US Chamber Of Commerce Quickly Showing That It's Out Of Touch, As Google, CEA Consider Dropping Out
from the which-sector-creates-jobs? dept
We've been pointing out for a while just how incredibly out of touch the US Chamber of Commerce is these days. The giant lobbying firm (not to be confused with the US Department of Commerce -- a government agency), has consistently been taking a position that is anti-innovation, anti-growth and anti-jobs. It does this by supporting protectionist policies for just a few large companies who pay it a ton. It never supports innovative upstarts. Over the past few years, that's meant that it's been losing the true innovators, the companies who actually create jobs and contribute to economic growth today. Apple dumped the US CoC two years ago over its anti-science position on climate change. Yahoo recently refused to renew its membership out of disgust over the Chamber's position on PROTECT IP/SOPA. And now there are reports saying that both Google and the Consumer Electronics Association are considering dropping out of the Chamber over its support of PROTECT IP/SOPA. Kind of silly to call yourself the "US Chamber of Commerce" when all of the companies in industries that actually involve innovation are dropping your for your anti-innovation position, isn't it?
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Filed Under: e-parasite, protect ip, sopa
Companies: apple, cea, google, us chamber of commerce, yahoo
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not to be confused with local chambers either
The US CoC was taken over by Republican-associated lobbyists years ago and basically serves as a means of cloaking Republican party interests in a veneer of respectability.
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Re: not to be confused with local chambers either
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Re: Re: not to be confused with local chambers either
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Radicalism or reform? You decide
Vote reform
Electoral reform
Vote reform comes in finding a better process to elect people in office than the current First to Post system that allows for attacks on them to add votes without receipts.
Electoral reform allows for less money in politics so everyone can get a shot. It would restrict gerrymandering, allow for competitive races and not allow for safe campaigns that are currently the norm in this country. You have a 50-50 shot at being the next person in office. Why are the odds so far against a third party in this country? Get the money out of politics. Make it a requirement that only a certain amount can go in for all sides, and the federal government is barred from assisting anyone in the interest of fairness.
Here's hoping the OWS crowd exposes these two major problems that continue to plague the US. I have a strong feeling if you make one (voting) to work, everything else will line up.
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Re: Radicalism or reform? You decide
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Re: Re: Radicalism or reform? You decide
That's the basis for most of my information.
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Could the "US Department of Commerce" get into some sort of trouble with the "US Chamber of Commerce" for deliberately confusing trademarks.
(Yes, I know those are the wrong way around)
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Hopefully more players will leave them and not wait for the convenient answer of we just opted to not renew. That they will leave and make public statements that the CoC is just focused on helping a few members stifle innovation that scares them.
As more large players withdraw the CoC will have to try to spend even more money to help officials overlook they only represent those who refuse to embrace the future. And those officials will be in the sad position of having to justify why they support the people "donating" to them rather than the country.
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Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
But I submit that most Americans would rather have a strong copyright rule than unfettered access to all of the free content that Big Search and Big Hardware can serve up. Why? Because most Americans aren't lazy couch potatoes. They have jobs and they know that the creators are working hard. Just as they want to be paid, they know that the creators need to pay for health insurance, a roof and some food too.
Furthermore, most Americans understand that strong copyright favors them when they actually create something. Most Americans like to keep control over their creations. Oh, they're happy to share with things like the GPL or the CC license, but they want to be the ones to make the decision.
This blog believes that it's the billionaires at Big Search and Big Hardware who get to make unilateral decisions and keep all of the revenue that comes from their royal declaration that copyright doesn't hold in this case. They're doing something cool and that should be a "Get Out of Jail Free" card.
(Pay no attention to those crypto scientists doing something with DRM. That's not innovation. Nope. It can't be. Innovation is just a buzzword that applies to infringement.)
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Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Do you have a link to the study or survey which supports your claim that "most Americans would rather have a strong copyright rule than unfettered access"?
"most Americans understand that strong copyright favors them" I highly doubt this claim. You got anything in support of it?
Yeah - I didn't think so.
"This blog believes ... "
... in fair use
"Innovation is just a buzzword that applies to infringement"
And this is exactly what the PROTECT IP/SOPA people think.
