's all FUD.

Having said that: I think the award is not even remotely unexpected. And under the letter of the law, it is not unreasonable either.

Right. She awarded the minimum statutory damages allowable, $750. The attorney's fees don't seem unreasonable, considering the expense of filing a federal lawsuit (this is a named defendant), pre-trial motions, discovery, etc. The number looks low to me.

Regardless. I would not write an entire article about how ridiculous and wrong these fees are without first understanding how USCG arrived at the numbers. Or at the least, I'd look up awards in other cases with similar circumstances for comparison.

Not Mike the Pirate. He's ready to go to print without bothering to let facts guide him. That's how you know it's FUD. Who needs facts when you've got FUD?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Because the idiots from the industry don't have a reality distortion field they would be exposed to the Lilly Allen Effects of the causality created by their actions.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:39am

Re: Re: Re: Wow...
He is afraid of drowning in is own BS.
The tide is coming and people are organizing in many fronts, open culture is becoming more wide spread, tools are being created to not only light the dark corners of politics but also to do something about it and if ever people are able to put a unified front and start voting on the issues instead of the people those idiots are screwed.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:40am

Re: Re: Re: Wow...
No thanks, nobody want to be you.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:42am

Re: Re: Am I missing something
You know what a license means in this case right?

It is a rental contract.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:52am

Another Techdirt fail.

The judge said the minimum is $750 (as per the law). The lawyers fees are something that are asked for in a civil matter, and agreed to by the courts. It isn't a "minimum", because if they lawyer costs were only $100, then the total would have been $850.

Congrats Mike, you are about 4 out of 5 on punting shit today.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:03pm

Re: Re: Re:
Lawyer costs here are actually $0. Attorney fees make sense when attorneys work for hire and don't have a vested interest in a lawsuit. For USCG it is a business enterprise (joint venture with other conspirators), not a work for hire. Therefore their time and a fortune spend to file a federal case ($350) is just a risky business investment, which paid off nicely by the way. Asking for "fees" on top of their dirty profit is impudent to say the least.

If Al Capone nicely asks a store owner to pay for "protection" in a letter, and the owner does not receive that letter for some reason, his associates turns out and get their ransom anyway, but do they also complain that because of that damn store owner they had to buy additional guns and should be reimbursed for that?
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:11pm

Re: Re: Re: WTF
Actually the RIAA seems more gunshy these days, and the MPAA are just pressing them to keep up the valiant effort.

Considering how much cash they burned trying to crucify their customers (and innocent bystanders/dead people/dogs) even they are coming to the conclusion that the open litigation tactics are a bad idea.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:14pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: I recuse!
You haven't read the documents.
This is a mass doe case, where I believe 3 Does have been transformed into named parties in the same mass case.
The named parties appear on the same line as the Does.
Filing a new case would have required another $350.
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RadialSkid (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:24pm

The ruling was a default judgment, meaning that the guy being sued simply did not respond to being sued (a dumb move).

I disagree with this. Not responding and accepting the default judgement is generally cheaper than hiring an attorney and fighting, and it's less convenient for those filing against you than a settlement. They still have to go to court (assuming they don't drop it), and the victim isn't likely to get hit with a Jammie Thomas $2 million judgement.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:31pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
He complains about Techdirt, so we're challenging him to do better. Instead of sitting here and complaining all day, why doesn't he start his own blog and do better. He's welcomed to stay, but the point is that he can't expect anyone to take him seriously when all he does is complain about techdirt and he does nothing to meet the challenge of starting his own blog and doing better.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:33pm

Re:
Looking back at this particular judgement, yes, you are right, but the case law about what the appropriate amount of a default judgement is still in the works, so I wouldn't advocate ignoring summons, it's still a lottery, a scary lottery: a couple of months ago a Canadian guy got hit with $60 K default in a similar case.
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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:33pm

Re:
I think you missed that part where one of the Names in the docket was claimed that he was not in the Military, with no evidence cited, and was given a default judgement against himself. Thw award is for $200 innocent infringement PLUS ~$3,000 in attorney fees.

