Musicians Realizing They Don't Need Major Labels Anymore
from the hello,-kickstarter dept
Music reality TV has become a key feeding ground for the major labels lately. Shows like American Idol, the Voice, X Factor and the like seem to be where the labels have been picking up some of their bigger name stars lately -- allowing the shows to help build up an initial following and then picking off the stars with typical record label deals. Except... it appears that some of those musicians are realizing that they don't need the labels any more. Jordis Unga, a singer who has appeared on two reality TV shows (Rock Star: INXS and The Voice), has decided that she doesn't need to sign a label deal. While she didn't win on either show, she did build up quite a following, and she decided that for her debut album, she might as well just hit up Kickstarter, and ask for $33,000. Which she got. In less than a day. In the first day alone her project on Kickstarter raised over $50,000.Now, perhaps some will complain that she is now beholden to her fans, but that seems a lot better than being beholden to a multinational conglomerate who claims all ownership and control of your work. Others, quite reasonably, will point out that she built up some of this following by being on two prime time network national TV shows. That's absolutely true. No one is saying that the trick to being a successful musician today is to just go on reality TV. But the point is that if you can build up a following -- in any way possible -- the need for a record label diminishes. And there are more and more and more ways to build up that audience today. If the labels aren't worried about these alternatives, they're not paying very much attention.
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Filed Under: american idol, jordis unga, reality tv, the voice, x factor
Companies: kickstarter
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Beholden huh?
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Re: Beholden huh?
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Re: Beholden huh?
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Re: Beholden huh?
** patent pending.
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Re: Beholden huh?
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Re: Beholden huh?
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Reminds me of Orange Unsigned Act
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Re: Reminds me of Orange Unsigned Act
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Elephant
They are the populist version of Kickstarter.
They raise upfront revenue from fans via the pay-to-vote system.
The format is entirely viable in a world without copyright!
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"Beholden to your fans"
A short story by TAC...
Band X started out posting videos on the internet. Their big success was being featured on The Promo Bay, where they uploaded all of their videos and previous tracks. They got international exposure and used Kickstarter to raise money for their new album and to film a "behind the scenes" special for people who donated. Band X gets triple what they sought to raise on Kickstarter.
Band X is still touring today, they lack the flash and polish and don't get the blanket radio coverage of "the big groups" and somehow are still selling out venues. They are making more than they ever would with a label, because the fee's for travel and promotion aren't being billed against any revenue they might earn in the future that have to be paid back. They stay within their means and manage to keep turning out music the fans buy. Even the weird rock opera project they worked on did ok, but was a real departure.
Band X will never be called a success by "the business".
They are making music they like, making money, and are living well. But because they don't have a big label pushing them they can't be a success.
I think alot of bands would prefer being "beholden" to their fans, instead of beholden to a corporation who is more concerned about their bottom line instead of keeping the fans engaged. Corporations who just want to own the copyrights and make sure that the corporate coffers are filled.
The dream of being a "Rock Star" where you stay in hotels, fly on your own plane around the globe, own 5 homes is long dead. Look at what happened to the big acts of yesterday. They had all of this grand "success" until the label found the new younger version of them and moved on. Then we see them living in homeless shelters and can't understand why a "rock star" is now penniless and destitute. They wrote songs that are still being used on TV and in Films... how is it they have nothing?
Success is should not be measured in how many exotic cars you can buy, it should be measured in how happy you are and if the fans are still happy with you. Bands now can make money just by being a "top band" being paid with money that should have gone to some up and coming artists... but they aren't big enough to deserve a payment for the collection society.
Music, it works alot like a ponzi scheme. The new artists have to toil long and hard to make it to the top, but it seems to come at the expense of the new acts that come after them who are trying to claw their way up to. And somewhere there are a bunch of executives in suits who will make the same if not more money no matter who the "top act" is.
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Re: "Beholden to your fans"
> you can buy, it should be measured in how happy you are
> and if the fans are still happy with you.
Another objective measure is if people will still be playing your music, um, what is it now, 90 years after you die?
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Re: Re: "Beholden to your fans"
Something tells me that the trash currently filling the airwaves won't make it past one or two at the most.
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Re: Re: "Beholden to your fans"
Hopefully they will have taken the Warren Buffet model and paid for all the education for their offspring and then left them on their own, rather than expecting something that made money decades before will support their great great grandchildren.
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Re: "Beholden to your fans"
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but, but...
Think that should give the usual trolls their prompts...
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This story is actually a good one to keep a track on as it will be interesting to see where she is in 12 months time and what level of fan interaction she has maintained.
