Disappointing: Google Makes Plan To Return To China With Censored Search Engine
from the this-is-unfortunate dept
Google has had quite the roller coaster ride with China. Back in 2006, Google unfortunately decided to give into pressure from the Chinese government, and agreed to launch a censored version of its site in China. A few years later, Google corrected that error and stopped censoring results in China, leading to the site mostly being blocked by China's Great Firewall. That was a principled stand to take. Unfortunately, the Intercept is reporting on some internal documents that suggest Google is moving back in the other direction, and testing a censored version of its search engine for China.
The project – code-named Dragonfly – has been underway since spring of last year, and accelerated following a December 2017 meeting between Google’s CEO Sundar Pichai and a top Chinese government official, according to internal Google documents and people familiar with the plans.
It appears the Intercept found out about this from a Google whistleblower who was (correctly) unnerved by this plan:
Within Google, knowledge about Dragonfly has been restricted to just a few hundred members of the internet giant’s 88,000-strong workforce, said a source with knowledge of the project. The source spoke to The Intercept on condition of anonymity, as they were not authorized to contact the media. The source said that they had moral and ethical concerns about Google’s role in the censorship, which is being planned by a handful of top executives and managers at the company with no public scrutiny.
Google's official response to this was an unfortunately PR-speak non-answer:
“We provide a number of mobile apps in China, such as Google Translate and Files Go, help Chinese developers, and have made significant investments in Chinese companies like JD.com. But we don’t comment on speculation about future plans.”
Yeah, that's really not going to cut it. Meanwhile, another source inside the company told Vice that the negative publicity over the plan may scuttle it altogether:
A source inside the company, who was not authorized to speak on the record, confirmed that the contents of the Intercept report were accurate. But they said that it was unclear at this point if the app would be launched — partly because of the negative publicity surrounding the Intercept’s story and partly due to the ongoing tensions between Washington and Beijing over trade.
Given how in the last few months we've seen employees at various large tech companies protest internally various efforts to get big government deals that create sketchy ethical situations, it seems highly likely that the same is going to happen here as well. I would imagine that a large number of Google employees -- the same ones who supported the company's decision to pull out of China -- will make a pretty big stink about the possibility of going back into China with a censored version.
The general thinking on this is that China is such a huge market it's difficult for tech companies to ignore. And it seems likely that Wall Street's constant push for growth is playing into this plan. But there are certain steps that are not worth taking, and Google should seriously rethink this plan.
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Filed Under: censorship, china, don't be evil, search
Companies: google
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Still
Now that the story is broken, it is important to note that they kept this project secret to prevent their own employees from revolting. That alone speaks volumes if your own staff have to be kept in the dark.
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Re: Still
Though I have to wonder what their ultimate plan was - if the plan had to be kept secret because the blowback would be that bad, what about when it actually launched? People would find out at some point, and if they'd kept it secret up to launch, the outcry would have been all the greater.
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Re: Re: Still
Probably new management forgetting about history, or thinking people would be more tolerant of it. Internal people would have been against the censorship the first time they did it, but they did it anyway until external pressure caused them to stop. Also, it's harder to stop this when it's already happening, because Google can talk about all the ways Chinese users have become dependent and will be inconvenienced.
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How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
In practice, every corporation is like an amoral and immortal beast driven only by a goal of gaining power -- via its tokens: money (which itself is actually just pieces of paper at most, usually just numbers in computers, again complete FICTIONS).
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Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
GOOGLE will ALWAYS do what gains power. ANY morality that you attribute to it is just YOUR fantasy.
Therefore, if disappointed in ANY corporation, you are contradicting reality. You are insane. -- And if you then try to hedge: well, the corporation is RUN by a group of people, then you flatly don't know the reality of people, either!
We're told that the premier corporatist example, Nazi Germany, murdered and incinerated millions of people. THAT is definitely far closer to the reality of corporatism than YOUR being "disappointed" with Google, you Masnick.
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Re: Re: How can you be disappointed in a Troll
So articles like that can certainly have a positive impact.
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Re: Re: Re: How can you be disappointed in a Troll
Tell me, since when fiscal paradises were removed?
Since when prices of plane tickets dropped considerably?
Etc.
The guy is right to assert that mainly, because driven my only money, corporations are evil. And thinking otherwise is just naive.
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Some vs None
So exactly what is your complaint regarding his counter-point besides 'big companies are bad'(which has nothing to do with his comment) and 'plane tickets are expensive'(seriously, what does that have to do with anything)?
If you've really got a problem with large companies which may or may not have a monopoly in their field you should want more articles like this, because while critical articles might not shift multi-billion dollar companies overnight and in significant ways, you want to know how much impact non-existent critical articles have on the companies involved?
None whatsoever.
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Re: Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
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Re: Re: Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
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Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
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Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
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Re: Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
Google is still a monopoly in many markets. And many american companies are still monopoly in many industries. If not go ask all the people that has just one, two at most options for ISP in their area.
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Re: Re: Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
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I don’t know, but we can always ask people who hated The Last Jedi.
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Re:
The Last Ledi sucks. The same old story than before, updated tot he times.