I don'#t know about you, but for a �350 filing, that's...what? 1,000% of the original cost? That's a massive profit margin.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:39pm

Re:
...that's why despite Howell's ruling is still disgusting, I think it is rather good than bad in a long run. One of the pillars of trolls' "business model" is their weapon of fear charged with "up to $150K" rounds.

If judges start awarding minimally allowed judgements, in defaults, Does will realize that a boogieman is just a clown and incapable of inflicting any serious harm. The entire trolling "business" will collapse.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:44pm

Re: Re: Re:
As opposed to the people who have called for my death, regularly lied about me, attacked me and my family?

Called for your death? Wow. If you died, I couldn't rag on you. That would suck for me, so I'm against. Stay safe! :)

Btw, the comment you're responding to? It's from someone who normally attacks us. Yes, that's right, it's someone on your side of the debate who posted that as an exaggeration pretending to be one of the people who support us.

That's hilarious if I was responding to a sarcastic comment. That doesn't change the thrust of my point though, which is that your loyal crew seem to be internet thugs, toughs, and hooligans.
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Yes Man, 12 Sep 2011 @ 12:54pm

Re: Re: Re:
"Btw, the comment you're responding to? It's from someone who normally attacks us. Yes, that's right, it's someone on your side of the debate who posted that as an exaggeration pretending to be one of the people who support us."

I'm with you here Mike. You have his IP address and that of other of his posts. It's all you really need to conclude that the guy who posted is from the "other side". And while it's not infallible, I'd wager you're can be almost 100% certain that your assertion is correct. Funny how when the government or a rightsholder uses an IP address to make an assertion you convulse in protests, sidetracking and excuse making. Your hypocrisy is truly breathtaking to behold. What an embarrassing douchenozzle you are.
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Dementia (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:01pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Wouldn't that mean they would have to actually KNOW it first? I for one, while interested in the fact that Mike does actually pay attention to the IP addresses posts are coming from, have no interest in actually knowing what those IP addresses actually are.
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Dementia (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:02pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
And your response kind of indicates he was right.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:09pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
It does point out the need to use something like Tor when visiting Techdirt. It's a real shame. I haven't used Tor in years, but the way Mike is now revealing information about his detractors gleaned from the IP addresses, I see no other choice. Mike won't respect his users' privacy, so his users need to take their privacy into their own hands. It is hypocritical. Of course he'll deny this, but that's a given.
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freak (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:33pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Well, it doesn't take a genius to compare these two cases.

1) The difference between the evidence:
Mike, comparing IP addresses to other IP addresses on techdirt. RIAA/MPAA comparing IP addresses to real people.

Now, to find out whether two IP addresses represent the same person, we have a variety of tools. First, we can look at whether they are the same. Mike can check the internet browser they use, some of its settings, which OS they use, etc. etc. If all of those match, it's a fairly close bet it's the same person. If this matching occurs again and again, you've probably identified someone.
Mike can also, humanly, compare the posts & writing styles, or run those through mechanical analysis to boot.
There aren't many false positives, since two people would pretty much have to be running the same setup, using the same software, and same software versions, and the same TOR exit node, in order to match each other.

To find out whether a single IP address represents real life person, we only have the comparison to an IP address that was assigned to a machine at the time. Those logs aren't always correct, we have to be concerned about proxys and TOR exit nodes, (whereas in Mike's case, we don't care since we're comparing an unknown identity to an unknown identity, here we're matching a real identity to a unknown), but we also have to be concerned with which machine was being used at the user-end, (the machine connected to the router may have been connected to another machine which used the connection), and who was using the machine; In a roommate situation, this usually proves impossible if they deny it.

Summary: Matching two unknown entities is easier than matching an unknown entity to a real person. This is true not only of the internet, but also of real life. We can tell if two break-in cases or two murder cases were committed by the same person/people; But we have great difficulty finding out who that person/people are.

