"John Fogerty was the lead singer of the popular rock group Creedence Clearwater Revival.
In 1970, as part of CCR, he wrote "Run Through the Jungle," to which Fantasy, Inc., eventually acquired the exclusive publishing rights.
CCR disbanded in 1972, and Fogerty began a solo career with another music label.
In 1985, Fogerty published "The Old Man Down the Road", which he released on Warner Bros. Records.
Fantasy sued Fogerty for copyright infringement, claiming that "The Old Man Down the Road" was simply "Run Through the Jungle" with new words.
A jury found in favor of Fogerty, ( that is the point !!!!) and he sought attorney's fees as provided by the Copyright Act of 1976, [ which went all the way up to the SCOTUS.]
Re: Re: The main difference would be that Lady Gaga almost certainly doesn't own the copyright in her recordings
"If you sign to a label, you do not own the copyright on your material. Even the biggest artists out there (Beatles, Rolling Stones, U2, etc) don't own the copyrights to their music"
by Artist choice yes. But they SOLD THE RIGHTS.
And as Mike knows:
John Fogerty ( ofCCR) v. Fantasy Records -
Supreme Court of the United States.
Argued December 8, 1993.
Decided March 1, 1994.
Full case name, John Fogerty v. Fantasy, Inc. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fogerty_v._Fantasy .
Read and get back to me.
But as you will see the SCOTUS said , that even without holding legal copyright J.F. --the ARTIST-- still owns his personal reproduction of that ART for sale even.
Great Legal decision and very IMPORTANT to understanding Artist's natural rights.
But yes if Paul asked to take my cover of Revolution #1 from my myspace page ,, I will
there is a powerful musician to musician culture.
Quite honestly it is very unlikely this who happen ,, no mater who are the musicians involved -- rich or poor.
Songwriters -- at any level of fame and fortune -- love to see their songs played live and covered on recording. IT is the big kick , that means more than $$.
It is the reason why Art will outlive Money, in Utopia,,, ( -- ain't that right anarchists ?).
-----
as well, , Sometimes it is a good cover of a song , and you like it . And other times -- rarely I'd say -- you think some hack just destroyed the beauty of your song,
======
Money schmomey , between Musicians.
Yes, if the $$ gets big , the vultures,, err -- lawyers,, are there , but if there is little or no $$ , the composing Artist will usually let it slide, and tell his lawyers to feed elsewhere.
Re: Re: Re: Re:Don't forget. Madonna was a consummate businesswoman
one of the best and brightest ever. musically and biz wise. Super-genius. Really.
But "the Material Girl" learned -- and learned very well --from those who went before her. David Bowie (esp.), Macca, Bob Dylan , ain't no slouches either .
she also has good copyright lawyers , and controls ALL.
But you just said that it's okay for you to give away the Beatles' music, because you're not charging for it. So why can't I do that with your copyrighted material?
Like I said ,, if there is $$ to be had ,, Paul and Yoke are free to come get , and I will willfully give it.
If there is no $$ it is academic.
But yes if Paul asked to take my cover of Revolution #1 from my myspace page ,, I will.
MySpace makes this clear when you upload.
( And Paul , I know you lost my phone number,, BUT i am stil getting your emails , for the beatles.com,, but you offer "No Reply" when I write back.)
I'm just here for my personal enjoyment.// but quite honestly , it that much fun.
quite honestly , it that much fun.
I am here because i feel strong about Piracy and copyright law. and techdirt readers are mostly pirates (--- oooooohh , i here it now ,, but if the earbud fits -- wear it !! ---)
And I figured why not argue copyright law in the Pirates den.
I download your music, and burn a new CD, to replace the broken one. Do you think this should be allowed?
I download your music, and burn a new CD, to replace the broken one. Do you think this should be allowed?
Ask my lawyer.
but my ans. No . you break the pysical medim you bought from the RECORD COMPANY,, you by another.
Remember you are not just cheating the Recording artist and /or song writer,, but the Label , the producers , engineers, Visual Artists fo the record sleeve, the record store ,, to whole Music economy and their familes.