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Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
These sites have nothing to do with free expression. They have nothing to do with fair use. They wouldn't even qualify for authorship under the Feist decision because they add so little to the world. They're pure leeches.
And it's easy to make a survey say whatever you want. I'm sure 95% of the people support an artist's right to choose what happens to their work. And I'm sure that 95% support the freedom to do what you want with your computer. The surveys prove nothing because they don't help us split the baby.
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
No amount of lying by the buffoon Mike Masnick will change that.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Thank you for your vote of confidence.
"ensoring is removing my material that I posted, not removing my material that you posted."
Yup - and screw fair use - amirite?
"No amount of lying by the buffoon Mike Masnick will change that."
Who is it that is attempting to effect change? Possibly you have lost sight of this tidbit - no?
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
You can see a troll from the distance.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
I eagerly await your well thought out response.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
How's that?
oh wait,
silly me, you were being willfully ignorant again...
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
How is any person supposed to know that the content creator didn't intentionally "leak" their own content? Some artists have come out in favor of having their content "pirated" which means that such "pirating" is de facto legal.
Not to mention fair use is only an American concept. Other countries have other laws and so Demonoid content may be legal in other places.
Also, fair use is only determined by a judge or jury in a court of law, so you can't genuinely say anything is or isn't fair use until it's been taken to court. Of course, RIAA lawyers have argued in court that home copying for backup purposes or format-shifting aren't even fair use (http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2006/02/6190.ars), so who is to trust an IP shill since they'll support any argument that involves them making more money?
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Ask any lawyer or judge.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Nobody is pointing out which Demonoid torrents are legal or illegal, and in which jurisdictions, and for which types of use, and nobody, except a court of law, can actually determine in every scenario for every uploader/downloader which actions are legal or illegal.
Real Example: Viacom actually uploaded some of the supposedly infringing content over which it later sued YouTube for hosting infringing content.
If even the copyright holder cannot be trusted to verify which content is infringing, how do you expect anyone else to just be able to look at it and say, "yep, this is definitely infringing" ?
And of course the IP maximalist answer would be, "if you don't know if it's legal, don't use it," but that would preclude the public from using a lot of content that is legally available for free or is used in accordance with fair use principles that would stand up in court if only the user had the endless bags of money from which to pay a lawyer to defend them from corporate legal strong-arming, simply because so much content gets passed around on the internet without a reliable copyright notice. Not to mention that a lot of people will claim copyright on content that isn't even theirs.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
If we need lawyers to determine what a sandwich is, then I'd say ignorance of the law is an excuse.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Hell, I tried to buy a game the other day for the sole purpose of testing my new PC. I don't need or want any more games. Nothing at the store interested me. Plus they had more used games than new ones. I want a new specs demanding game. I want to make this PC perform. I'll go back and try again later, not download off of torrents, where I get my Linux fixes from.
One thing I have noticed in my lifetime though, is that people accuse others of what they themselves do. People think everyone thinks as they themselves do.
Makes me wonder at some of the accusations that fly around here.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
You definitely need to step up your game. I believe Mr. Wilson has scored all the points.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
fair use - a common misspelling of "fare use," which involves a "pirate"/customer avoiding the payment of a fare for a use of IP that should otherwise be licensed through the proper channels for exorbitant sums.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
OK - let's frame the copyright enforcement regime so that that is ALL that happens-big content won't be happy with that.
The problem is that rightsholders are both lazy and greedy - they want to avoid the workload of actually sifting the infringing material from the rest and so they promote laws that will result in large amounts of collateral damage.
Plus "copyright infringement" is all too often used as a smokescreen for censorship - as numerous stories on this site attest.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
He just tries to spin things that way to rationalize himself and you breaking the law.
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Unsupported statements
Hey, this IS fun...
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Either share or don't share.
Then I can decide whether I want to donate $10 to Johny Depp or my Doctor. Whichever I value the most.
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Wrong. If you are shutting down a website, you are censoring the owner of that website from expressing their views.
Whether censoring the website is justified is an open question.
I'm even willing to admit that it is within the realm of possibility that censoring a website for copyright infringement could be a general societal good, although I want to see evidence or at least clearly logical reasons how and why.