2) Mike isn't charging someone in court, he's accusing them on his blog. He isn't accusing them of a crime, even, just of being someone on his blog who regularly comments negatively. We ask a much smaller burden of proof, (ie: We don't ask innocent until PROVEN guilty), because the consequences . . . are barely existent here. Fining or arresting the wrong person? Rather larger.
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freak (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:37pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
He hasn't revealed much. All he's revealed is that 'this comment maker has commented before, negatively'.

If you had said: "I'm concerned that Mike is viewing this information", maybe I'd have some sympathy, but complaing that Mike is revealing that this particular user, who we still aren't able to identify unless Mike points him out again and references this post in that pointing out, has posted before? Yeah, that totally rips that AC's privacy to shreds.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:47pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
I don't care if Mike looks at IP addresses. I've never covered my tracks because I don't care.

But lately Mike is looking at the IPs and posting some of what he finds to discredit his critics. You may think this is OK, but I don't. I think it's a complete violation of trust, and I think Mike has crossed a line by doing this. I think it's total bullshit.

When I find time I'll reinstall Tor and start using that for this site.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 1:58pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
The keywords there, since you wrote them but apparently missed them somehow, are for the purpose of an indictment or civil action.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:09pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Due process, have you heard of it? Apparently you feel that courts should be held to the same standard as internet comments or is it the reverse?
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Jay (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:13pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
" IP address alone is insufficient to create a link to an individual for the purpose of an indictment or civil action."

Funny thing...

Europe has an issue with data privacy. I wonder how you would feel if an IP address was found to be linked to "improper use of the internet".

Oh, right, profits must be paid...

M-A-X-I-M-A-L-I-S-T
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freak (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:30pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"posting some of what he finds to discredit his critics."

I'm sorry, but if someone can point at two posts, and without saying anything else, can say, "the same person wrote these two posts", discredit someone?

Further, tell me exactly who, and how to identify them in future posts, Mike has discredited?

What, you can't tell me how to identify AC in the future?

And further again, who is he discrediting here? He said that the person who wants to murder people has posted negatively before; He's discrediting the person who wants to murder people? By saying that person has posted here before? Run that by me again?

Is it possible that you are referring to Mike discrediting you because he made a statement that you cannot confirm/deny that directly contradicts the statement you made to try to discredit and shame Mike and some of the commenters here?

Of course, if you feel discredited by that, that means you made a statement you could not prove in the first place, and are upset that Mike has pointed this out.

So I'll presume intelligence on your part, in that I'll presume you are not the one being discredited here, and ask you again, exactly who is?
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freak (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:32pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
That first bit, I cut myself off mid-thought:

I'm sorry, but if Mike can point at two posts, and without saying anything else, can say, "the same person wrote these two posts", discredit someone, is that actually Mike discrediting the person? Or the person discrediting himself? Mike here isn't even going that far, but only saying "this person has commented negatively before".
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Rikuo (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:40pm

Re: Re: Re: Am I missing something
A contract that no-one sees and no-one signs cannot be a legally binding contract.
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JMT (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:44pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"But lately Mike is looking at the IPs and posting some of what he finds to discredit his critics. You may think this is OK, but I don't. I think it's a complete violation of trust, and I think Mike has crossed a line by doing this."

Oh geez, cry me a frickin' river you big baby! That's about the lamest complaint I've ever heard. I'm afraid people who are too chicken to have their comments linked together while still remaining completely anonymous don't generate any sympathy from me. If someone has issues with trusting Mike they're quite welcome to stop posting comments. It'll be a nice win-win situation.

"When I find time I'll reinstall Tor and start using that for this site."

I can picture you donning your tinfoil hat at the same time.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 2:49pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
It's not hard to understand. Mike can see the IP addresses. What he sees, he should keep to himself. Instead, he points out how one AC is a usual critic. A couple of days ago, he pointed out how another AC was from D.C. That's not right. He can look at the IPs all he wants. But as soon as he reveals publicly anything he's gleaned from those IPs, he's crossed a line. That's absolutely wrong.

