Who Sets Up An 'Innovation Forum' Hosted By A Guy Who Insists That Nothing Good Has Come From The Internet?

from the really-now? dept

Fri, Jan 25th 2013 10:24am — Mike Masnick

A few days ago, I received a surprise invitation to an "innovation forum" in Los Angeles to be held at the beginning of February. I have other commitments, and on such short notice, I couldn't attend, but in looking over the program, I was a bit surprised to see who's behind it:

I'm all for forums that discuss innovation -- and I think it's both helpful and important to have content folks and tech folks discussing innovation together (in fact, we've been doing exactly that ourselves). But... this still seems like a rather odd group of folks to lead an "innovation forum."

Universal Music's Lucian Grainge is the guy who, upon taking over that company, announced that CDs were a big part of its future. He's also the guy who has lobbied politicians directly for ISPs to spy on users and report to the labels if they thought someone was infringing.

Then there's Ari Emanuel, Hollywood's super agent, who (among other things) claims that Google engineers just need to invent a magic stop piracy button (he's sure they can do it). He also insists that cord cutting is a "myth." He's also clinging to the past, claiming that the movie business is all about DVDs (ignoring, of course, that the movie business once tried to kill the home movie business). Oh, and he was directly pressuring President Obama to put a three strikes plan in place.

And then there's Michael Lynton, the head of Sony Pictures. You may remember him from this lovely statement: "I'm a guy who doesn't see anything good having come from the internet. Period." Given a chance to provide a more nuanced explanation, he doubled down, insisting that fewer people will create content because of infringement (even as the data shows an explosion in new content). He's also claimed that piracy is killing the movie business, even as the box office continues to set new records every year.

Basically, if you had to pick three "innovators," I'd put these guys pretty close to the end of the line. All three of them have a history of not innovating, but pushing protectionist policies to hold back innovation and to promote legacy business models at the expense of innovators and innovation.

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Filed Under: ari emanuel, hollywood, innovation, innovation forum, lucian grainge, michael lynton
Companies: sony pictures, universal music, william morris endeavor

42 Comments

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Jeff (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 9:55am

Actually they are innovative...
Between them, they've come up with numerous innovative ways to be willfully blind to what is going on around them...
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:33am

Can you send someone in your place?
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Zakida Paul (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:35am

If there is a better definition of irony, I can't find it.

I imagine if anyone posts anything anti IP or pro Internet freedom that is an instant ban?
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jupiterkansas (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:36am

Let's hope they get schooled.
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Arsik Vek (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:36am

This isn't about innovation, it's about recon. If we find out where the innovation is going, we can start lobbying against it before it's even out!
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:39am

Are any real innovators actually going to that? I think it's either going to turn into an argument or lecture (coming from the legacy side).
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:44am

Can You say "Publicty Stunt".
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:44am

Well, they didn't state what KIND of innovation.
It's about innovation in gate-keeping and racketeering.
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Coogan (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:54am

I would say this is just another excuse for Hollywood-types to get together and slap each other on the backs. However, the logo suggests that actually they'll be getting together and performing fellatio on each other.
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:59am

All in the Subtitle
Innovation:
How do we stop it?
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Chosen Reject (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:00am

Re:
Every time there's an article about some panel where the panelists are all in favor of a general path but want to talk about details, the regular idiots here say that it's a bad panel because they don't have people who disagree with the general path. Perhaps they've decided they'll host their own panel where all the naysayers get together and hash out the details of stopping innovation.
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technomage (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:03am

3 people about anti-innovation, can we say the 3 Chinese monkeys of see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil?

I wish I was good enough at photoshop, because these three would be the perfect candidates for a picture of just that with a tagline of "Innovation".
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John Fenderson (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:10am

Re:
If the internet has taught me anything, it's that you don't have to be good at photoshop to make a funny picture.
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Capitalist Lion Tamer (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:10am

And then there's Will.I.Am, who will possibly bring an innovative hairdo.
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:18am

the reason, surely, is so as to make the case for their side of things, as usual, and not allow anyone much of a chance to decry their approach or advertise the way that innovation actually works. if no one joins Will.i.am on the innovation side, he's in for a hiding, if he even gets the opportunity to speak!
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Lowestofthekeys (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:28am

Re:
Bring or plagiarize?

