Congress Decides To Ignore Privacy Concerns, Refuses To Even Consider Key CISPA Amendments

from the major-failure dept

Thu, Apr 26th 2012 7:29am — Mike Masnick

Remember how we said that there were a few key amendments that were necessary to make CISPA even close to palatable? Yeah, well, the ~~House Intelligence Committee~~ House Rules Committee issued its rules for the House debate over CISPA... and basically barred the discussion on all of those key amendments. In other words, for all the talk of how they knew they had to make changes and were willing to compromise and come to a real solution? Yeah, it seems like that was all for show.

Amazingly, CDT, who had been a major player fighting against CISPA had backed off its opposition on Tuesday, believing that the authors of CISPA really were willing to negotiate some changes in good faith. This fact was trumpeted by supporters of the bill to show "proof" that they were listening to constructive ideas. However, by barring the consideration of these amendments, they've shown their true colors. CDT is back to fully opposing the bill.

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Filed Under: cdt, cispa, cybersecurity, house intelligence committee

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Jeff (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:33am

Double dog dare you!!
You are seeing the pointles futility of our political system at its finest. Because the White House said - "We'll veto CISPA in any form" the House is now attempting to call their bluff. It would be funny watching morons calling each other names, but sadly this could then become law (if the house manages to get enough to overcome a veto). In the end, we get what we deserve - we elect morons thinking that somehow the cluebird will magically land on their shoulder and whisper the answers... what ends up happening is the moron is elected the cluebird shits on them in disgust, and the moron then does what ever their corporate paymasters tell them to do...

I believe if George Orwell and Franz Kalfka got together and tried to write out their worst nightmares... even they would blush when taking in how thoroughly corrupt and utterly disconnected and useless our system has become.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:51am
  
  Re: Double dog dare you!!
  Saying that White House advisors recommend veto and actually vetoing a bill are two different things. It's hard to imagine an election year veto of this bill. Look for final passage in the lame duck session.
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- MonkeyFracasJr (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:15am
  
  Re: "...we elect morons..."
  As if we have a choice.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:24am
    
    Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
    As if we have a choice.
    
    Google "French Revolution" and learn.
    
    Then get back to us.
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    - Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:28am
      
      Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
      Google History of the USA -- One Independence war and one civil war isn't enough for you?
      
      (I can't believe I have to point this out, since I'm not even an American)
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      - :Lobo Santo (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:33am
        
        Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        "One Independence war and one civil war isn't enough for you?"
        Obviously not, since those in charge keep pulling the same bullshit which necessitated the previous wars...
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        Rob, 26 Apr 2012 @ 10:19am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        And the French Revolution stopped Sarzoky from getting in office. Got it.
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        Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 1:20pm
        
        Re: Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        LOL! Revolution? Besides indefinitely imprisoning anyone they want; if its too much hassle to send some guys with automatic assault rifles over to arrest you, they'll just dispatch a drone to murder you. They've done it overseas and now that they're working on the legals for bringing drones home, its only a matter of time before a "terrorist" in the homeland gets a drone's missile up their ass. The second amendment won't help us once robotics really get established and the gov't doesn't have to worry about human soldiers refusing to shoot their fellow Americans. "Amendments" to CISPA is just a dog and pony show- just enough to placate everyone while they finalize their plans for the NWO. They have all your phone transmissions, now they'll have all your other communications too. One more checkmark on the list:
        
        Ability to Indefinitely jail anyone for anything that can be possibly labelled terror: Check
        Ability to declare martial law during time of peace: Check
        Ability to spy on all telephone communications: Check
        Ability to spy on all digital communications: Working on it! Available soon!
        Ability to spy on all physical movements of people: Working on it! Available soon!
        Have the perfect soldier who will never think for themselves or question orders: Not complete, but available!
        Slavery: Soon!
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    - E. Zachary Knight (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:35am
      
      Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
      The French Revolution is not really the ideal example to use. Those were some very bloody times for France and just about every time, they traded one tyrant for another. Thus sparking yet another revolution.
      