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...not paying very much attention?
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Re:
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*cough* Idols The Netherlands, where one year, they had the people who didn't make the auditions were put on a show on the field of a large football stadium at half time of a football match.
Off key singing and showboating from the ex-contestants and whistling and booing from the audience. It was embarrassing to watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIKkUTn1Wuc
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I've seen and saved copies of some of the contracts, and could pull them if people want further reference.
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American_Idol_Contestant_Agreement.pdf
The Voice contestant contract terms
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I especially find the American Idol breach section (1st page, last paragraph) interesting, as it assumes damages done by breach of confidentiality to be $5 million!
I wonder if the leaked portion of the contract that I just read constitutes such a violation and somehow means the Network and Producers are under a $5 million damage claim?
Or are they insinuating that they have some hidden stuff, such as fixing the results outcome, that if revealed would tarnish the show's reputation (and the Netowrk/Producer)?
In that case, what exactly are they hiding?
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Or, more precisely, the multimedia enterprise run by Simon Fuller.
There's a good (though older) article about the contracts on Salon:
http://www.salon.com/2002/09/18/idol_contract/singleton/
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Re:
If they were to put that clause in the show contract for all 'talent', then what would the incentive of winning the show be?
And would the label include the less than talented talents that fall off at the beginning of the talent show?
Could get costly for $big_label.
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Not that it won't find a way to rule that an unconscionable agreement is wholly acceptable. Surely the major record labels' contract attorneys have had some success convincing judges to endorse their clients' strong-arming of naive or legally ignorant artists.
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Tony Lucca, the guy Christina Aguilera was kicking around on 'The Voice', was talking about how song selection for these shows was such a pain in the ass.
That there are only so many songs in the pool for all the different reality shows to pull from, and much of the voting is people voting for the song as much as for the performer.
The labels want them locked into contracts, but only clear a handful of "popular" songs to be allowed. These shows aren't so much about finding new talent, as they are about locking onto someone who fits a demographic and will earn them money like every other cookie cutter artist they have.
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Seeing as the talented artists don't want anything to do with the major labels, this is the method they employ --they don't have a choice. It's all about making a quick buck, not long-term investment. Right now the independent music scene is blossoming and it's only a matter of time before a new musical renaissance is ushered in, leaving the middle-man in the dust.
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This is why they hate Kickstarter, The Promo Bay, and every other service that allows artists to skip the middle-men of old. With the lots and lots of hours of content being uploaded to YouTube every minute/second (someone will remember the most recent numbers) it is harder to use that for self promotion. Then add in the flawed ContentID system weighted to believe the middle-men would NEVER claim to own what they do not. Then the secret deals they have with some middle-men going above and beyond legal requirements and unable to be questioned or seen. They are using their influence and money to slowly try and corrupt the systems that are springing up to bypass the old ways.
The internet is an amazing tool for the indies, as long as we can keep the old middle-men at bay. What once took a long time, special tools and deals, now can be done in seconds by anyone willing to grab for the brass ring.
It would be nice to see someone disrupt the "reality" tv music show bubble by putting indies out there and giving them that extra exposure they might need. I would rather see a less than polished indie on a stage than some cookie cutter singing head.
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It's 60 hours of video uploaded per minute. Which is the figure that was released and current at the time, which was around the 20th of this past January.
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As for other things such as Kickstarter and such, there really isn't anything they can do. Artists can now receive direct funding by the fans, promote themselves and do it all without the greedy mafia cartel sucking them dry. The labels' fortunes were amassed by sitting back and reaping the profits of others, doing none of the hard work themselves. Their days of rooking artists of both their work and rightful profits are coming to an abrupt end; the writing is on the wall.
Let 'em keep manufacturing their artificial 'sensations.' you know, those flavor-of-the-month, cookie-cutter, corporate-molded celebrities. They're building a house on sand and the storm is approaching ...and there isn't a single thing they can do about it.
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Copyfraud happens so very much, because the system is weighted towards the large copyright holders always being right and innocent, and anyone else is a thieving pirate stealing from them. I am willing to bet any cases that make it off the ground will just be tied up in court until the person who was wronged is out of cash or gives up.
They are spending money to buy laws and "trade agreements" to get control over anything they think is a threat, do not think they are going softly into that dark night. They are willing to pay someone off with a cushy job to slip things into legislation, a spokesman openly talks about buying off lawmakers, and they are still not being investigated.
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Just wait till 6 strikes kicks off, and see what lengths they will want to push the ISPs into. Not the first time content holders have pushed well beyond what everyone agreed to.