Anyway, I've got Tor fired up and I will be using it from now on. Shame on you Pirate Mike for not practicing what you preach. I think you're a slimball for exactly this type of bullshit.
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Some Guy, 12 Sep 2011 @ 3:03pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Actually, a couple of days ago, he did not point out how another AC was from D.C. If you paid attention, and I am not going to go get the exact quote to copy/paste it here, what I believe Mike said was something along the lines of "you'd be surprised how many IP addresses in these comments are from the D.C. area". He did not single out any one specific person, nor group of people. You're misstating what he did say in order to further your own agenda, whatever it may be. To me, putting words in someone's mouth is much more wrong than what Mike did, which wasn't that big a deal to begin with.

In fact, from what Mike did say that day, I made the assumption on my own, that perhaps the reason so many IP addresses were from the D.C. area was because perhaps people with vested interest in discrediting Mike are working in tangent or at the behest of others to comment here. And do so more often when certain topics are discussed or brought up. But like I said, that was an assumption on my part that may or may not be true. But it does make a bit of sense.

We're glad you've got Tor fired up and will continue using it. It'd be a shame to not know who one of the many Anonymous Cowards who visit this site to insult and berate others (and Mike) is. Not that we care who you are to begin with.

May I make a suggestion to you, AC? Why don't you get off your cross, use the wood to build a bridge and get over it. ("It" being whatever it is you're complaining about in regards to Mike at the moment. Since "it" changes frequently and depending on your mood or whatnot, it seems.)
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freak (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 3:12pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Personally, I just assumed that a lot of people who are interested in such policies live in the capital. Either because they moved there because they were interested, or that it was hard not to be interested when constantly inundated with politics.

Up here, we have a lot of political pundits and critics living in Ottawa, what a surprise . . .
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Michael, 12 Sep 2011 @ 3:18pm

Re: Re:
and soon we'll be coming for YOU.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 3:36pm

Re: Re: Re:
There is no limit to how low IP maximists will stoop to support their agenda.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 3:42pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"I think it's a complete violation of trust"

Simply mentioning that the comment came from an IP maximist is not a violation of trust. It hardly reveals anything.

What is a violation of trust is when IP maximsits pose as IP critics in order to make IP critics look bad.

But, of course, your sense of morality tells you to only focus on Mike for doing nothing wrong and to ignore, and not to take the initiative and criticize, what the IP maximist did (ie: without being nudged by this comment here). The IP maximist did something wrong, but you don't care enough to say anything. Your only focus is on the IP critic for doing nothing wrong.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 3:45pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
(and the people who do this are the same people writing our laws. They're the same people saying that IP is good. They're the same people responsible for maintaining and expanding IP laws. ABOLISH IP!!!! These laws are oppressive and they exist only because sociopaths with no regard for morality want them to).
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crashsuit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 4:24pm

Wow
You must be SO PROUD that you managed to wedge such a huge stick up your ass.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 5:10pm

Re: Re: Re:
As opposed to the people who have called for my death, regularly lied about me, attacked me and my family?

Seriously? Death threats? Care to provide a link or is this something known only to you?

Btw, the comment you're responding to? It's from someone who normally attacks us. Yes, that's right, it's someone on your side of the debate who posted that as an exaggeration pretending to be one of the people who support us.

While that sort of masquerade is a dirty trick, your willingness to assert this individual is one and the same based (presumably) by IP address makes a mockery of your objection to identifying an infringer by IP address. I think you are probably right about the identity of your detractor playing games but you really have damaged your credibility regarding correlating IP address to individual identity.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 5:38pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
There is a difference between identifying a file sharer (who likely wants to cover his tracks) based only on an IP address alone and between identifying the future posts of someone who previously posted on some blog.

Unlikely coincidence that someone else hijacked this persons IP address just to post on Techdirt, the same exact blog that the person who has been hijacked just so happens to post on. Furthermore, unlikely that the person who posted has the same 'attack IP critics' mentality and writing style that this poster has.

