FBI Director: Our Electronic Voting System Is Such A Complete Mess, It Would Be Difficult To Hack
from the well,-then dept
There's been plenty of talking going around this election cycle about the terrible security problems with our current voting technology -- along with some conspiracy-theory level talk of foreign agents looking to "hack" the election. We haven't been very impressed with officials telling us all to calm down and it's difficult to see how FBI director James Comey did himself any favors by basically arguing that the voting system is secure... mainly because of what a complete and utter mess it is. The larger point he's making is somewhat valid, if clunky, in the fact that each state runs their own voting, so it's not like hackers can get into one central system and wreak havoc. The different systems definitely make it harder. But arguing that this is a sign of good security seems kind of ridiculous:“The beauty of the American voting system is that it is dispersed among the 50 states, and it is clunky as heck,’’ said Mr. Comey. “A lot of people have found that challenging over the years, but the beauty of that is it’s not exactly a swift part of the internet of things, and so it is hard for an actor to reach our voting process.’’Yeah, that's basically security through obscurity... at scale. Not exactly very reassuring, even if the underlying point may be true.
Wouldn't it be better if we just made sure the systems were actually secure (i.e., not computerized and connected to the internet) rather than just "clunky"?
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Filed Under: e-voting, elections, fbi, hacking, james comey
Reader Comments
The First Word
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Re:
What a clunky mess of an argument. While no foreign country is likely to have enough ressources and enough interests in USA to sway an election, 4 parties might...
Neither the democratic nor republican primaries were shining examples of fair and democratic elections...
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Re:
How many states VERIFY addresses?
HOW many states verify and match Birth and death records??
How many states verify Property ownership?? and WHERE they live?
What would it take to OWN property, in many states, and be allowed to VOTE?? because the STATE dont realize you live in ANOTHER state??
Easy trick? YEP.
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Re: Re:
Nice try but you will need to produce some evidence, not just insinuations.
Stating that "We're just asking the questions" does not cut the mustard.
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Out of the 50 states exactly how many different systems are used? There are a few vendors... 4 to be more precise... that have the majority of the voting system sales.
How many states do you need to sway an election? So you only need to know exploits on 2 systems to make a big impact no?
Look away folks nothing to see here.
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Re: Re:
But they've been right, over and over.
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The system doesn't need to be hacked
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The upside?
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Re: The upside?
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Is Comey in on it?
This sounds like Comey is in on the vote tampering that is scheduled.
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It only takes one
I am basing this analysis on an assumption that the Director knows how the US electoral system (including the Electoral College) works. That may be a stretch.
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Re: It only takes one
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Spoken like someone who has first hand experience hacking the American election system.
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yes it is..
2. WHO in hell would want to hack it, EXCEPT those in this country?? we make MORE of a mess with this, then THEY EVER COULD..
3. this is as bad as saying "The illegal MEXICANS want to vote"..WHY?? they just come here WORK, MAKE MONEY, and get a free ride back home.. AND what about the REST of south America??
Lets see...Make a BASIC programmed system to take votes, NO USB, or anything else that can HACK the system..then VERIFY the programming before counting it..
have at LEAST 3 parties acknowledge this protocol...and AWAY WE GO..
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Re: yes it is..
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I am sorry.... electoral what?
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Paper Ballots Please
The convenience of electronic voting should not take precedent above the ability to audit the vote via a physical/tangible paper ballot trail.
Paper ballots may not be pretty but they once served this nation very well for 200 years.
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Re: Paper Ballots Please
Sorry, but luddism isn't a good argument. Our laws and means of governance should be open to some degree of change, even for the sake of modern convenience. Nonetheless, it should always be transparent and accountable to the people. In the context of voting machines, they should make the source code open for public review or at the very least available for independent security audits and testing.
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Re: Re: Paper Ballots Please
Horses and wagons, as well as quill pens, candles and many other handmade goods may not be pretty but they once served this nation very well for 200 years. The convenience of cars and electricity should not take precedent above the ability to audit where our power and goods comes from!