But it is still censorship.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
The jails are filled with people who did nothing but talk about where and when and how to commit the crime instead of actually performing the act. They're called accessories to the crime and they're often given similar sentences.
Yet I'm sure you're such a believer in free speech that you see these folks as protected by the first amendment.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Last I checked, prisoners were in.. ya know... PRISON because of public policy changes causing more prison sentences and lengthening time served, e.g. through mandatory minimum sentencing, "three strikes" laws, and reductions in the availability of parole or early release.
But feel free to actually have a point rather than this BS you're spouting.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Yes, you are censoring the gangster for something he said.
It's censorship, and yes, the First Amendment does come into play. But let's look at the other facts:
1) This speech caused real harm - to another person's life, their family and friends were impacted, and there is the impact and resource cost to society. There is even the cost to the other gang members who carried out the orders, as they are presumably in jail.
2) Prior to the gangster being arrested, an investigation was conducted and evidence was gathered. This evidence must be of sufficient quality. Usually a district attorney would need to sign off on the police holding the gangster when he is arrested (depending on the case, sometimes before or shortly after the arrest).
3) Shortly after the gangster was arrested, he was put before a judge and the evidence was reviewed. The judge then decides whether to hold him, pending a trial, or to release him on bail. Bail is an interesting concept in and of itself - even if the judge thinks the evidence is sufficient for the gangster to probably be found guilty, the gangster still has a chance at freedom until the trial is actually completed - all bail is is a type of insurance that the gangster will be at the trial.
4) At trial, the gangster is allowed to refute any evidence gathered against him, and supply any of his own evidence. He can hire an expert lawyer to defend him, and even if he can't afford one, he is given a lawyer to defend him. A judge oversees the trial, and a jury of he gangster's peers (normal member of society) decides on his guilt or innocence.
5) After trial, even if he is found guilty, there are still possibilities of appeal.
We have decided as a society that all of these steps are absolutely necessary when the government wishes to deprive someone of the various freedoms they enjoy. This is necessary for even someone who has ordered the violent killing of another human being.
Yet you wish to deprive someone of their freedom of expression via SOPA for creating a website that cannot be positively shown to even cause the slightest monetary damage to a corporation, where no evidence is required, where no presumption of innocence exists, where no prior hearing is granted, in which private entities have all the power and decision making ability, and in which appeals seem unlikely.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Nope.
The "attempted XXX" or "conspiracy to commit XXX" crimes that you refer to require evidence of a substantial step in aid of the proposed crime/conspiracy. E.g,:
[1] it is not illegal to talk of killing your spouse. It becomes illegal when you contact someone with the intent of hiring them to kill your spouse. (Substantial step.)
[2] It is not illegal to talk about making meth, read how to make meth, or even to post his to make meth on the internet. However, if, coupled with these steps, you buy or attempt to buy the precursor ingredients you have performed a "substantial step" and can be charged with endeavoring to manufacture a controlled substance.
Even in terrorism cases, note how the Government infiltrator always encourages or facilitates an overt step towards the conspiracy, e.g. puts them in touch with a fake assassin, fake explosives dealer etc.
Attempted (name of crime) requires just that, some form of attempt. Just talking about it seldom if ever qualifies.
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
More like using a flamethrower instead of a flyswatter.
Sure, you might torch your own house and half the neighborhood, but the odds are pretty good that you'll get that pesky fly eventually.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
And this "big search" you keep talking about is just one company. Why not just say Google?
And some "big hardware" companies are also "big content" companies. I'd like to hear from Sony how their hardware business is decimating their content business through piracy. Why would they make devices that can pirate their own content? Because those devices have many, many uses - including you need them to access the content. Devices that facilitate piracy are called computers, very useful and versatile tools. Perhaps you'd also be happy with a law that destroys any computer that has pirated content on it? Such laws have been proposed.
You're trying to discredit us by saying all we want is free everything. What we really want is laws we can respect, a right to privacy and free expression, due process and judicial review, innocence until proven guilty, and blame placed on the actual criminals. You know, old-fashioned American ideals. The land of the free doesn't mean the price.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
For instance, think about how society gives out tickets to people who are caught speeding. A camera takes a picture and the plate is used to identify the car. Do people sit around and suggest that perhaps someone stole the car just as everyone around here seems to believe that a IP address is always used by someone other than the homeowner? If there are extenuating circumstances, a judge is ready to listen.
