DOJ Realizes That Comcast & Time Warner Are Trying To Prop Up Cable By Holding Back Hulu & Netflix
from the took-'em-long-enough dept
For quite some time now, we've been reporting on how the big television players were so upset that Hulu and Netflix were dragging them kicking and screaming into the 21st century (even though they owned Hulu) that they were working on plans to kill off both services -- or at least cripple them. Mostly, what this goes back to is the inevitable fact that the internet is going to subsume television. But, these days, there's so much money in TV, thanks to the ability to be a gatekeeper, that all efforts are on holding back the internet for as long as is humanly possible. Want to know why HBO refuses to offer a standalone internet streaming option? It's because of the monopolistic power of cable.This has all been pretty obvious for years, but the Justice Department has finally begun investigating Comcast/NBC Universal and Time Warner Cable to see if any of their actions with regards to Netflix and Hulu trip the antitrust wire. In particular, they seem focused on whether or not tiered broadband plans are actually designed to keep people from using competing online services, and preventing people from cord cutting. For Comcast, the risk may be much higher. As part of the merger with NBC Universal, it made certain promises to the government concerning how it treats online services. If it's not living up to those promises, it could mean trouble.
Unlike some other antitrust investigations, this is one where you can make a strong case that these companies are making life worse for consumers, by using their natural monopoly positions to keep prices artificially high. That said, I have little faith that the DOJ will get things right with the investigation. I think it's likely that the natural economic pressure of cord cutting (which, despite denials from Hollywood and the cable industry, is very very real) is going to have much more of an impact on the eventual massive reconfiguration of the television market than any antitrust lawsuit.
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Filed Under: cable, competition, cord cutting, doj, television
Companies: hbo, hulu, netflix, time warner
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I tend to agree and it seems to me that this is part and parcel of the history of capitalism. Centralization/decentralization of capital/market share/power is the way history works.
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As "invisible hand" Adam Smith himself observed, unregulated capitalism will naturally devolve into monopoly. This is one reason why it's impossible to have a free market without regulation.
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The way the term is used today has nothing to do with the way Smith intended it. But that's not too strange, considering that the way the term "capitalism" is used today has nothing to do with what Smith intended. What people call "capitalism" today is based far more on the writings of Ayn Rand, and bears a much stronger resemblance to fascism. Anyone who believes in what Adam Smith actually advocated would be decried by modern "capitalists" as a dirty commie.
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As for monopolistic practices, Rand's protagonists thrived on rather than feared competition. Witness the National Alliance of Railroads (a private entity) and the Anti-Dog-Eat-Dog rule used to force Phoenix-Durango out of competing in Colorado.
Seriously, Rand might have been a terrible writer but nothing you see in the so-called capitalism today can be justified by her ideals.
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I'll grant you that she was pretty pissed off at communism. Quite understandable given her background. Anyone trying to sell that she was for any form of stifling competition though either didn't understand her work in the first place or hasn't read it in a while. There were too many examples of both public and private anti-competitive practices that her protagonists had to fight to even remotely claim that.
Look, I'm not a Rand fanatic. I think she was a terrible novelist and somewhat short-sighted. My disagreement is strictly factual rather than idealistic.
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Someone taking a half-assed understanding of her philosophy (or deliberately misunderstanding it for their own gain) and making policy out of it can't really be laid on her shoulders. I'm fairly certain she'd have some righteously pissed off words to say about what was done with her message if she were still around.
My philosophy is, in general, the government should stay out of competitive matters. Right up until someone does something anti-competitive. Then they should come down on them like a ton of bricks.
Truly anti-competitive mind you. Simply being too good for anyone else to beat isn't enough. Any action aimed at stifling competition though is. Including pretty much all exclusive contracts, even if the parties aren't dominant market forces.
The "in general" above because there are times when the system breaks down and the government should take steps to restart competition in a sector. That power should be used exceedingly sparingly and only when absolutely necessary though. Monopolies hurt the involved sector of the economy but so does government meddling.
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But Alan Greenspan was her most devout follower. We see how that worked...
The hard part here is that a lot of Objectivists seem to use her name for a lot of monopolistic behavior.
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Confirming what we have always known
The sooner the media dinosaurs are gone and someone who understands technology is put in their place, the better. Then we might see some real progress.
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But whatever, 'screw your customers and hope for the best' might also work...
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The only kind of unbundling that would please me is if I could have cable internet without having to take the TV as well. My household will never, ever, pay for TV with commercials. It's a matter of principle.
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Re: brent
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As Wall Street proved with their vulture capitalism that helped cause the economic mess, big corporations don't usually think long term profits, they think short term.