;)
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Zos (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:30am

It's too bad you can't make it, that sounds like it would produce a weeks worth of content.
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Nick Dynice (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:38am

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/the-founders-forum-2013-innovation-forum-comes-to-los-angele s-187085411.html

Also in attendance will be a VP from YouTube, the founders of Spotify, Soundcloud and Songkick, some UK bureaucrats, a chairperson from Maker Studios, and Jimmy Wales.
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Dave, 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:42am

I'm actually quite disappointed that you're passing on this. Go in there and raise some hell! Those guys just aren't seeing this situation the right way, they think they are right and pirates are the enemy. Of course I don't realistically expect them to bail on millions of invested lobbyist money and that whole train but it really wouldn't hurt for someone who's extremely well informed to bend a few ears.
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PT (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:43am

It's just another example of regulatory capture.
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Rob (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:52am

Weird that they would use two F's in the shape of the Chinese character for mother. I wonder if there is some symbology dealing with mother and F's...
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 11:57am

It should be called the "Innovation for us not you" forums.
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DannyB (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 12:04pm

Three Monkeys
Three monkeys.
(with shameless copy/pasting from Mike's article.)

First we have Mr. See No Evil
Universal Music's Lucian Grainge
* the guy who, upon taking over that company, announced that CDs were a big part of its future
* the guy who has lobbied politicians directly for ISPs to spy on users and report to the labels if they thought someone was infringing

He can't see that:
* CDs are NOT a big part of Univeral Music's future
* only a court could determine if content online is actually infringement

Next we have Mr. Hear No Evil
Hollywood's super agent Ari Emanuel
* claims that Google engineers just need to invent a magic stop piracy button (he's sure they can do it)
* insists that cord cutting is a "myth."
* clinging to the past, claiming that the movie business is all about DVDs
* was directly pressuring President Obama to put a three strikes plan in place.

He can't hear what he doesn't want to hear:
* if Hollywood can't even determine whether online content is infringing, or fair use, or even authorized uploads, then how can Google determine this?
* court cutting is happening
* the movie business isn't about DVD's, but about making money from licensing and getting people to actually see movies
* that three accusations instead of actual proof should not be able to deprive anyone of an internet connection

Last but not least we have Mr. Speak No Evil
Michael Lynton, the head of Sony Pictures
* "I'm a guy who doesn't see anything good having come from the internet. Period."
* he doubled down, insisting that fewer people will create content because of infringement (even as the data shows an explosion in new content).
* also claimed that piracy is killing the movie business, even as the box office continues to set new records every year.

But it should be Speak No Good, because what he says sounds plenty evil to me.
But then wasn't it Sony who put rootkits onto everyone's computers in 2005? Oh, but that wasn't Sony Pictures.
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Jeremy2020 (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 12:15pm

It's amusing that Michael Lynton is so against the internet when SOE is all aboard the open user created content systems.

Seriously, they realized that they can't make a good MMO so they're letting the players do it.

Oh, I know why SOE isn't liked...it's one of the actual profitable parts of Sony.
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 12:19pm

Re: Re:
So they've gone for the Bender plan of innovation domination: "I'll make my own innovation! With blackjack! And Hookers!"
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Jasmine Charter, 25 Jan 2013 @ 1:16pm

Their definition...
It's all about DEFINITIONS... you see... their definition of Innovation is teaching consumers how to goose-step to the theaters and pay for crappy movies, then goose-step to the store and buy DVDs of crappy movies... then goose-step to the music store (are they even still around?) and buy a CD with 1 or 2 good songs and the rest of the crappy music on the CD... and then goose-step back home and watch and listen while sipping the Kool-Aid.
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dennis deems (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 1:27pm

Re:
If you can, you really should. The proceedings are sure to be amusing.
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Snooki rapes Justin Beiber, 25 Jan 2013 @ 1:31pm

Re: Re:
lol send CLT or Darkhelmet or both
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We are 140 grams to the ass records, 25 Jan 2013 @ 1:34pm

Re:
just use paint and cut&paste their heads unto some random picture of the 3 monkies
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�Qu�?, 25 Jan 2013 @ 1:39pm

Re:
i dunno i wouldnt go either, come on all these MAFIAA figures handing surprise invitations to a person who actively speaks out about their dirty dealings? sounds like grade A rapevitation and/or potential kidnapping to me
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Emil Ole William Kirkegaard, 25 Jan 2013 @ 1:55pm

Re: Re:
You mean "steal"? ;)
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Loki, 25 Jan 2013 @ 3:52pm

Innovation comes in many forms.