Also (though this probably can't be said so much for IP maximists) the people who post on Techdirt and other tech related blogs tend to be tech savvy and computer security conscious, so it's less likely that someone who posts on such blogs has security issues and would be unknowingly hacked.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2011 @ 5:43pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
(and by, 'attack IP critics' mentality, I mean that it's unlikely for the person who hacked this persons IP address to say something that criticizes or effectively derails IP critics when that's exactly what the original poster just so happens to do. So this person isn't being identified by one thing alone, they're being identified by many things).

Also, there is a difference between being able to casually identify someone and being able to identify them with enough certainty to fine them a ton of money.
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Thomas (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 6:41pm

Really amazing...
that you can suborn justice by simply getting one of your shills to become a judge. Is there any court in the nation left where judges aren't...on the take? The RIAA/MPAA doesn't need to worry about judges' rulings; they just pay to get the ruling they want.
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techflaws.org (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:15pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Thanks for proving his point.
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techflaws.org (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:16pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Actually it totally does. The only thugs are your ilk, sueing the life out of people with outrages sums for sharing songs worth 99 cents.
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techflaws.org (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:26pm

Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
That falsehood sets the tone here.

Wow, you couldn't describe your own posts better than that.
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wvhillbilly (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:34pm

Lobbyist for the RIAA?
She was a lobbyist for the RIAA? Judging copyright cases? A very big conflict of interest, indeed.

I guess next they'll start suing people for infringement for playing copyrighted music at a private party or watching copyrighted movies with friends over.

I wonder... are private letters now covered by copyright, seeing anything reduced to any kind of fixed medium (baby scribbles on the wall) is automatically copyright? You can be sued for infringement for reading a letter from your mum?

Yes, I'm being sarcastic.
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wvhillbilly (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 10:42pm

Re: Re:
But who says they will only award the minimum in a default? He/she might just let go with one of those $150K rounds, or maybe a $1.5M daisy cutter. Remember Jammie Thomas?
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The eejit (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:09pm

Re: Re: Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
You clearly missed the part where Judge Howell ordered the payment of attorney fees.
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wvhillbilly (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:16pm

Re: Re:
Ah but you don't understand. These lawyers charge $3000 an hour for their services. >:(

(Sarcasm)
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Karl (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:38pm

Re: Re: Re:
I believe that Mike knows that the $200 damages for innocent infringement are not even a possibility here as a matter of law, but he throws that in anyway to deepen the FUD.

"Innocent infringement" can (but usually won't) be decided by a judge, even in default judgement cases. It's rare, but it does happen.

It is slightly less rare (but not by any means unheard of) for judges to award statutory damages, but not attorney's fees.

The fact that it is a default judgement probably determined damages more than anything else. Judges don't like to be ignored.

This whole article is just plain FUD, Karl. I don't know how you could consider it to be anything but.

Perhaps because I'm not paid to do so.

I agree that the article might be a bit alarmist. That's certainly debatable. What is not debatable is that Mike has never, once, advocated piracy, so claiming he is a "pirate apologist" or calling him "Mike the Pirate" is absolutely, positively spreading FUD.

You know, when you do this stupid name-calling bullshit, everyone can see right through it. You would really be much better off sticking to the facts.
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Karl (profile), 12 Sep 2011 @ 11:41pm

Re: Re: Re: PaulT, prim schoolmarm.
By the way, I seem to have suppressed a certain Techdirt "Insider" from making bizarre sexual references here

Are you one of the guys who down-voted the bullshit A.C. post about the judge fucking animals, or whatever?

If so, then you have my thanks, at least. Whatever disagreements we have about her, there's no need for /b/tard tactics.

Of course, I still suspect it was posted by the other side trying to make Techdirt look bad... but I have absolutely no evidence to back up this suspicion.
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Karl (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 12:00am

Agent provocateurs...?
Hey, Mike... Can you set my mind at ease about something?

When this story first was posted, there were a couple of rather extreme comments about the judge. I didn't like them, and apparently nobody else did either, because they were quickly downvoted.

In response to one of them, I posted a link to Wikipedia's page about "agent provacateurs." It was kind of a joke. But now I'm not so sure that it actually is a joke.