While long term it's a better idea for Comcast to have NBC make as much money as possible by making good deals with Hulu and Netflix, short term that undermines Comcast's revenue, and undermines Comcast's CEO and other top executives their chance to get big performance bonuses NOW, so they won't do it. Plus, less revenue coming in NOW might cost Comcast's CEO and other top executives their jobs if their board is too impatient to wait for long term returns.
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Re: Past Inclusive Restrictions
Something like: The train company would own the cotton farms, the clothing factories(?), the clothing stores, and the rails which it was all transported on... Or a thousand variations on the theme (logging camp, sawmill, rails... cattle ranch, slaughter house, cheese manufacturey, restaurants, etc, etc)
Also, the movie studios owning everything from film production thru to actors, and theatres...
And in the above examples, the tightly integrated vertical integration was deemed illegal--repeatedly.
Given that the above *historical* examples were illegal, why was Comcast allowed to purchase NBC?
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Alas, it's probably the reason we won't see a Google service provider to use your Google phones with Google OS on.
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I don't think that's true - the studios aren't that valuable. There are probably a number of individuals in the tech industry that could do it with their personal wealth. If a few of them got together they could probably take 51% control of the entire industry and asset-strip it to oblivion. I wish someone would do that to the RIAA companies.
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Kickstarter
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He points out that railroad companies were the start of the corporations. Basically, they were initially "public" companies with diverse shareholders and some government regulation, but the shares always consolidated in the hands of fewer and fewer wealthier shareholders. And the weak federal government and the various local governments that the railroads encountered didn't stop the railroads from...well, railroading them to achieve greater market domination and wealth. Like today's corporations, they played different towns and states off of each other by threatening to take their market-enhancing rails somewhere else if they didn't get incentives.
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That's not necessarily irrational. If I don't know you, I'd rather have $100 from you now than your promise that you'll give me $102 or even $150 tomorrow. The larger the sum, the more important it is to make sure to get it, and thus the more likely one will be to take the smaller sum immediately.
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What if I said I would give you $100 if you waited one year or $102 if you wait one year and one day? Would your rationale hold up then? I'd feel certain that your response would be, "I'd wait one year and a day. After all, it's only one more day and I get two more dollars."
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Re: "Bill Creep Issues"
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This pricing model essentially forces people in the areas where there is a possible savings to go ahead and subscribe to basic cable to achieve the discount, even though they may in fact subscribe to satellite TV for actual viewing.
This "sleight of hand" essentially skews the numbers of people actually viewing Comcast basic cable, and results in higher than actual eyes-on-the-screen numbers which impacts the reported cableTV subscribers communicated to any advertisers who contract with Comcast to display their products. They are basically lying to their advertisers.
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This pricing model essentially forces people in the areas where there is a possible savings to go ahead and subscribe to basic cable to achieve the discount, even though they may in fact subscribe to satellite TV for actual viewing.
This "sleight of hand" essentially skews the numbers of people actually viewing Comcast basic cable, and results in higher than actual eyes-on-the-screen numbers which impacts the reported cableTV subscribers communicated to any advertisers who contract with Comcast to display their products. They are basically lying to their advertisers.
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First, while I agree that Comcast is a problem is regards to their product pricing for consumers (they keep raising prices on subscribers on a regular basis) they are not required to provide their content to online rental or streaming services. This would be a valid argument if Hulu and Netflix were a cable service or "televised provider" like broadcasters, but neither Hulu nor Netflix are broadcasters, they merely stream.
Second, Hulu and Netflix are trying to pull the same crap that Redbox and Netflix has been pulling with movie studios over movie rentals.
I don't see this going too far because there is no antitrust violation. Neither Hulu nor Netflix are a broadcaster so their complaint is baseless.
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No they're not. They just don't get to whine when their customers find avenues to obtain content that don't benefit them (be that through competitors or piracy).
"neither Hulu nor Netflix are broadcasters, they merely stream."
Explain the difference.
"Second, Hulu and Netflix are trying to pull the same crap that Redbox and Netflix has been pulling with movie studios over movie rentals."
What "crap" are they trying to pull? Asking to be allowed to rent new movies to consumers is something to be attacked now?
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Part of tbe deal that allowed comcast to buy NBC was an agreement that they wouldn't hold their content back from competitors or favor their content over competitors.
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You need to go back in time a bit and examine just how Blockbuster failed. It had nothing to do with piracy, but the controlling forces which:
A) it used blackmail to prevent BB from legally obtaining VHS/DVD or else it would blacklist the company from distributors. The same tactic was used on Redbox.
B) it used its "we own it" stance to continually demand more royalties from BB, forcing the rental price to nearly $5 before it started closing stores. $5 for a rental is atrocious, especially when they were selling used DVDs for the same price.
These tactics are now being used on streaming websites, the latest being Netflix be told to pay $16 million per movie to license.
