MAGA 'Freedom Phone' Targets Rubes With Dubious Promises Of Privacy
from the one-born-every-minute dept
If you hadn't noticed, there's been no shortage of dodgy folks attempting to cash in on the MAGA craze. There's also been no shortage of folks eager to cash in on the generalized animosity against "big tech" driven by bogus claims of "Conservative censorship" (aka: people being held vaguely accountable for being racist assholes on the internet via clumsy Silicon Valley moderation practices that don't work well at scale).
Enter the $500 Freedom phone, a new device being targeted at MAGA devotees promising an "uncensorable App Store," all your favorite right-wing apps preloaded, and promises that users can take "back control" from big 'ole mean big tech.
Amusingly there's no real detail anywhere on the website in terms of specs or build, meaning users have no real idea what they're actually signing up for. But when The Daily Beast had somebody take a closer look at the device, they found it was likely a Chinese-made A9Pro (retail: $120) running a modified version of Google's Android OS dubbed "FreedomOS":
"Freedom Phone appears to be a simple rebranding of a budget phone called the “Umidigi A9 Pro,” made by the Chinese tech company Umidigi. In an interview with The Daily Beast, Finman confirmed that the Freedom Phone was manufactured by Umidigi, but couldn’t say immediately which Umidigi phone it was based on.
The Freedom Phone’s $500 price tag would represent a substantial markup on the Umidigi A9 Pro. That phone is available on Chinese retail giant AliExpress for $120 — less than one quarter of the price of a Freedom Phone."
The phone in question appears to be one of several discounted Android phones with insecure configurations that are vulnerable to a long list of trivial vulnerabilities. The low cost, high-customizability of such phones make them more vulnerable than more expensive options, and less likely to see consistent security updates. In short, the Freedom phone appears to not only be an overpriced version of a fairly underwhelming phone, it potentially makes its customers more vulnerable to the type of spying and government surveillance they're being told they're avoiding.
In a post to Twitter, the phone's creator proclaims the phone is "the first major pushback on the Big Tech companies that attacked us - for just thinking different." Though as several Twitter users were quick to point out, a completely unmoderated or managed app store means it's easy for any random idiot (or government) to launch a bevy of privacy-violating and malware-laden apps designed to hoover up your personal details:
Nice! An Android phone with an App Store that doesn’t check for viruses or malware in the apps!
This is awesome!
I wonder how hard it would be to put an app up that allowed a foreign power to spy on your freedom phone?
99% of the apps will be porn!
— Texas Born and Raised Texan (@feloneouscat) July 14, 2021
As Gizmodo notes, the ironic part is there's ample resources for folks genuinely interested in freeing themselves from Google and Apple. There's massive online communities designed around letting you bypass the Android/iOS gatekeeper logjam, often for a fraction of the cost of the Freedomphone. The Linux-based Pine phone, for example, offers a significantly cheaper option with greater transparency into what you're actually buying. The /e/ Foundation also sells refurbished and "de-Googled" discount phones that are likely notably more secure at a lower price point (with caveats).
Of course this all assumes that you genuinely care about privacy and aren't just gesticulating wildly based on a bunch of bullshit fed to you by a NYC real estate conman with a terrible combover.
Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.
Techdirt is one of the few remaining truly independent media outlets. We do not have a giant corporation behind us, and we rely heavily on our community to support us, in an age when advertisers are increasingly uninterested in sponsoring small, independent sites — especially a site like ours that is unwilling to pull punches in its reporting and analysis.
While other websites have resorted to paywalls, registration requirements, and increasingly annoying/intrusive advertising, we have always kept Techdirt open and available to anyone. But in order to continue doing so, we need your support. We offer a variety of ways for our readers to support us, from direct donations to special subscriptions and cool merchandise — and every little bit helps. Thank you.
–The Techdirt Team
Filed Under: android, censorship, china, erik finman, freedom phone, maga
Reader Comments
The First Word
“Unfortunately, we'll be cleaning up the mess. Again.