My reasoning:

1. The posts are all anonymous.

2. They are completely out of character for this site, even among Techdirt's most vehement supporters. (We may use salty language, and we may get a little hot under the collar, but none of us are obsessed about our opponents' dalliances with non-human fauna.)

3. The usual A.C. detractors used these commenters to paint the entire site in these colors. They did so within minutes of the other A.C.s' posts. And at least according to one A.C., that has a political consequence:

Sorry, these kinds of posts are generally taken a face value by legislative staffs who monitor the discussion of proposed bills.

Could those obnoxious A.C. douchebags actually be people who are working for the other side (literally or metaphorically)?

And before anyone gets their panties in a bunch - no, I'm not talking about all Anonymous Cowards, or even most of them. I've had plenty of good discussions on this site with A.C.'s, even those I completely disagree with.
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Karl (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 12:09am

Re: Re: Re:
Yes, that's right, it's someone on your side of the debate who posted that as an exaggeration pretending to be one of the people who support us.

Wow. I missed this comment.

I guess I have my answer. It's an agent provocateur, deliberately trying to make this site look bad, in order to discredit the opinions of the site expressly for the purposes of political gain.

I actually was thinking I might be paranoid. Apparently not.

On the plus side: Mike, your opponents are obviously running scared. That's good news.

Pity it isn't better news: that they actually listened to what you have to say. Oh, well.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 12:11am

Re: Re: Re:
No one said that and it was my point - the case law is not mature in this area (I'm talking narrowly about mass p2p cases). That's why I think that this decision is more good than bad, because when precedent base is being built, every such decision is rather a win.

But of course no one can guarantee you anything, and at this moment in history knowingly allowing default to be brought on oneself is stupid.

Sorry for not being clear.
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Karl (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 12:17am

Re: Agent provocateurs...?
Mike somewhat confirmed this theory before I even posted this comment... sorry about that.
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 12:54am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"It shouldn't be a surprise that people had careers in the private sector before becoming judges or senior policy people. "

Since you're too stupid to understand the point I'll repeat it:

Having a career prior to being a judge is not a problem. Being a lobbyist for an industry prior to judging cases for that exact industry is a conflict of interest. I'd be saying the same thing for your "Googlers" too if they were expected to make important policy that directly favoured Google, but that's not what's being discussed.
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 12:57am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
"H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-E"

M-O-R-O-N

Mike is simply noting a correlation between one idiot who attacks him and another account with the same IP address. He's not looking for reparations, nor banning the IP, as he could do.

Unlike your corporate Gods, he's not looking for legal sanctions, where the standard of evidence should be much higher.
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 1:00am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"the way Mike is now revealing information about his detractors"

He's noting that a moron troll is the same moron troll who regularly attacks him. No personal information has been released.

Your privacy is safe, except for the fact that we now know that you too are a moron.
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 1:03am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
"Funny how when the government or a rightsholder uses an IP address to make an assertion you convulse in protests, sidetracking and excuse making."

Is Mike's decision legally binding? Is he trying to cut the troll's internet connection, delete his URLs or fine him hundreds of thousands of dollars? Is he even trying to block the IP address, as he's entitled to do on his own blog? No? Then you have your reason why it's not a contradictory position.

"Your hypocrisy is truly breathtaking to behold."

Hmmmm.... funny how you're using the same arguments as the AC idiots....

"What an embarrassing douchenozzle you are."

...and using their kindergarten name calling tactics as well. I suppose congratulations are in order for finally giving yourself a handle.
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 1:20am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"A couple of days ago, he pointed out how another AC was from D.C. That's not right."

Citation?

"Anyway, I've got Tor fired up and I will be using it from now on."

Will you also be using some software that enables you to discuss issues like an adult?

"I think you're a slimball for exactly this type of bullshit."

I think you're a moron and full of shit. I think you're incapable of formulating an actual argument and can't possibly comprehend the issues being discussed, so you resort to insults (which you can't even spell correctly).