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Re: How can you be disappointed in a FICTION unless BELIEVE FICTION?
What's your point?
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Shocking
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Re: Shocking
Same as every other billionaire: with the souls of dead factory workers.
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Re: Re: Shocking
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Re: Shocking
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Hypocrisy on display
The good news is that your hypocrisy is so obvious it has motivated the election of Trump. Karma, right? The more tyrannical and hysterical you become, the more you conjure the ultimate solution: Donald J. Trump (POTUS). You made him who he is, and you got him the job. Keep it up, Denounce capitalism. Denounce Trump. Go for it. You are and your hypocrisy and histrionics got him the job, and the Koch brothers pay for it. Perfect.
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Re:
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Well, if you insist…
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Re: Hypocrisy on display
https://theintercept.com/2018/02/25/koch-brothers-trump-administration/
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Re: Re: Hypocrisy on display
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Re: Re: Re: Hypocrisy on display
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I would say “Hamilton is Trump” here, but “Hamilton” legit has a better grasp on constructing coherent sentences.
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Re: Re: Re: Hypocrisy on display
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Hypocrisy on display
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Re: Re: Re: Hypocrisy on display
When Trump was sent to us, he wiped away the old laws and sins of the Republican party, and it became a new party in his name, with a new covenant for his people.
Trump loves all his children, and all that he asks in return is loyalty.
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Re: Re: Hypocrisy on display
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Re: Hypocrisy on display
I am curious, what sort of ID do I need in order to purchase groceries? Will my drivers license do or will I need a passport? Will I move to the front of the line if I have PRE?
Why are you so easily duped? Willing suspension of disbelief for some sort of gain .. what is that, or what do you get out of it? You seem to be a good capitalist, so it must be money you are being paid to make such silly posts.
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This article Entirely misses the Monopolistic Point
All these companies censor their comment (as does Techdirt). They do it in a way that benefits themselves (obviously). None of them are benevolent, and no one expects them to be. They are all “for profit” companies, not champions of anything except themselves, and without a moral core of religious or other selfless belief. They believe only that they want to make money. No one would argue with this.
China is taking a reasonable stance, and I hope the US takes it next. It basically is telling Google, if you want access to our market, you will not decide the censorship that takes place, we will. And they are right to do so. Google has a monopoly, and should be regulated like a monopoly (obviously).
Faced with a ban or to allow their (existing) censorship to be shaped by the government, they will choose the latter. In the US, the same thing should happen. I would much prefer an open and publicly exposed censorship policy (for example) with government oversight then leaving the censorship decisions to Google, Twitter, Facebook and the like. The Chinese government has an agenda for the Chinese people - work hard, serve others, get rich (that last part is fairly new).
Who out there really wants to trust Google with the undocumented unaccountable censorship they perform every day? Bad idea, really bad idea. Open it up, make it all publicly controlled, and show the American people exactly what is going on. It looks like the Chinese will get there first, but I hope America soon follows. Split it up, Google is a monopoly, let’s regulate it like one.
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Re: This article Entirely misses the Monopolistic Point
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Re: This article Entirely misses the Monopolistic Point
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Re: Re: This article Entirely misses the Monopolistic Point
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Ah deepities...
The framing of this article suggests that without China’s censorship, there would be no censorship on Google.
Correct but irrelevant. It would still happen, it just wouldn't be happening with Google's assistance, hence the article.
All these companies censor their comment (as does Techdirt).
[Citation needed], along with the definition of 'censor' that you're using just to be clear.
Google has a monopoly, and should be regulated like a monopoly (obviously).
Define 'monopoly' and state what you believe Google has a monopoly on, keeping in mind 'they're popular' is not a definition of a monopoly.
The Chinese government has an agenda for the Chinese people - work hard, serve others, get rich (that last part is fairly new).
Don't forget 'thou shall not question your betters' and 'If your betters say it's taboo then shut up about it'.
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Re: This article Entirely misses the Monopolistic Point
Not at all, or at least I did not get that impression.
Everything is censored - so that makes it ok. Move along, nothing to see here.
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Second - since we cannot have a "do good" company, let us at least have something out of it. Like taxes. To fix bridges, roads, build proper broadband; to do good, instead of "not doing evil" or pretty much anything.
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“Tiananmen Square Massacre a Myth”
will stoop to to profit from Chinese netizens’ yuan.
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Google employees are reportedly are upset...
A partnership which would have:
A: Helped Improve United States Military Security
B: Helped Reduce Innocent Loss of Life
Nope! Google employees can't seem to work up that level of frothy civil disobedience when it comes helping the Chinese government shit all over its own people, because 'god' gave the Chinese different cultural rights which may or may not include imperialist western values like freedom of speech.
So let's summarize Google's values:
1. Banning Entertaining Conspiracy Theorist using Trumped up "bullying" charges - CHECK
2. Shutting down deal with US Military to improve drone program - CHECK
3. Helping the 'Communist' Chinese Dictatorship destroy civil rights - CHECK
Folks, here is some advice, next time there is massive wave of technological innovation, prior to industry consolidation, if some pock marked engineer claims that their company 'won't be evil' please don't choose that company.
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