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They passed laws to make it ok for a Doctor to LIE to a woman about having a disease if the treatment could hurt the fetus.
They want to make women who have been raped have a probe shoved into them so they can see the "life" they want to end.
They believe the AbortionPlex is real.
They believe that their tax dollars fund abortions.
They believe that their religious beliefs are the law of the land.
While the rest of the net might fight back to avoid the cyberwar drama, these are the same geniuses who wanted a button to turn off the whole net.
I fear a large event like hackers penetrating a critical system and causing havoc will make people run to have the Government wall off our garden. Its for the children.
Afterall DHS did tell someone who detected hackers poking around in their critical systems to let them stay and keep poking around but keep and eye on them and try to stop them before something really bad happened.
With guidance like that from the people "in charge" it is merely a matter of time before something horrible happens and we get legislation that makes the Patriot Act look like a walk in the park.
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Indeed, the legal system in the US is set up such that you're treated better if you're rich and guilty than if you're poor and innocent. It challenges our identity as a nation dedicated to equality, fairness, and justice.
Innocent until proven guilty. Yea, right.
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Do you think it might be possible to crowdsource the creation of a similar group to operate in cases like dajaz1, to help create legal precedents to protect others? A sharers' legal defense fund of sorts?
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There is no way for any defense fund to help when it the law is being handled in secret with only 1 side getting the ear of the Judge.
The sheer number of misdeeds by the DOJ in these types of actions is reaching stupid proportions and no one has done a damn thing to stop it. The tracker site from Spain, they told the Judge in court that the owners had not done anything to get the domain back or move the case forward. They lied to the Judge in court, they lied to the public. What does the DOJ have to actually do to finally be called on crossing the line in bending the law. They are the top of the food chain for Justice, and they are selling it out.
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Hubris. It will be their undoing.
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The major labels are DESPERATE. All of the risk-taking, smart, talented artists are going independent. Sure, a great bunch of them don't sound as "professional" as some of the major label artists but they're catching up very quickly. The success of Kickstarter is going to send shockwaves across the industry, along with the other independent artists who are gaining traction on their own. The major labels are clinging tooth and claw to their antiquated 'intellectual property' and even that is fading away with the termination rights going into effect.
Game over.
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Er, I should say, hear about someone willing American Idol. I'd never actually watch that crap!
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Corps
WTF?! 50% profit isn't enough?
Publishers don't even care about profit anymore, just control and revenue. But above all, control.
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Beholder
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Funny headline
Or, it's just one musician's decision conflated into something much bigger that suits your agenda, with no regard for the calculations of that decision or whether or not it will be successful in the long term.
Do you want to be a writer or a hack?
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Re: Funny headline
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Re: Funny headline
Douche.
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Article
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19 Group is not a member of the RIAA, so far as I know. Not surprising: they're not a record label. They're a combination management, marketing, promotions, and merchandising company.
And, amazingly, the contracts you get from them appear to be even worse than the label contracts.
It's not just the RIAA that is evil. There's plenty of that to go around.
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About time
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The Celebrity Mentality
I simply cannot imagine a teenager who is fairly good at math and science, better than nearly everybody at his school, worrying about whether or not he's going to get a Nobel Prize in Physics or Chemistry, or a Field Prize in Mathematics. What such a teenager is thinking about are achievable intermediate objectives, things like AP exams, and being allowed to take courses at the local college while still in high school, which have their own reward in terms of college admissions. Okay, so maybe you wind up as a mechanical engineer, instead of a theoretical physicist, but that has its own compensations. The whole notion of "star-ness" is defined by the immediate un-profitability of certain pursuits in the short run, the foreseeable future.
For someone who is working behind the counter at McDonald's, ownership of a taco vending truck might or might not be an attainable goal. It depends on the local licensing regime.
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Re: The Celebrity Mentality
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Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
The internet gives them a worldwide market at once.
They don't have to treat each continent or group of countries as different areas that need special release dates.
They also don't have their profits being whittled away repaying "loans" that might never get paid off due to amazing accounting. Or wait years for their royalty checks to actually be sent to them. Or have the labels put them on a list to be paid... someday after they take all of the money and hang onto it for a while.
Yes they might not make 10 million a year, amazingly most of the planet lives on much less than that. "Rock Star" doesn't require you to have a 7 digit income to survive.
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Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
Most little girls who take ballet lessons aren't going to be professional ballerinas and they know it.