      On the other hand, the US currently has the ability to change the way government works, or at least who runs the government. Unfortunately, those willing to replace those in office are in a minority making the extremely difficult to accomplish widespread revolution.
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      - Lord Binky, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:22am
        
        Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        Unfortunately those smart enough to provide good replacements for those in office can get a much better job elsewhere.
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        Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 11:18am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        Smart people also don't do well running for office because they tend not to want to resort to the hyperbolic unsupported impassioned bullshit that it takes to get elected.
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    - MonkeyFracasJr (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:47am
      
      Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
      Yes there are alternatives to accepting the system as it is.
      
      I only meant there is no one to choose to vote for who is not or is not likely to become a moron once in office.
      
      I do not see how we as citizens will be able to effect substantial change with out some substantial revolution.
      
      I don't know where the tipping point is but it doesn't look like the majority of the populace is near that point.
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      - Lord Binky, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:28am
        
        Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        I remember a study that showed power really does make someone stupid. The choices made by the participents when being told their role was supervisor or employee, changed significantly from listening to details to ignoring them. Just thinking they were in charge made people dumber.
        
        Really though, You don't need the guy in charge to be a genius, just smart enough to employ and listen to the guy that's a genius. The trick is to get rid of the guy in charge before he starts to think he IS the genius.
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        Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 11:19am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        We need a smart enough populace to not fall for political bullshit. If half of the country was smart enough to question the news and actually research the shit they believe we wouldn't have these issues.
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        Jay (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 11:29am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Off course you have a choice. Grow some!
        Why do you think most politicians are attacking students and teachers with less pay? For the most part, an informed population is anathema to what most politicians want.
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- gorehound (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:47am
  
  Re: Double dog dare you!!
  Thinking a Revolution will occur eventually.It will not be pretty.
  Every Empire rises and it falls.Look at how long it took Rome to really Rise and then to fall into Dark Ages.
  All the Empires only go for so long until they are either overthrown or they change.
  We do live in a very twisted Political Climate which is kind of like a Plutocracy yet you do cast a Democracy in Voting.
  Is there such a thing as a Plutocratic Democracy ?
  
  These assholes will never control the Internet !!!
  Hope they get what they deserve.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:21pm
    
    Re: Re: Double dog dare you!!
    How's the Maine Pirate Party coming? Is it doing as well as Step 2 or the Insight Community?
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:40am

I've decided
to ignore the us congress.
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- :Lobo Santo (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:54am
  
  Re: I've decided
  I've been generally ignoring them for years, they don't seem to care--as they as they get to keep playing in their make-believe world.
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  - MonkeyFracasJr (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:18am
    
    Re: make believe world
    It would be easier if their make-believe world did not impinge upon the real world.
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- John Fenderson (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 10:29am
  
  Re: I've decided
  "Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you." -- Pericles
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:48am

I wonder if the supple spine demonstrated by CDT was due to the money they receive from Google and the other tech firms supporting this bill. If it's so bad, I'd have thought CDT, PK and EFF would have gone SOPA on them instead of posting a wishy-washy statement on their website.
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Fighter Fei (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:54am

What's the point of a "democracy" if the very system put in place to serve the public can ignore the public's dissent toward any law that it wants to pass. Forget reform. All branches of the government have sidestepped the single most valuable asset the public has against it: Fear. A government should fear its people. Ours, quite clearly, does not. As it systematically vandalizes or outright ignores the very checks and balances put in place against it. And we let it happen.
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- bradykp (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:20am
  
  Re: that's the difference between...
  the U.S. and many European countries. Our people fear our government, whereas, the French Government fears the people. Our government does things to keep people comfortably fearful, like give just enough money for people to get food stamps, pathetic education, and other welfare assistance, but not quite enough to lift themselves up out of poverty or the middle class. Keep us comfortable so we don't revolt. Good strategy on their parts. Seems to work.
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- E. Zachary Knight (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:41am
  
  Re:
  The reason the government does not fear the people is because it has spent the last 100+ years carefully eroding the ability of the voting populace to make informed decisions when it comes to public policies and elections.
  
  Frankly it is sad.
  
  Just to help illustrate this point from a state perspective, Oklahoma has 101 house seats. This year all 101 seats are up for election. Last week, registration for candidacy closed. 51 of the 101 seats are uncontested. Of the 50 left, about half of those will be decided in the primary leaving only 25 give or take to actually show up on the November ballot.
  