Every body knows that Rome fell because of Pirates --on land or at sea!!!! -- or now online.
1) So, the difference between downloading and recording is that one takes more effort?
Ans: For ME and my artisitc choice it is. It it like the fruit stand leaving out a few apples , for the homeless to "steal"
You want or need my art that much,, G-D bless you. Please come to gig to.
AND you can record the MP3 for free @ myspace
Download the orginal file Mp3 encoded with what ever i want , from the lyric to malware [sic] --for PAY @ amiestreet.
Or you could buy the CD from me.
===================================
Q; And that the extra effort must be put up by your fans?
All six of them. Again my Art . MY UNIVIERSE. You want it MY rules. Copyright Law. It is natural.
=====================================
2) What about Fair Use? Doesn't that limit what control you have?
Ans: Fair use is fair . But Fair use is only a quote or and excerpt,, or for educational purpose in limited circumstances. there may be other legal examples too.
===========================================
3) Say I bought a CD with your music. For the sake of simplicity, lets say I bought it in the normal fashion, and without any special 'limited time', or 'right to withdraw' clauses in the contract of sale. Say the CD Broke, got scratched, or was somehow otherwise damaged. To rectify this, I download your music, and burn a new CD, to replace the broken one. Do you think this should be allowed?
ans:
as i pointed out in the lyric thread last week:
I own the Art. you own the physical meduim. You sratch the CD , tough.
-----
in 1970 we bought Abby road on Vinyl.
in 1976 we bought the tape , because it vinyl wore out after 6930 plays.
Then the tape got eaten in the Deck ,
So I bought the tape several more times ,
Till the CDs cam out in the 1990s.
Bought that. ( I think you see where I am going )
Then the Beatles released re-mastered the CDs , thus leaving the earlier CDs useless to my audio file brain.
AND soon we will by the repressed vinyl of Abby Road Again.
(Still want that 25 cents Paul for my cover of Revolution ?)
AND AGAIN in 10-15 years we will , G-D willing , we will buy a mini analog disc of Abby Road , for our nano-tech-mini-analog- music player.
(MAMuPs)
=========
I need a ciggertte. ( please no comments on that , I get it from Mom all the time. It hand rolled organic tobbacco)
Re: Re: Point of Information.// Danko had no right to your 25 cents since the song was written by Bob Dylan.
I knew that ,, i could have just as easily been playing a rick song -- and propably did -- those years are FUZZZY.
Rick was good friens with my mentor Kenny Gwynn, so I got to chill with Rick a few times. May he rest in Peace. Great guy1
it was a fair example
And Rick did sing "I shall be .." on the BANDs 1st album,--- ( a nickel if you know the title of the Ablum , w/o googleing)---- SO from an artist perspective , that made me sweat. Rick siting there ,, and I am at the time , only six months into my public performing carreer.
BTW :"released" was writen by Bob AND late Richard Munual the keyboard/piano player for the Band.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
To this day, John Fogerty does not own any rights to "Run Through The Jungle.
On the post: Can Someone Explain Why Circumvention For Non-Infringing Purposes Is Illegal?
Mike's point is that writers have seldom been paid much for copies of lyrics they've written in the past.
ANS:Which is a bizarre statement. They have , and will.
once written or created ART is owned by the Owner of the CopyRight
----
"++seldom +++been paid much for copies of lyrics they've written in the past."
ANS: the word "seldom" is unsubstantiated , and also untrue , and was the foundation of mike's premise. Mike said "almost never"
--------
If Market Post Creation is such a cool term , used by academics and economist , it would be all over Google results.
to intrude a term into a debate -- at the very end , and then refuse request to define it ,
and whose meaning known only to you -- if even ,
is intellectually dishonest when engaging in Honest Discourse.
Mike made up a B.S. term -- "market post creation" , to bamboozle his way out of admitting ::
that Mike's original post on the Lyrics thread was , a flat out lie , all nonfactual , grossly inaccurate;;;;;;;; and to use Mike's word : "SILLY."