Among all the aspiring actors and actresses, we don't hear much talk about how they can now have sustainable acting careers with the Internet. Yes, indie filmmakers have new options, but for actors and actresses, we aren't getting a lot of pep talks about how now they can keep more money in their pockets.
But for some reason, we're telling musicians how they can become successful full-time musicians because the label system is gone.
Expectations in music seem out of line compared to expectations in other fields.
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Not at all. We're showing them how they can produce without the dubious 'benefit' of a label.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
The majority of musicians have never been signed to a label nor were they going to be signed to a label. There have been musicians recording their own music and selling it at shows since at least the days of cassette tapes. Major labels have only been a factor for artists who have signed to major labels, but they have not be a factor for everyone else.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
True, but they've never "made it" before. Largely because they couldn't - the avenues of expression were monopolized by a cabal of multinationals.
It is now possible to "make it" - or at least make a living - without having to deal with that cabal. And that deserves to be trumpeted.
Of course, the vast majority of those who try to make a living off of art will fail. That has always been true, and always will be true. I don't think anyone here has ever pretended it wasn't. But it's still better for musicians now than it ever was before.
I'm unqualified to talk about actors and actresses, but from what little I know, they earned the majority of their money on a "per-gig" basis anyway.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
That's what I don't think people who haven't been a part of that music culture don't understand. I've been around unsigned musicians for 30 years. The ones selling their own cassettes and CDs at shows were "making it" as much (or even more) than those who are "making it" now without a label. People who have only known the music business since the Internet days are assuming that the Internet has transformed life for DIY artists. The ones raving about their great success now tend to either be those who used to be signed and are now keeping more of the money, or those who have only known life as a DIY musician in the Internet age and don't know what it was like pre-Internet. Some of what they think is new is the same thing unsigned musicians have always done. People have played gigs and made money from gigs for as long as there have been gigs. Artists who couldn't get radio play still found ways to find fans. It was done even before the Internet.
What I am saying is that there has always been a vast subculture of music that wasn't associated with a label. And the Internet hasn't changed things that much. There are more people who "feel" famous because they get a lot of people checking them out on YouTube, so yes, there are more people who are famous in their own minds. But in terms of making a living at this, I'd say that hasn't changed that much. The conversion rate from being seen/heard online and actually sales isn't all that great.
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Suzanne, I've been making music since the 1980's, and I was doing exactly the type of things that you are talking about. I've also known many musicians over the years who have done the same.
And at least as far as me and the musicians I know are concerned, you are mistaken. It is far easier to make money now than it was in the 1980's or 1990's.
Certainly the process hasn't changed: get the word out, tour as much as possible, sell directly to fans, etc. And most musicians (myself included) never even broke even, and probably never will.
But there is no way that someone like Amanda Palmer would have been able to get $200K for making an album without a label. Even I, who make almost nothing, have been able to get more gigs, with more people in them, than I ever could in even the early 2000's. And it's largely due to the internet.
The internet doesn't just allow bands to connect with fans; it also allows fans to connect with each other - which is just as important. Especially with underground music, the ability for fans to connect with each other directly (and I include file sharing here) allows people from around the world to unite tiny local "scenes." This makes it easier for musicians to connect with those worldwide fans. But more importantly, that worldwide connection causes those local scenes to actually grow.
I've personally seen this happen: bands that were drawing a handful of people in the 1980's-1990's retired, but are now coming out of retirement to play shows for hundreds or even thousands of people.
I remember the shows in the 1980's. They were much smaller than they are now. For example, have you seen the crowds at the early shows of the classic punk bands, like the Misfits or the Dead Kennedys? They were tiny. Even I pull in more people than that at my own shows nowadays, and I'm nobody.
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As for gigs, I think it depends. I live in a college town and it used to be that every fraternity party hired a live band. Now it's a DJ. That has nothing to do with the Internet, but a major source of paid gigs dried up. Similarly, lots of clubs switched from live music to DJs or karaoke.
There have been a number of paid gigs from corporations and cities hiring entertainment, and now that so many bands are competing for those jobs, the going rate has gone down. Weddings that used to hire bands now often hire DJs instead. Schools are cutting back on arts programs, so I would expect the demand for music teachers has declined (not sure how it has been for private lessons, though if you don't play in a school band, you might not be taking those lessons on the side).
Technology has lowered the barrier of entry for musicians, which is good, but the majority will not make a living at this and they should understand that.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality (to: Suzanne Lainson, # 85)
http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-05-10/behind-europes-workday-club-craze
The Swedes are apparently doing "lunchtime raves," if I have the terminology right. A DJ, an ad-hoc space, and a serving table full of water and cheese-lettuce-tomato sandwiches--- and away they go! I'm not clear as to whether one is supposed to dance furiously while eating a sandwich, or to eat the sandwich while walking back to work. Oh, to be young again!