But, unlike your masters, I'm not trying to take away from your ability to do such things. I only wish you understood what an idiot you look like.
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 1:34am

Re: Re: Re:
Here's the problem with your arguments. You start with an assumption:

"I believe that Mike knows that the $200 damages for innocent infringement are not even a possibility here as a matter of law"

You don't state what this is based on, you have no proof. It is an assertion that's based on an opinion. But then, you parley that into a further assumption:

"but he throws that in anyway to deepen the FUD"

You then launch into a tireade as if both of these assumptions are the correct, unvarnished and unmistakable truth, yet they're not. They're simply your own personal opinions.

Until you stop basing everything on your own assumptions, fail to take input from others and quit the childish name calling, your opinion is invalid.

"Who needs facts when you've got FUD?"

Your family motto, I presume?
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PaulT (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 1:42am

Re: Re: Re: Mike's title is FALSE.
"YES, if you had READ Mike's post, you'd see that he states attorney's fees are optional: "

Really, so what part of the article states that? I could only see the following:

"Judge Howell has apparently decided that the absolute minimum anyone could pay (is) $3,430, which is the $750 amount plus another $2,680 in lawyer's fees."

and:

"That's a bit strange since it's not all that common to award attorney's fees in such cases"

Could you point out what I missed, since you seem to be looking at words I'm not seeing?
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Sep 2011 @ 2:45am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Sorry, these kinds of posts are generally taken a face value by legislative staffs who monitor the discussion of proposed bills.

Sorry, [citation needed].
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Mike Masnick (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 3:12am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
It's not hard to understand. Mike can see the IP addresses. What he sees, he should keep to himself. Instead, he points out how one AC is a usual critic. A couple of days ago, he pointed out how another AC was from D.C.

Why do you lie? I've asked you REPEATEDLY to point out which AC I said was from DC. And you can't. Because I did not.

So, seriously, stop lying.

Anyway, I've got Tor fired up and I will be using it from now on. Shame on you Pirate Mike for not practicing what you preach. I think you're a slimball for exactly this type of bullshit

I have absolutely practiced what I've preached.

You're going around lying falsely claiming that I revealed someone's location when I did not.

The only slimeball here is you.
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Sep 2011 @ 4:22am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"Sorry, these kinds of posts are generally taken a face value by legislative staffs who monitor the discussion of proposed bills."

Sorry, [citation needed].

You're right to question this. I doubt that this is true. People should feel free to assert that judges accept money in exchange for rulings and have group sex with dogs. No way that sort of stuff would color an outsider's perception of the people who frequent this site.
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Sep 2011 @ 4:48am

Re:
We could always get Ted K released and let him do his thing...since it appears his method is now in demand (he was right about corporate greed running government).
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 5:08am

Re:
Mike, AC comments should show their IP at the time of comment posting. Like wikipedia of sorts... I'd love to implement some kind of UserCheck ;)
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 5:27am

Re: Re: Re:
These sorts of psychotic comments about murdering the so-called "corrupt" and Judge Howell and beastiality only reveal to lawmakers the character and mental state of opponents to reasonable copyright measures. Thanks Mike for hosting a forum where true substance of the opposition can be put on full display.

You, sir (ma'am?), disgust me. Taking an AC comment (anonymous, probably written by the same shill-machine you in/directly work for) and putting yourself on the same anonymous pedestal just to drop a few of fallacies here? And doing it anonymously? Disgusting...

Analogy:
Lawyers like Evan Stone only reveal to voters the character and mental state of proponents to unreasonable copyright measures. Thanks Mike for hosting a forum where true substance of the copyright proposition can be put on full display.
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 6:58am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Now this is an unrefutable answer. Too bad "D.C. area" just likes to post the same debunked questions again and again and doesn't care for answers.

It's how U.S. media transformed from "fact reporting" to "balanced opinions" - who needs truth if most of people you reach believe a convenient lie. Your people aren't stupid enough? Scare 'em stupid! Proclaim war against invisible enemies and voila - your own people will start behaving like sheep. It's simple and tested - testing shit abroad and implementing it at home like real Chicago Boys. ;)
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 7:09am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
I don't think Mike has opponents :) In my view, common sense and valuing arguments proximity to truth is his only "crime".