I completely understand the general sentiment that the people who buy into these scams are getting what they deserve. Unfortunately, as is the case in most of these kinds of situations, someone has to clean up the mess afterward. When mom, or grandpa get scammed, the kids are going to have to figure out how to cover the loss, and deal with the anger/heartache/anxiety. I am not smart enough to know how to fix any of this, but I do feel that we only have so much capacity to bail out the willfully stupid. It is tempting/easy for me to feel that anti-vaxxers who get Covid, and freedom phone buyers who get scammed etc., are getting their just desserts, but I also can't help but feel that when the check is finally brought to the table that we going to be the only ones left to pay. Grim.
Subscribe: RSS
View by: Time | Thread
"We're finally taking back control and freedom... with a phone made in a country who we routinely demonize as an enemy of the free world."
I know Republicans and the far right have all the self-awareness of a goddamn tomato, but yeesh...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
It's the perfect storm of grift, a bitcoin scammer pretending he's the next Steve Jobs and a Silicon Valley tech expert, teaming up with right wing griftosphere celebrities to use the grandparent scamming skills he picked up in the crypto world to scam elderly racists in a new way. The people he's scamming are too dumb to notice all the people singing the praises of his phone are doing so from iPhones or better android handsets, using mainstream social media to boot, not Gab, Parler, Hitlr or whatever other new right wing safespace has sprung up this week.
Imagine being so racist and desperate to use the N word on social media you'll buy a phone just so you can use an app store where 'no quality control' is used as a selling point.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Do they come pre-infected with the "China-virus?"
The Dunning-Kruger is strong with these folks.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Freedom phone, because iSafespace would probably get them sued by Apple.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
But Karl... "gesticulating wildly" never goes out of fanshion.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Market Failure
This is precisely why Trump got elected. There is huge demand for this kind of product, such that some people are willing to throw money at it. It's kind of a shame that major manufacturers aren't willing to fulfill it, and now privacy interests and censorship interests must clash.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
I often wonder what it would be like if I didn't have morals. I seem to recognise that same stupidity, cluelessness and jingoism that drives Trump voters, but my instinct is usually to ignore or help them or at least try exposing them to the facts that would clue them into how they're being conned.
I'd probably be quite rich if I defaulted to fleecing them instead. This is just another example - sell a rebranded phone that took you a day (if that) to prepare the images for at a 300-400% markup. Very easy if you don't have any qualms about the morality of selling below par merch to people dumb enough to fall for it because you branded it with a nonsense buzzword.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Market Failure
So you are proposing that Trump got elected to help with the "gesticulating wildly" ? I suppose that's not actually the craziest thing I've heard.
Not sure how private companies would cash in on that though. The market might be large, but envisioning a product... seems kind of difficult to me.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Market Failure
Isn't it funny how big tech censorship only really became a problem for conservatives in the past couple of years, after Trump's election in fact. It's almost like they became emboldened enough by his constant rulebreaking to believe they're entitled to be able to ignore the rules of any platform they join because they're conservatives and deserve special treatment. They're somehow the silent majority, who never shut up, and an oppressed minority, who are unable to point at any genuine oppression they face... Not being able to openly stamp on the rights of actual oppressed minorities doesn't count.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Market Failure
There is huge demand for this kind of product, such that some people are willing to throw money at it.
A Chinese phone with no posted specs and a roughly 350% markup, an 'uncensored' app store that can presumably let you decide whether or not to install malware (because freeze peach), a port of multiple Android OSes (I'm sure Google is laughing), and a website that looks like a generic Shopify site that does nothing except let you order the phone...yeah, that sure is freedumb.
It's kind of a shame that major manufacturers aren't willing to fulfill it, and now privacy interests and censorship interests must clash.
I love the willingness to give up privacy in exchange for 'no censorship.' It just cements the opinion I have that you 'conservatives' are some stupid motherfuckers.
This is precisely why Trump got elected.
I agree - if not for half the country being the mental equivalent of a potted plant, he would've lost twice instead of once.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Market Failure
He never won the popular vote, but America does love land counting more than people.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
"It's the perfect storm of grift, a bitcoin scammer pretending he's the next Steve Jobs and a Silicon Valley tech expert, teaming up with right wing griftosphere celebrities to use the grandparent scamming skills he picked up in the crypto world to scam elderly racists in a new way."