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality (to: Suzanne Lainson, # 85)
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality (to: Suzanne Lainson, # 85)
Very true. But what I love about pop-up events is that they are easier to do than opening a full scale restaurant. In this case you try it and if it works, great, you do it again. If not, on to the next idea.
And quite honestly, even if the music is bad, but there are pretty people to look it, the crowds will come.
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Pop-Ups (reply to Suzanne Lainson, # 90)
http://www.holytrinity.oh.goarch.org/92.html
At any rate, it got more and more popular, dragging in all kinds of people who were not parishioners, or Greek Orthodox. At a certain point, Greek restaurateurs, who had not been serving their national cuisine, because they thought their customers would not like it, took notice of the trend, and the rest is history. By 1985, there were any number of places you could get a Gyro and a Moussaka.
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Re: Pop-Ups (reply to Suzanne Lainson, # 90)
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality (to: Suzanne Lainson, # 85)
Eating, Live Butchery and, Oh Yeah, Music - NYTimes.com
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
You know, thinking about a band like the Dead Kennedys, I think it was okay for them to have tiny crowds at the beginning. I knew about them early on because of the name. There have always been zines and alt-weeklies reporting on underground music and if you were one of those who kept up on that, you could find out about it.
Had the Dead Kennedys become an overnight sensation on the Internet, I'm not sure it would have worked well. Part of being a band like that is to be under the radar until word-of-mouth is so great that everyone eventually hears about you. The idea of blasting your presence everywhere online has given us one type of music, but to be truly underground, you aren't supposed to use mass media to let everyone know about you. Someone like Rebecca Black truly is an Internet creation.
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Can we send it back and try again?
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
Your Karl, you come here and give us the benefit of your real world experiences.
Pretty sure that makes you not a nobody.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
Sorry to keep harping on you like this, it's nothing personal obviously. But here, again, I just don't see that. In fact, I see the opposite.
It's the bands that weren't DIY'ing it before the internet that think it's harder nowadays. This is especially true of musicians on a label today. They say stuff like: "I've heard selling 100,000 records today is like selling a platinum album in the 1990's." Of course it's not true at all. And that's not experience talking; that's what they heard from someone at their label.
It's the ones (like me) who have been doing it on their own for 20 years that see how things are better. It certainly hasn't "transformed life," but it's made things a tiny bit better, one small increment at a time.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: The Celebrity Mentality
I think I see your point Suzanne, in that we appear to be setting a different level of expectation for musicians when compared to other artists.
I think that's true, for three main reasons:
1) The old model was sooooo bad for the majority of musicians that it's not that difficult to find a better way.
2) The barriers for entry are lower. The kit you need to get started is, in real terms, cheaper than it has ever been, as are the advertising and distribution tools.
3) I think it's a less polarised (and more enduring) market, the scale for "successful" ranges from selling a few albums here and there as a bonus to your hobby, right up to the Amanda Palmers / Jonathan Coultons who make a good living from it; it all depends on what you're trying to achieve. Compare that to, say, professional sports.
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reality sucks
one day people will realise real artists don't go on talent contests - that's for plastic pop shit - we play gigs! :-)x
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reality sucks
one day people will realise real artists don't go on talent contests - that's for plastic pop shit - we play gigs! :-)x
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And they should. For probably $100.00 a month, they could get a custom web site up and running and maintained.
If they sold MP3's at 25 cents each, they would likely make exponentially more than the RIAA will get them.
Heck, the artists themselves could cut CD-R's - advertise that too and people will buy them just because of that, lol.
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Re:
And they should.
Unfortunately they can't. The contracts everyone is required to sign just to try out and then appear on the show give the show producers control of the contestants. I've known people approached to try out and I have recommended that they do not.
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For years and years, this industry gutted the public with over priced content that you would buy a whole disc/album/tape for just a single good song. Now, the consumer is gutting the industry. And they want sympathy?
Naaaa.
I'll still buy CD's, for ethical reasons (even though it's obvious the music industry NEVER sought to treat consumers with this same respect, but I'm above that) and because I like to have them, plus it's legal.
If the RIAA withers and dies, I'll buy digital media. The sooner the RIAA dies and let's the industry move on to the digital age - the better. Since you obviously won't evolve: go away RIAA.
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2 years later...
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