  If we cannot even get 101 people to challenge those in office, how are we going to get the necessary 50+% of the US population to vote out every member of congress and the president?
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:55am

EFF Online petition opposing CISPA
Here is a link to an E.F.F. on line petition opposing CISPA.

https://wfc2.wiredforchange.com/o/9042/p/dia/action/public/?action_KEY=8444
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 7:59am

Republicans in the house are going to blindly vote CISPA through simply because Obama announced he's going to veto it, and because it's a bill about cyber security.

That kind of reflexively opposing something just because the other party supports it happens all the time. Look at Obamacare, it's almost word for word the EXACT same thing as the republican healthcare plan of the 1990's, including the Individual Mandate, all intended as free market way to fix the problems with America's health care system. Then Obama supported it, and suddenly the 1990 republican healthcare plan became evil big government socialism.

And democrats have had their share of flip flops over the years to simply because Bush suddenly decided to support something.
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- weneedhelp (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:19am
  
  Re:
  Children. Thats the same shit kids do. Sad. We are doomed.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:51am
  
  Re:
  Once again are you refering to "HillaryCare" which was a Democrate created and supported Health Care Bill which was the Healthcare bill of the 90's with and Individual Mandate... (and is one of the items that cause the Repub Revolution in the house and Senate/and thus cause the Democrate Take Over in the 2000's, plus Bush's Moneky Like awareness)
  Ill give you they both flip flop and oppose each other, but at least be honest about it
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:01am

America doesn't have a congress. It's owned by corporatists. But again, Americans are going to vote for the same people. Because we always vote incumbents in. Because we are confused and distracted by Big Media.
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- Fanic, 26 Apr 2012 @ 11:04am
  
  Re:
  I have a question for you. Who exactly are we suppose to vote in? Everyone I see on the ballets are the same, while they have a different party stamped to them they are all attached to "corporatists". The only way I see anything changing is if everyone in the nation writes in a name and gets someone in there that is not from the current political pool. People vote simply because they are told to(and because it makes them feel like they have a choice, I know foolish right?), but who they vote for does not actually matter because it is basically the same.
  
  The way the nation functions now is just a morbidly twisted and obfuscated way it use to work. We lost the true meaning of voting and the politicians lost what the true meaning of being a politicians is.
  
  I will give you a hint people vote for someone who shares there same beliefs/views and politicians are the voice of there people. But I do not see the politicians going around there state asking there people what they should do they just broker back door deals and ask for money from a company and then pass the companies agenda through.
  
  /rant
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Alan Smithee, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:27am

Choose words carefully
It may be nit-picky, but there's a difference between "The Congress" and the "House". Conflating the two only confuses the discussion, and the real problem here is in the House.

And fwiw: don't worry about the House overriding a veto. It won't happen. You would need a 2/3 majority in both the House and the Senate, and the will to override a veto by that margin exists in neither chamber.

/rant
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:50am
  
  Re: Choose words carefully
  It seems like the right way to deal with this is to make it so that all votes have to be 2/3 majority in the House and the Senate, and to override a veto it should be a 7/8 majority. That way only the awesomely popular stuff would make it through and it would keep either of the two parties that have a strong majority from controlling everything.
  
  Honestly, I kid. There is no right way to deal with it. Our form of government is a failure. It didn't work. It's time to try something else. The only thing that I can see even remotely working would be to ban anyone from contributing money to any politician or political candidate, giving the jobs of representing the people to those that don't want the job, and barring anyone who has represented us in the past from working at a corporation who has had a stake in any bills that the politician voted yes to while in office. That might stem corruption to a manageable point at the least.
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  - Monkey With Attitude, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:16am
    
    Re: Re: Choose words carefully
    The System works but for a couple of things that have changed... The press are no longer holding the Government to the fire (they seem to choose who the support and bash everyone else) and the People... People are to mired in the political parties and the Parties have pushed laws in place that basically if you want to get elected and change things you need to be in thier bed and rich. And if you run in one of the 2 big parties you get 20% of the vote no matter what (Charles Manson would get 20% because they only care about D or R, name and person mean nothing)
    
    My Example:
    Lets say I want to run for Mayor in my hometown of 1 million people. First if I am not from a major party I have to get 100,000 verified signatures (law) this will cost you about 5.00 per signature (this is one of the basic equations a Career Campaign Manager will tell you to bank on for funding). If I want to run as a major party it cost 10K to be on the ballot and various dinner parties and meetings to get them to vote on putting me on their ticket.
    