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re: Re: The main difference would be that Lady Gaga almost certainly doesn't own the copyright in her recordings
But Read:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fogerty_v._Fantasy
"John Fogerty was the lead singer of the popular rock group Creedence Clearwater Revival.
In 1970, as part of CCR, he wrote "Run Through the Jungle," to which Fantasy, Inc., eventually acquired the exclusive publishing rights.
CCR disbanded in 1972, and Fogerty began a solo career with another music label.
In 1985, Fogerty published "The Old Man Down the Road", which he released on Warner Bros. Records.
Fantasy sued Fogerty for copyright infringement, claiming that "The Old Man Down the Road" was simply "Run Through the Jungle" with new words.
A jury found in favor of Fogerty, ( that is the point !!!!) and he sought attorney's fees as provided by the Copyright Act of 1976, [ which went all the way up to the SCOTUS.]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fogerty_v._Fantasy
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re: The main difference would be that Lady Gaga almost certainly doesn't own the copyright in her recordings
by Artist choice yes. But they SOLD THE RIGHTS.
And as Mike knows:
John Fogerty ( ofCCR) v. Fantasy Records -
Supreme Court of the United States.
Argued December 8, 1993.
Decided March 1, 1994.
Full case name, John Fogerty v. Fantasy, Inc. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fogerty_v._Fantasy .
Read and get back to me.
But as you will see the SCOTUS said , that even without holding legal copyright J.F. --the ARTIST-- still owns his personal reproduction of that ART for sale even.
Great Legal decision and very IMPORTANT to understanding Artist's natural rights.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Kenneth Walter Gwyn Re: Re: Re: Point of Information.// Danko had no right to your 25 cents since the song was written by Bob Dylan.
the Late great: Kenneth Walter Gwyn.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Respect is anything but natural.
I enjoyed this one.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
But yes if Paul asked to take my cover of Revolution #1 from my myspace page ,, I will
Quite honestly it is very unlikely this who happen ,, no mater who are the musicians involved -- rich or poor.
Songwriters -- at any level of fame and fortune -- love to see their songs played live and covered on recording. IT is the big kick , that means more than $$.
It is the reason why Art will outlive Money, in Utopia,,, ( -- ain't that right anarchists ?).
-----
as well, , Sometimes it is a good cover of a song , and you like it . And other times -- rarely I'd say -- you think some hack just destroyed the beauty of your song,
======
Money schmomey , between Musicians.
Yes, if the $$ gets big , the vultures,, err -- lawyers,, are there , but if there is little or no $$ , the composing Artist will usually let it slide, and tell his lawyers to feed elsewhere.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
I applaud you for at least providing some access to your music, however your choice of wording compelled me to comment.
ans: Thank you. Applause is always nice.
"however"
There is always a "but" , or "however" ,,,, I guess that is life on posting boards.
"your choice of wording compelled me to comment."
I did my job.
Pay me. :)
But again , really thank you for the applauds.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re: Re: Re:Don't forget. Madonna was a consummate businesswoman
But "the Material Girl" learned -- and learned very well --from those who went before her. David Bowie (esp.), Macca, Bob Dylan , ain't no slouches either .
she also has good copyright lawyers , and controls ALL.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
But you just said that it's okay for you to give away the Beatles' music, because you're not charging for it. So why can't I do that with your copyrighted material?
If there is no $$ it is academic.
But yes if Paul asked to take my cover of Revolution #1 from my myspace page ,, I will.
MySpace makes this clear when you upload.
( And Paul , I know you lost my phone number,, BUT i am stil getting your emails , for the beatles.com,, but you offer "No Reply" when I write back.)
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
This is what all of those collection societies are for.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re: Mike , Point of Information.
ans: I believe the law -- as it stand now in the USA--gives me 100% control , except fair use which is fair.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
The main difference would be that Lady Gaga almost certainly doesn't own the copyright in her recordings
Ans: I doubt that .
I would bet She made the decission on the song use , and it was hers to make alone .