The same thing happens with most other crimes. The cops arrest and then the trial comes afterwards.
Yet around here, shutting down a web site with plenty of evidence is seen as some arbitrary move by a dictatorship. Nope. It's not much different from what happens to every other criminal around. The cops collect evidence and then they shut it down-- just as they collect evidence and arrest someone.
The line of argument is always the same-- any law that would hamper Big Search's actions is said to be terribly restrictive and what a Fascist would dream of imposing. In fact, any effort to do anything to an infringer is portrayed as evil and overly broad etc.
The fact is that the evidence indicting the IP address of the users is better than the evidence in cases where the defendant is sent away for life. Murder cases are decided with less certainty. Yet around here everyone assumes that an IP address means nothing.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
They have a practical mechanism to police file-sharing already. It's called the DMCA. It is also poor legislation that hampers individual rights, but it was already passed. When content owners see that their product is being used against their wishes, they can inform the site owner and have it taken down. The content owners are the ones that have a problem with specific use of a work, and they are the ones that should express this displeasure and file a request to have it removed.
"For instance, think about how society gives out tickets to people who are caught speeding. A camera takes a picture and the plate is used to identify the car. Do people sit around and suggest that perhaps someone stole the car just as everyone around here seems to believe that a IP address is always used by someone other than the homeowner? If there are extenuating circumstances, a judge is ready to listen."
Careful with this example because it actually goes against your argument. Speed cameras catch a vehicle, not a driver. Much like an IP address does not identify a person. Also, speed cameras are in place for the purpose of revenue generation not as a deterrent. There are no points assigned for this offense because it is impossible to determine who was driving. A small fine is issued to the owner (for state revenue generation), but there is no criminal liability.
"The same thing happens with most other crimes. The cops arrest and then the trial comes afterwards.
Yet around here, shutting down a web site with plenty of evidence is seen as some arbitrary move by a dictatorship. Nope. It's not much different from what happens to every other criminal around. The cops collect evidence and then they shut it down-- just as they collect evidence and arrest someone."
There are safeguards in place for the police to do their job and for the court systems to do theirs. One of these safeguards is called due process. The police cannot arbitrarily just arrest someone without evidence, and that evidence needs to be substantially more than simply at the request of a private citizen or organization. The current legislation is a clear attempt to circumvent due process, and this is one of the major reasons that people have issue with it.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Yeah, that's what I thought.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
I think a few will fall under the mascara definition as well. Herp derp.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Will it be used to target others? Perhaps, but not without bending the law to the point when it might break.
And I think you're hyperventilating by saying that every part of the Internet will "fall under the law" whatever that means. I don't know where you get this impression. Every blog I visit is filled with original content that was largely created by the owner. I rarely bump into infringing content because I don't frequent these sites. So I can't imagine it making a darn bit of difference in the aboveboard internet where people actually do their own work.
But I do know that the other sites are out there and I'm amazed that they can be so brash about their offerings. So I'm sure it will be nice to target them initially.
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Re: Re: Re: Tried to FTFY, but it's just too broken (gibberish generator on?)
These sites have nothing to do with free expression. They have nothing to do with fair use. They wouldn't even qualify for authorship under the Feist decision because they add so little to the world. They're pure leeches.
And it's easy to make a survey say whatever you want. I'm sure 95% of the people support a totalitarian's right to choose what happens to their subjects. And I'm sure that 95% support the freedom to do what you want with your computer. The surveys prove nothing because they don't help us split the baby.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Tried to FTFY, but it's just too broken (gibberish generator on?)
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Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
It is a shame that large corporations demand they be signed over for the creators "best interests" which seem to include making sure that payments are as low as possible to them.
And I doubt most Americans would enjoy the lengths that Big Media want to make sure that you have to pay everytime you might possibly see/hear/think about something they claim ownership of. That they do not want to have their access to the world limited to remove everything Big Media does not want you to know about.
Big Media fears a new platform where creators can completely manage their works and but them out of the process. That means more money for the content creators, is that a bad thing?
Try harder...
3/10
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Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Why are you anti-choice?