No matter how often this shit happens I still can't wrap my head around how weirdly gullible the alt-right ends up being. The only reason scams like this show up targeting the adherents of Dear Leader is because an entire demographic has grown up deranged.
And I have to ask; How? I've seen this farce play out. I've seen the US right-winger go from stodgy to utterly nucking futz. And I still don't get how such a vast mass of benighted morons keep falling for stunts like funding Steve Bannon's fraud wall, funding Trump's..."lawyer" fees, or shit like this insecure phone.
It must be something in the water because sure as hell none of this shit could reasonably happen anywhere else...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
three of the last five GOP presidents entered the white house without ever winning the popular vote: Gerald Ford, George W. Bush, and Donald Trump.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Market Failure
"There is huge demand for this kind of product..."
A scam product at massive markup so the user can avoid...oh, sideloading the apk's they want which they can already do on ANY android phone?
That's like saying that people who have modern cars must also buy, at ten times the price, a rent-a-wreck with a new paint job sold by a shady used car dealer.
Truly, Koby...your assertion that Trump voters are all gullible sheep throwing good money after bad to obtain what they already had...is duly noted.
I doubt that's the argument you wanted to make but it's the one you made.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
"his is just another example - sell a rebranded phone that took you a day (if that) to prepare the images for at a 300-400% markup."
And - lest we forget - works the same as ANY other android phone except that it has "Allow sideloaded apk's" switched on by default.
You know, PaulIT...you can call me paranoid if you like but I'm not sure these good folks are getting their money's worth...🤔
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Market Failure
Trump got elected because a ton of people wanted certain policy positions, which weren't being fulfilled by anyone from either mainstream party. Despite his past reputation, and having never held office before, and also having nearly every media outlet denouncing him, he was still chosen. This phone is nearly the same: many people still want these features in a product so badly that they might disregard everything else.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
You can't blame Trump for the popular vote. Hillary made the decision to win NY and CA in a landslide. Despite her local campaign managers on the ground in states like MI and WI begging her to shore up support, she couldn't be bothered to campaign in those flyover states, and risk getting put on the spot in a politically hostile environment with the cameras rolling.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
"It's the perfect storm of grift..."
They should have named it "The GriftPhone". The suckers would still be lining up.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Reading your article, it seems to me that there is a market for this device even amongst people who aren't racist shitheads. The freedom to have properly expandable memory that remains accessible even if I forget my password or undergo an amputation? Yes, please! That's why I'm still running Jellybean, the last usable version of Android. Have a break, have a skeet shoot. It's all Android <s>KitKat</s> <s>Lollipop</s> <s>Marshmallow</s> <s>Nougat</s> <s>Oreo</s> Pie is good for.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Market Failure
Watch out there, AC, you might get censored for giving potted plants a bad rap.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re:
There's nothing weird about the Alt-right's gullibility. The gullible (with a right-ish political lean) are precisely the demographic who were attracted tot he Alt-right movement in the first place.
And as for none of that shit being possible anywhere else, well if you believe that you really don't know much history. It is rather common. From death-cults to dingbat political movements to sex-free religious movements, this sort of nonsense is actually rather frighteningly common in our species.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
This phone is nearly the same: many people still want these features in a product so badly that they might disregard everything else.
I'm sure they know Umidigi's (you know, the folks that manufacture the phone) headquarters is in (wait for it, Koby....) Shenzen, which is where?
You fucking guessed it, you simple-minded littlebrain! China! It even comes with the 'China virus' pre-installed a no extra cost! So if you're looking to support 'Murica, and buy local, what better phone than one made in the place you want all Asians to go back to?
So yeah, disregard supporting the Communist regime (commies are bad) in the name of Freedum! Don't worry about an app store that will allow you to install anything you want. I'm sure anyone looking to hack you good, Christian people would never be brave enough to go up against the freedumb phone!
Seriously though, do you people really think that being this obtuse somehow 'owns the libs?' Because between this and the anti-vaxx folks having the freedum to contract their Covid, I'm starting to think there's a contingency of you that think a 'Darwin Award' is some kind of prestigious honor.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
And like with him they're getting what they bargained for: being ripped of. Nicely done.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
As Ford never won a presidential (or vice-presidential, if it comes to that), he's a bit of an anomaly for this list. The one time he did stand, he lost.