THE point is also irrelevant to our dissussion as I see it-- but pleaee point out my mistake there if you see it .
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
What's your opinion of file-sharing, again?
That is why my file cabinet is locked. ( I also keep my booze in there. don;t want to boss or the cleaning crew to get it .)
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: I'm just here for my personal enjoyment.// but quite honestly , it that much fun.
======
{wheres my ciggie?}
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
I'm just here for my personal enjoyment.// but quite honestly , it that much fun.
I am here because i feel strong about Piracy and copyright law. and techdirt readers are mostly pirates (--- oooooohh , i here it now ,, but if the earbud fits -- wear it !! ---)
And I figured why not argue copyright law in the Pirates den.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
I download your music, and burn a new CD, to replace the broken one. Do you think this should be allowed?
Ask my lawyer.
but my ans. No . you break the pysical medim you bought from the RECORD COMPANY,, you by another.
Remember you are not just cheating the Recording artist and /or song writer,, but the Label , the producers , engineers, Visual Artists fo the record sleeve, the record store ,, to whole Music economy and their familes.
Every body knows that Rome fell because of Pirates --on land or at sea!!!! -- or now online.
Don't be a Pirate , be a legal sailor.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re: Point of Information.
Ans: For ME and my artisitc choice it is. It it like the fruit stand leaving out a few apples , for the homeless to "steal"
You want or need my art that much,, G-D bless you. Please come to gig to.
AND you can record the MP3 for free @ myspace
Download the orginal file Mp3 encoded with what ever i want , from the lyric to malware [sic] --for PAY @ amiestreet.
Or you could buy the CD from me.
===================================
Q; And that the extra effort must be put up by your fans?
All six of them. Again my Art . MY UNIVIERSE. You want it MY rules. Copyright Law. It is natural.
=====================================
2) What about Fair Use? Doesn't that limit what control you have?
Ans: Fair use is fair . But Fair use is only a quote or and excerpt,, or for educational purpose in limited circumstances. there may be other legal examples too.
===========================================
3) Say I bought a CD with your music. For the sake of simplicity, lets say I bought it in the normal fashion, and without any special 'limited time', or 'right to withdraw' clauses in the contract of sale. Say the CD Broke, got scratched, or was somehow otherwise damaged. To rectify this, I download your music, and burn a new CD, to replace the broken one. Do you think this should be allowed?
ans:
as i pointed out in the lyric thread last week:
I own the Art. you own the physical meduim. You sratch the CD , tough.
-----
in 1970 we bought Abby road on Vinyl.
in 1976 we bought the tape , because it vinyl wore out after 6930 plays.
Then the tape got eaten in the Deck ,
So I bought the tape several more times ,
Till the CDs cam out in the 1990s.
Bought that. ( I think you see where I am going )
Then the Beatles released re-mastered the CDs , thus leaving the earlier CDs useless to my audio file brain.
AND soon we will by the repressed vinyl of Abby Road Again.
(Still want that 25 cents Paul for my cover of Revolution ?)
AND AGAIN in 10-15 years we will , G-D willing , we will buy a mini analog disc of Abby Road , for our nano-tech-mini-analog- music player.
(MAMuPs)
=========
I need a ciggertte. ( please no comments on that , I get it from Mom all the time. It hand rolled organic tobbacco)
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re: Point of Information.// Danko had no right to your 25 cents since the song was written by Bob Dylan.
Rick was good friens with my mentor Kenny Gwynn, so I got to chill with Rick a few times. May he rest in Peace. Great guy1
it was a fair example
And Rick did sing "I shall be .." on the BANDs 1st album,--- ( a nickel if you know the title of the Ablum , w/o googleing)---- SO from an artist perspective , that made me sweat. Rick siting there ,, and I am at the time , only six months into my public performing carreer.
BTW :"released" was writen by Bob AND late Richard Munual the keyboard/piano player for the Band.
On the post: Lady Gaga Says No Problem If People Download Her Music; The Money Is In Touring
Re: Re:we should respect the artist's wishes.
always. with or w/o law. It is natural.
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