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Try getting a song on the radio without the RIAA, or a movie in the theatres without the MPAA, or a show on television. It used to be impossible. Now thanks to the internet it's slightly easier, which is why they're scrambling to control everything that happens on the internet with regards to their business interests.
I don't blame them - that's what they're supposed to do. I blame is people in Washington who seem content to do their bidding. I suspect the reason is that they love having mass media in the hands of a few major players, because it's make it easy for them to manipulate public opinion, and they can keep the major players for digging into their activities too deeply.
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Please point out where the partners of big content take the time to make sure payments owed goto the right people instead of just the big players.
We could have more choices for artists, if the big players were to stop stomping their foot and claiming any business model but theirs is based on infringement and stealing their content.
Choice, like the UK rapper who had his music taken down by a large corporation who wanted to buy the song for their artist but had not gotten the rights actually?
Choice, like anyone who wants to repeat the Beiber road to success. Perform other peoples music and put it on YouTube to get noticed. Except the labels will swat the files down claiming losses.
Choice, like doing everything they can to try and kill RedBox and Netflix despite the proven decrease in "piracy" these companies lead to.
Choice is supposed to be free, not legislated that you can pick one of the nearly identical companies who have monopoly control of the industry.
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
Your conception of choice is akin to, "worship me in heaven or burn in the hell of artistic obscurity."
Fortunately, the internet has open sourced the religion of art. Now artists can get a direct line to their audiences without having to go through a priest/middleman. The church of entertainment needs to adapt or give up the holy ghost.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
The fact is that distribution is expensive and so is advertising. I realize it may sound sucky to sign away 85% of the revenues to the people handling distribution, but the royalty structure is something that's evolved over a long time. Hundreds of thousands of musicians have tried to self-publish their own music and they often can't afford to invest in distribution or advertising. It's usually easier to shake a fist at the big corporation than acknowledge that it takes plenty of capital to get out the word about a new band.
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
-Sign up with Big Label, get ripped off.
-Go independent, get a bogus DMCA takedown on your stuff, and/or get Universal to claim they own your songs and royalties, and get every single channel that you could use to promote your stuff outlawed by RIAA.
Yeah, there would be choices if YOU DIDN'T ATTEMPT TO DESTROY the other choice constantly.
Oh hey, you don't have to vote for us, you can either vote for us or get shot. Choices!
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
The fact is that people like to share music with their friends and this creates a winner-take-all market as everyone congregates around whatever the mob chooses. It may tough to be a small band that's ignored by everyone, but it has nothing to do with bogus DMCA notices.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
So what happens when Youtube is held liable for everything their users upload? They'll stop letting their users upload anything, unless it's been approved by the major studios.
But this isn't just about Youtube. It's also about the next competitor to Youtube. What about the 3 guys in a garage building the next big thing? Are they gonna get venture capital once a law passes to make them liable for uploads?
And seriously, people still use MySpace?
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"Big Search and Big Hardware"
I do not think they mean what you think they mean...
Please explain how these monsters of industry are so powerful if not from a majority of the population purchasing and/or using their services and goods? Especially since they are the ones being targeted by the so-called "victims of piracy," who, as of yet, are the only ones who have successfully swayed Congress to create bills in their favor (when it comes to IP, anyways). They have pretty much only been thrown the bone that is the (unfortunately, most sensible bill since it was drafted) DMCA.
Which has the oh-so-terrible habit of not blaming the service provider for what it's customers do.
Awful, I know. Of course retailers and business-folks should be persecuted for what people do with their product.
Instead of just the folk who are actually doing the unlawful activity.
Hey, a guy last week rode a cab to the bank he robbed! Let's sue the cab company! They're enablers!
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Re: "Big Search and Big Hardware"
There are so many things that Big Search and Big Hardware could do to help the artists. They might insist that people use real accounts traceable to people before uploading. They might ask uploaders to fill out a form instead of insisting that creators jump through annoying DMCA hoops to get something taken down.
But no. Everything is meant to smooth the way of the pirate and every roadblock is arranged to annoy the person who actually did the work.
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Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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:D
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Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
bob,
I disagree with you, I think most Americans are happy to drop some change or maybe even a bill into an artist's hat or guitar case...until the economy tanks or they have to pay for their children to have braces. Then they walk by an think to themselves, "why doesn't this guy get a job?"