He entered the white house without facing the electorate - so how could he have won the popular vote? You could equally well say he entered the white house without losing the popular vote.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Market Failure
There, right there - sideloading. Of course Alt-rightists don't want to follow that path, They would have to do the one thing that they hate above all else - actually think,
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Perhaps. But let it not be said that tech companies are willing to cater to market demands. They would rather lose money and play politics, than make money if it allows a dissenting message.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Good for them…
I used to be concerned about scammers ripping off people and selling dangerous products and shady cures…
But… I dunno about that concern anymore with this lot.
The MAGA crowd are so determined to drag everyone to hell with them, I kinda don’t really have ANY sympathy for them… they beg to be ripped off by their willful blindness and quadrupling down on stupidity… they revel in their stupidity and are proud of it.
I almost want to applaud the scammers because these fools are literally lining up to be fleeced, so why not give them what they want?
Isn’t that what they themselves keep crowing about?… a free market with NO rules and zero regulations or responsibility?
So… fuck em.
They are so aggressively stupid they are fighting to get infected with a highly transmissible virus, which has a readily available vaccine… but they want to only follow their MAGA celebrities advice and reject it… despite the fact that most if not all of these celebrities have been quietly vaccinated themselves regardless of their rhetoric.
I stopped being concerned when it involves the MAGA folks wellbeing… They are right up there with suicide bombers as far as I’m concerned… they want the world to burn if they can’t have it their way and they only care about winning not how much carnage they cause.
The whole conservative movement has been a complete and total scam from day one, a way of getting stupid people to hand over their money and rights so their “team” can win.
If I had far less ethnics and self respect I’d happily join the grift because it’s just super easy money they want to give you for telling them what they want to believe…
If someone wants to give you a $100 to tell them their shirt looks nice, would you turn it down?
I don’t honestly blame the scammers, it’s easy money from easy marks.
I know that all sounds cruel or heartless, but how much sympathy can you have for people who have no concern for anyone else and continually keep acting against their own self interests?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
But let it not be said that tech companies are willing to cater to market demands.
What demands? Isn't the Freedom Phone supposed to be sticking it to big tech, as they are the problem? I mean, it uses Android (so there's some Google in there, who I thought was big tech). And the phone is made in China, a place I thought you wanted certain people to go back to, and who you think is responsible for Covid.
Are you saying that big tech isn't catering to people who don't care about their privacy, so they can be spied on by the damn libs while paying 3 times as much for a commie-made phone that's got Covid all over it?
That's an interesting 'market' you're talking about, for sure.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
MAGA...America First...with a phone made in China?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
By and large, conservatives are taught to hate facts, science, and those who teach them. (To wit: the Religious Right.) To such people, certain authorities can be trusted—so long as they’re conservative/hate the right people. But everyone else is a dangerous leftist radical or somesuch. It’s a big reason why many conservative opponents of Critical Race Theory can’t accurately explain what it is: They don’t need to know what it is (i.e., read about it from factually accurate sources), so long as the Trusted Voices “know” CRT is “evil”.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
They would rather lose money and play politics, than make money if it allows a dissenting message.
Which 'dissenting messages' would those be again, and as always be specific.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Porn phone
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Demands for uncensored communication.
Google or Apple could be charging hundreds of dollars per phone for such a product, but they choose not to.
Unfortunately, the Made in America smartphone is unavailable from any manufacturer, so that was never an option.
I'm saying people are willing to pay money and sacrifice their privacy in exchange for freedom.
Better watch out, or else Jen Psaki is going to have you censored for coronavirus misinformation!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Guilt-free scams, gotta love 'em
Fleecing gullible fools by massively overcharging them for a chinese(strange how now they trust China...) phone with little to no security and an app store that will be loaded up with malware, spyware and just outright viruses in short order, all because because they really want a place where they can let their bigot flags fly without being told to behave or get out?