The entertainment industry has been violating anti-trust laws longer than I've been alive.
And if we go back even further in time, to an era where Edison owned the patents on movie equipment...
This industry is taking too long to fail.
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Riiight...
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We will have to see if the courts see this as a violation.
Either way, they have done away with data caps and are going to start charging more for heavier bandwidth useage.
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What definition of "broadcaster" are you using? From where I sit, it looks like Hulu & Netflix are no more or less of a broadcaster than Comcast is.
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Monopoly abuse.
Comcast and the rest should be regulated utilities. They are physical monopolies given subsidies and a favored status by the government.
They are abusing their monopoly position to suppress rivals. The anti-trust implications here are pretty obvious.
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Re: Monopoly abuse.
In fact, very few industries don't suffer from anti-competitive laws. That needs to change. I'm very very very sick and tired of anti-competitive laws. They must all be abolished.
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Sarcasm Mode Engaged:
nickcage.jpg Noooooooooooooooooooooo?
Seriously how retarded do you have to be to not see this happening?
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Where they stepped in it
I have little hope that DOJ will actually do anything about this problem. The DOJ is filled with the best politicians money can buy.
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The DOJ is filled with ex-MPAA and ex-RIAA associated attorneys. They shouldn't be allowed near these cases due to conflict of interests.
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LoL
These "dinosaurs" depend on the public being afraid to migrate to new technology and for the most part they are justified in that thinking. The problem is that the internet has sped up the cycle of adoption. People communicate faster and to a broader audience now.
I don't think we will be seeing the "dinosaurs" going extinct, but they will have to evolve quicker than they want to.
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Pass the buck off and let it be someone elses problem.
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Instead of a customer, they get nothing.
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I wish I had that option. Where I live, the choice is between Comcast or dialup.
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Seemed like a good time to bump it.
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About time?
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Time to Check Your Calendars. It's 2012.
And like Hollywood, in a few years it will be all over, save the stench of decay of the bastard offspring.
And, like Hollywood, in a few years people won't know what "broadcast" means or who the f*** these people are. Nor will they give a shit.
How many young people own/buy/rent records, cassettes, 8-Tracks, VHS or Betamax tapes or CD's or DVD's or even Blu-Rays (a Trademarked name for nothing more than mega-DVD's with more anti-consumer features [which were nothing more than mega-CD's with more anti-consumer features]) or watch TV (what's that)?
Uh-huh. I thought so.
Where can I but a new Buggy-Whip?
More importantly, how do I buy me some of those hundreds of US Government Inc. laws to force you all to buy my stone wheels or else get arrested and jailed?
In 2012, no less.
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DOJ?
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Time Warner != Time Warner Cable
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Is it just me...
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Re: Hulu Is Retarded
Netflix may not be current or up to date, but that is because they have to liscense what they show and most of the good shows are on cable. You need to also remember Netflix didnt start as a streaming service. It's closest twin was GameFly. They didnt start with banner ads online but wirh TV comercials. They also had to license them as a rental service. The streaming sevice came along and cable companies pulled the plug on Liscensing certain materials to try to prevent people from completely switching over. Netflix is a legitimate service. They got big due to inexpensive services. Besides, who here has seen any cable show lately on th
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Re: Re: Hulu Is Retarded
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Really now
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Re: Really now
Things won't change until the cable money goes away.
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Cost
It's the sole reason cable companies, or anyone offering TV services outside of online streaming, charge so much for the Internet services.
Comcast's biggest sin is capping data then throttling it. Now that 35GB limit doesn't seem like much of an issue. Until you find out they measure by throughput rather than data downloaded. The thing is, they don't measure it with their own online streaming service.
Time Warner's issue is cost. The only way you can get "sufficent" cost/speed ratios is when you bundle with the other two services they provide. Also, if you cut cable with Tim Warner, you cannot use their Internet because they are in the same lines.
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Re: Cost
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Content vs Distribution
Be a media company, step aside and allow Open Access to the last mile into our homes. We want a connection, and the companies competing for our connection. What we buy using our connection shouldn't be under the control of those with content.
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Wow
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They fight change
Now go to a small town. You will see either one, and they are pushed, or the norm is they are the ONLY cable company in that small city. If you notice they also have like grid areas they are set up in.
Now look at towns that have the norm cable company but they have their OWN local cable company. Notice the local cable belongs to the city, or a local business person. If you look at their background something interesting pops up. Most had to sue the major cable company for the privilege to set up shop in that town. The major cable company sued them.
Another thing you will notice is the harder for the main cable companies to set up cable in a town the more chance they wont. Quite a few towns around the USA don't have cable because they are in mountain regions, or located off the beaten path. The major players don't want to spend a dime on these places. So these rural areas rely on Satellite or nothing.
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