    Next you need a Campaign Manager (50K per year+ salary), Press Liason (100K+) for thier contacts or the press ignore you, Fundraiser (50-100K) to get money to pay for this crap, OH and lawyer that knows the finance law for campaigns (you get in trouble real quick if you dont, and the law is SUPER COMPLEX) plus office space, plus TV adds, plus Newspaper adds, plus a few private detectives to at least dig into your life to find potential problems (and if you want to bash, to dig into your opposition), Signs (1.00 per sign, 10K minimum buy to get the price down).... Show me the "average person" than can start to shell out the money just to start things.
    
    Then you need 60-80 hours a week (so enough money to keep you family in a house, and food, with out a salary). And this is a minimum of 6 months.
    
    All this for a Job that pays 100K per year.... but you can try and change things, but if you dont stack the council for the city in your favor, what you can do is limited or ignored. And the system will find every way to trip you up and keep change from affecting the flow that feeds them.
    
    I have worked 2 campaigns for others and 1 for myself, and mine nearly broke me (im not rich, and worked my full time job while running a small campaign for a low position)... its hard to do, and I dont blame people for not trying, but if you are going to raise hell about change you need to be willing to help out those who are trying.
    
    Sorry for the miss spells and the like I am typing this out quick...
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:51am

obamas hollywood buddies want this bill I bet he signs it.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 11:20am
  
  Re:
  ...
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- I-Blz, 26 Apr 2012 @ 11:35am
  
  Re:
  I think AC's a pretty cool guy. Eh ignors grammer and doesn't afraid of any tpyo.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 6:45pm
  
  Re:
  Actually it is the tech companies supporting this bill, not Hollywood. But don't let facts deter you.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 6:48pm
  
  Re:
  Actually it is the tech companies supporting this bill, not Hollywood. But don't let facts deter you.
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Zakida Paul (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 8:52am

This is what happens when you have people making laws on things they have no understanding of while ignoring the advice of those who do have the understanding.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:08am

This was predictable. They will pretend to want to compromise ahead of time to reduce public resistance and to prevent the public from gaining resistance and then change their mind at the last minute. It's naive of the public to fall for it, Congress has been doing these sorts of last minute changes and addendums to bills forever.

One fundamental problem problem is that once a bill in favor of the government-industrial complex has passed, it's very difficult to repeal. Once the government-industrial complex has stolen something from us, it's hard for the public to take back what's rightfully theirs. We need to change that. We need to let them know that bills can be repealed. We need to aggressively protest many of the existing laws that should be repealed and get them repealed. We need to let them know, don't keep trying to pass bad bills because just because they get passed doesn't mean they will stay passed.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:11am

I have little confidence in the American people to change their government. Government should fear us. We have the power. It isn't entirely Americans fault, the system made us all insane.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:36am

out of curiosity, is anyone promoting CISPA also on the House Rules Committee? what reasons have been given for ignoring the discussion of amendments? who on the House Rules Committee is set to gain something from pushing things without any changes?
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:49am

Oh, and for those TSA apologists who claim that the TSA itself is somehow appreciably less corruptible than the general public due to the fact that TSA applicants are subject to background checks and so they are less likely to facilitate terrorism, it should be noted that a bunch of TSA agents have been caught facilitating drug trafficking.

The TSA and those overseeing our security are ultimately made up of the body of people that they seek to find terrorists in and so some of them may also be composed of extremists who may do something crazy. This idea that creating more oversight can stop terrorists assumes that those overseeing things themselves are not terrorists.

Also see

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20101118/15134711926/tsa-likely-to-face-multiple-sexual-assa ult-charges-new-searches.shtml#comments
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- John Fenderson (profile), 26 Apr 2012 @ 10:35am
  
  Re:
  Oh, and for those TSA apologists who claim that the TSA itself is somehow appreciably less corruptible than the general public
  
  Wait, there are people who claim that???
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2012 @ 9:58am

"lemme check your asshole Sir" - Southpark TSA agent.
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