Your mistake is believing that because your art is the most valuable thing in the world to you, others MUST place equal value on it. We do not.
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Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Perhaps if you don't want to share you should not leave the house.
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Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
So close:
http://arstechnica.com/media/news/2010/03/60-of-americans-engaging-in-couch-potato-multitask ing.ars
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Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
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Re: Re: Yup, there's no way that Big Hardware and Big Search are out of touch
If anything search is regressing as they remove what used to be innovation. But Mike doesn't like to talk about that.
http://www.seochat.com/c/a/Google-Optimization-Help/Google-Drops-Plus-Sign-from-Search-Operators /
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That company is not doing well.
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Fears they can't make a logical argument.
is
Uncertain the spewing of distracting insults won't be enough.
and
Doubts they will be getting a bonus for making such a crappy post.
See, its all there...
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Here you go, sparky....
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Here you go, sparky....
Thanks for making my point numb nuts. Here is the sum total of Yahoo's comments on leaving the US CoC:
For Yahoo’s part, a spokeswoman would only say to MT that the company “has memberships with numerous trade associations and belongs to a number of organizations that promote a free and fair marketplace which enable Yahoo! to innovate on behalf of our more than 700 million users. As our membership renewal time neared and we reviewed our membership, we decided not to renew."
Maybe you can explain how this supports Masnick's FUD-based assertions like:
Yahoo recently refused to renew its membership out of disgust over the Chamber's position on PROTECT IP/SOPA. or this October 13 headline: Yahoo Dumps US Chamber Of Commerce Over Its Extremist Position On PROTECT IP
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But did you bother reading at the rest of the link? Everyone is pointing to odds over the legislation as the key reason Yahoo is leaving. Are you actually expecting a comment saying so to get through Yahoo's PR machine? Is that all that would satisfy you? A direct quote from Yahoo saying this is exactly why they're leaving?
I mean, just let me know if that's the case, because we can stop discussing this now. Such a requirement would NEVER be satisfied, true or not....
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You're welcome. I try to be charitable.
But did you bother reading at the rest of the link? Everyone is pointing to odds over the legislation as the key reason Yahoo is leaving. Are you actually expecting a comment saying so to get through Yahoo's PR machine? Is that all that would satisfy you? A direct quote from Yahoo saying this is exactly why they're leaving?
I'm just saying "who knows"? Maybe Yahoo asked the Chamber to seek certain language or modifications to the bill which were spurned. There's a lot of stakeholders currently (credit cards and ISP's mostly) stating that they will object unless other stakeholders are also held to a higher level of accountability. Perhaps Yahoo wouldn't have left if the payment processor role was enhanced. Nobody knows for sure, certainly not Masnick. But that doesn't stop him from making broad, sweeping pronouncements that are utterly unsupported by fact.
I mean, just let me know if that's the case, because we can stop discussing this now. Such a requirement would NEVER be satisfied, true or not....
The FACT is that Yahoo did make a statement. The FACT is that statement said nothing about "disgust" or the "extremist" position of the CoC. Hell, Yahoo never even referenced the bill. Yet Masnick's propaganda machine twists the Yahoo statement into something totally unrecognizable from what was actually said.
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First sentence: belongs to a number of organizations that promote a free and fair marketplace [emphasis added]
Second sentence: we reviewed our membership, we decided not to renew.
Ergo, the services of the US CoC do not promote a free and fair marketplace so we dumped 'em!
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First sentence: belongs to a number of organizations that promote a free and fair marketplace [emphasis added]
Second sentence: we reviewed our membership, we decided not to renew.
Ergo, the services of the US CoC do not promote a free and fair marketplace so we dumped 'em!
Even if accurate, where does "disgust" and "extremist" come into play? People enter and leave voluntary associations all the time depending on the alignment of their views and the views of the organization.
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Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but in a civilized society many choose to provide rational and supporting evidence for their conclusions.
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SLAP!
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RUN MIKE RUN!
You have a head start while he gets his pants back up.
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Well, duh!
And yet, it takes Google's loss of participation to make you think they've "lost touch?"
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Re: Well, duh!
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FTFY
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really nice
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