Techniques and methodologies, even if they essentially halt progress and inevitably shift our society back to a more feudal model, can still be highly innovative and creative.

It's just not the sort of innovation or creation the vast majority of society is looking for.
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 3:56pm

Re: Actually they are innovative...
hahahahahahahaha... sounds like they learned it from you!

your CES "Pro-Copyright" Panel that had no one representing artists and creators!

http://voxindie.org/CES-copyright-panel-no-artists

and uhm... yeah, there's this to from the CNET panel moderator explaining how he got duped by CES.

https://plus.google.com/112961607570158342254/posts/KHXXzA7ZY7E

Good job, Good Job!

Pot, Kettle, Black.
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nasch (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 4:04pm

Re: Re: Actually they are innovative...
your CES "Pro-Copyright" Panel that had no one representing artists and creators!

Except for the artist and creator who was on the panel.

there's this to from the CNET panel moderator explaining how he got duped by CES.

Or CEA just screwed up. That sounded more like incompetence than villainy.
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nasch (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 4:06pm

Re: Re:
Perhaps they've decided they'll host their own panel where all the naysayers get together and hash out the details of stopping innovation.

Perhaps so, but why not call it the "Protect Copyright" conference or something, rather than the "Innovation Forum"? I mean I'm sure they could come up with a good name that isn't the exact opposite of what they stand for.
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Mike Masnick (profile), 25 Jan 2013 @ 5:13pm

Re: Re: Actually they are innovative...
your CES "Pro-Copyright" Panel that had no one representing artists and creators!

I'll have to tell Hank Shocklee -- a member of the rock and roll hall of fame -- that he's not an artist or a creator.

Ditto John Perry Barlow, a long time member of the Grateful Dead.

That said, I actually agree that panel was poorly conceived and told the moderator and the organizers as much.

But this case is quite different. This isn't a panel, this is an entire event presented by three people who have been anti-innovation, claiming to be an "innovator's forum."
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 5:16pm

Re: Re: Actually they are innovative...
So they didn't have anyone from the RIAA? I'd say that's a good thing, hurricane head up your ass.
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Karl, 25 Jan 2013 @ 7:05pm

Re: Re: Actually they are innovative...
It's worth noting that the person behind "voxindie" is also behind the awful popuppirates.com site.
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Jan 2013 @ 10:49pm

Re: Re: Re: Actually they are innovative...
really mike, you need to read beyond the first paragraph...

Industry leaders confirmed to attend include: Daniel Ek, Spotify Founder; Robert Kyncl, Vice President and Global Head of Content for Google/YouTube... Jimmy Wales, Founder & CEO, Wikipedia; Ynon Kreiz, Ex-CEO/Chairman Endemol/Chairman Maker Studios;

yeah... no representation there, and they aren't even of the fake variety like barlow shlocklee...

FYI, barlow's "band" don't agree with him on copyright... but than again neither does googles own chief economist...

http://thetrichordist.com/2012/05/01/effs-john-perry-barlow-is-wrong/

jus sayin'
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Mike Masnick (profile), 26 Jan 2013 @ 12:51am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Actually they are innovative...
Industry leaders confirmed to attend include: Daniel Ek, Spotify Founder; Robert Kyncl, Vice President and Global Head of Content for Google/YouTube... Jimmy Wales, Founder & CEO, Wikipedia; Ynon Kreiz, Ex-CEO/Chairman Endemol/Chairman Maker Studios;

Yes, and there were plenty of entertainment industry folks who "attended" the panel at CES.

yeah... no representation there, and they aren't even of the fake variety like barlow shlocklee...

Shocklee is a "fake"? Really now?

You're delusional.

FYI, barlow's "band" don't agree with him on copyright... but than again neither does googles own chief economist...

Heh. That's wrong on so many levels it's not even funny.

jus sayin'

That you have no idea what you're talking about? Yes.
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The Real Michael, 26 Jan 2013 @ 6:01am

Re:
Read between the lines. It's not so much about who's attending the event, it's about who's hosting it. What we have here is the content industries putting on a fake presentation about something they've fought to destroy for the past several decades. Oh, but expect to see them proudly touting this 'innovation forum' in their future PR statements and lobbying efforts, as if just by hosting this (vapid) forum, they're granting themselves credibility where they have absolutely none.
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