Let me elaborate - when people resort to dirty tactics like this (agent provocateur) it's ussualy bacause their arguments have no or little standing in reality and as we all know - what better way to hide the truth than discrediting its speaker. It's how a lot of our written history got falsified (and you can't do sh*t about it). But this manipulation got a lot more difficult in the Internet age - finding sockpuppets is a lot easier since you're just connecting identities, not revealing them.
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 7:13am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
rated R? what is that? :> Where I live we have rating "You are not allowed to watch this!" and the system is called Parenting.
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 7:28am

Re: Re: Re: PaulT, prim schoolmarm.
Could you explain this oxymoron freetard? Am I a retard because I want and get information for free? Or because I copy and give it away (i.e. share) for free?

I found some explanations on Urban Dictionary and if you'll take the time and follow the link - which definitions do you agree with and which do you not?
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bratwurzt (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 7:39am

Re: Re:
exactly - discrediting Mike won't change my mind. I mean - my views are similar to his but that is it. He's just one man - owner of this blog.
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That Anonymous Coward (profile), 13 Sep 2011 @ 8:37pm

Re: Re: Re:
Jammie Thomas is an aberration for a few reasons.

The RIAA claimed on the stand, and was not called on, that the act of ripping a CD was violating the law in their mind.

Jammie conveniently had a new hard drive installed in the machine, and then denied having done so.

It was a jury trial, where all of these "experts" were called upon to testify. Feelings were admitted as law, the instructions were bad, and the defendant changed her story early and often.

Even if it were possible that she were innocent in all of this, she set into motion a long series of actions that showed her as someone who was guilty.

The problem currently with the Tennebaum (sp) and Thomas cases is they are both arguing the damage awards are unconstitutional, the problem is neither one of them is that likeable to the average person. Tennebaum told the open court, yeah I did it... and? Thomas devastated her own case by her own actions and speech.

The average person does not think some 15 yr old who downloads a Bieber song to their iPod should have to pay $150,000... but that is the law of the land. The law was written for a time when then only people who might "pirate" things were people doing it for profit. To deny rightholders of income by putting out the copies of the material and diverting the cash to themselves. Now we have a system that refuses to catch up to the times, and infact has become more draconian acting that if you share something you have killed a baby seal...on national television...during a kids show...

The simple answer would be for the "fine" for noncommercial filesharing to be the cost of the item. This would free the courts up for more serious matters than large scale fishing trips, and the labels would have to actually adapt their business model to get consumers to stop sharing.

There will always be people sharing, but you can make it work for you. Or you can waste all of your time trying to get those darn kids who are downloading taken care of while you annoy your customers to the point where they understand the label has no interest in making them happy and its just easier and better to find other sources for the material growing the number of those darn kids. There are less restrictions and hassles with whats being shared than with purchased content. It is not always all about wanting it for free, sometimes its just wanting it free of the crap attached to it.
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Anonymous Coward, 18 Sep 2011 @ 7:44am

The labels see this as a more profitable approach than pushing the artists songs that suck. Just put the songs up online and wait for the fish to bite. They are so transfixed on this that in the future the disproportionate labels siding with this approach to profiteering will no longer be deemed worthy of talented artists' time.
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Dark Helmet (profile), 19 Sep 2011 @ 2:00pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: PaulT, prim schoolmarm.
"Are you one of the guys who down-voted the bullshit A.C. post about the judge fucking animals, or whatever?"

No, no, ootb the pole smoking penis wang is referring to me. He apparently thinks I've somehow stopped making phalic related jokes, but he must have cocks on the mind because I'm as committed to mentioning man-sausages as ever.
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Marcus Carab (profile), 21 Sep 2011 @ 10:51am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Yeah, you're right - it was probably a Techdirt supporter spoofing his IP to pose as a Techdirt detractor posing as a Techdirt supporter. Occam's Razor at work, everyone!
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