Sorry, but luddism isn't a good argument. Our laws and means of governance should be open to some degree of change, even for the sake of modern convenience. Nonetheless, it should always be transparent and accountable to the people. In the context of voting machines, they should make the source code open for public review or at the very least available for independent security audits and testing.
Please what a dissembling pile of horse cocky if I've ever smelt one. PU.
Suggesting the use of paper ballots verses electronic voting machines is not Luddism.
It is common sense.
Paper ballots serve a very important function electronic voting machines do not and that is having an auditable election with the paper ballots being physically available for a recount.
The various technologies allowing for the operation of trains, planes and automobiles are at a minimum 100 years old for winged flight and almost 200 years for railways.
Just because something is old does not render it obsolete.
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Re: Re: Re: Paper Ballots Please
But hey, why let facts ruin your silly rant?
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Good for you Biff. Mean while, back at the ranch, they have no paper trail and politicians like it that way.
But hey ... why let a few facts get in the way of your - whatever you call that.
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Re: Re: Re: Paper Ballots Please
This might come as a shock, but in the 21st century planes are no longer made of wood, we don't use metal cranks to start our cars in the morning, and trains don't burn coal. ALL of them have advanced a great deal in 100+ years, and continue to do so.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Paper Ballots Please
Some are, you really need to get out more.
"trains don't burn coal"
Some do, are you really this sheltered?
I see you think being advanced means throwing caution to the wind, but not everyone shares your enthusiasm for wanton recklessness.
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Re: Paper Ballots Please
I remember reading an article of someone observing the process of comparing paper to computer votes. And when those didn't match they just added or removed the obviously wrong paper votes.
And as for the convenience part: There is no difference for voters. We have paper votes only here and you go in to voting center, give your ID, get a paper, go into a booth, make an X or two, fold it, and put it in a sealed box. Takes 1-2 min max.
Counting might take a bit longer but first results are usually up 2-3 hours after the centers close.
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It doesn't take 50 states.
He must have received his post election assignments and is trying to get ahead of a big workload. Like maybe the Cessna 208s they plan on dispatching to likely riot areas use more fuel than he budgeted for, and so he is trying to calm the herd a little to save operational costs?
Probably cheaper to just buy more billy clubs. But that doesn't have quite the same optics as micro targeting the "trouble makers" with close air support.
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So, the FBI is secure because ...
A man in charge of the Federal Bureau of Investigation feels it is duty to convince everyone else to make his job easier because he doesn't really get security. An agency that entraps citizens because it cannot find terrorists, what better way to spend time than convincing Americans to act against the country so they can arrest them, thus proving that they are protecting America.
Yeah, right.
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......Again, I can't speak for all states, but I know that Ohio's voting machines are NEVER connected to the internet and I'm pretty sure that's standard.
Each machine just runs pre-programmed software and saves the results to memory card (which appears to be a proprietary design). The memory card is located in a port that has a lock (which is different for each machine; no master key) and affixed with a barcoded tamper seal.
The machines have no usb ports at all.
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Re:
How about a design/code review?
How does the vetting of Bank ATMs compare to that of voting machines?
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NATIONAL ELECTIONS STANDARDS
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In other words, having each state run a national voting process in such a fragmented fashion... AND WITHOUT A NATIONALLY MANDATED SET OF VOTING STANDARDS!... inevitably leads to a rejection of HARMONIZED PROTECTIONS AND BENEFITS FOR ALL U.S. CITIZENS! Some citizens will receive more protections and benefits in some elements of the process, and others will receive less! AND SO!... THIS SHOULD NOT BE TOLERATED IN AMERICA!... AND!... SHOULD FORM THE BASIS OF A FUTURE U.S. CONSTITUTIONAL BATTLE!
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Politicians acting like spoiled brats at a birthday party, is not a solution to an important issue, such as voting_in those who will lead the country!
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Please!... no emails!
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So un tracable not unhackable
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Give me a C! O! M-E-Y!
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Re: Give me a C! O! M-E-Y!
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No Credibility
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FBI Doesn't Want Them Fixed
Gag orders work wonders.
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