Stupidity should be painful and it sounds like the MAGAts will be feeling the sting in short order because they were stupid enough to fall for the latest scam to be aimed their way, the only thing better is that you can be damn sure that even after this comes crashing down they will fall for the next con, and the next con, and the one after that so long as the person fleecing them tells them they're sticking it to [insert group to hate here].
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Please name the people Jen Psaki censored for coronavirus information. Be absolutely specific in the details of who this happened to, when this happened, and what she said to make it happen.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
Well, there have been other options for ages. But you'd rather pay a huge markup on a shitty piece of hardware and an OS that is full of security holes? This one is a scam on racist shitheads, who are buying into a really thin image made entirely of bullshit, so idk about your claims. Maybe that utter douchebag is just attractive to some people, could that be another reason?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Demands for uncensored communication.
Your phone doesn't censor your communications. The websites you choose to visit or the apps you choose to run do, including Parler, GETTR, and Frankspeech (someday).
Google or Apple could be charging hundreds of dollars per phone for such a product, but they choose not to.
Or maybe they think that a shitload of rubes who think big tech's the devil aren't worth the effort. Big tech making a phone for anti-big tech folks doesn't sound like a good marketing plan to me. But hey, if you want to try and sell that to the bank, by all means! It's a good avenue to start a victimhood campaign against big banks not catering to loans for stupid ideas.
Unfortunately, the Made in America smartphone is unavailable from any manufacturer, so that was never an option.
I totally understand. After all, is there anything you America first folks have ever made yourself?
I'm saying people are willing to pay money and sacrifice their privacy in exchange for freedom.
Well hey, being a simple-minded fool willing to make that trade is yours to make. I mean, they'll still be blaming the libs when their phones are hacked, or someone knows just a little too much about what they're looking at because they gave up privacy. So it's really of little consequence to the overall argument. Hell, I guess folks like you consider doing something stupid and blaming it on something other than you being stupid is probably just a bonus feature.
Better watch out, or else Jen Psaki is going to have you censored for coronavirus misinformation!
Not worried about that one bit. After all, there's so many simple minded rubes I can count on to come to my defense, because freeze peach. Right Kobes?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Readily available if you choose where you comment, or run your own blog. Demanding use of a particular site is a demand for an audience, or an ability to directly attack people on the basis of their politics, sexuality, lifestyle or race.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
FUCK OFF KOBY!!!!
You know god damn well that this isn't happening!! But you are going to use it over and over and over and over again thinking you are some sort of clever conservative fighting censorship.
How can somebody become such a human POS?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re:
Iv watched this also for many years.
But its on both sides, not just 1.
WE have many people who are taught to Listen/obey/ not question, what is being said.
It tends to be abit of indoctrination.
For all the peace, love and joy, there is one other word I hate. HOPE.
If you never do anything, except hope, nothing gets done. you Hope to find a person who will give you hope.
Dont teach people How to get things done. Teach them the least they need to Survive.
The first thing you look for is a person making Promises. Not understanding that Promises dont amount to much. And that 1 person isnt enough to get things done. Not the president, change the congress, change the State congress's, to get things done.
We have raised a nation of yes men, that do little and just smile while the Corps slowly take over everything.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Better watch out, or else Jen Psaki is going to have you censored for coronavirus misinformation!
Well we've got nothing to worry about since you and your fellow rubes will be right behind us yelling freeze peach!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
My strongest argument
Stephen Stephen Stephen.
Everyone knows when, where and why it happened. You can deny it all you want and it won't change what happened.
tldr: I deny your reality and substitute my own.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
If it had been Trump vs Anyone but Hillary, I believe that Trump would have lost the election.
The second election supports that conclusion. Should have just ran Biden the first time and we would never had a President Trump.
Hillary provided the perfect storm.
I see two groups of stupid here.
tldr: The group who decided to run Hillary are the people that gave Trump the Presidency.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Unfortunately, we'll be cleaning up the mess. Again.
I completely understand the general sentiment that the people who buy into these scams are getting what they deserve. Unfortunately, as is the case in most of these kinds of situations, someone has to clean up the mess afterward. When mom, or grandpa get scammed, the kids are going to have to figure out how to cover the loss, and deal with the anger/heartache/anxiety. I am not smart enough to know how to fix any of this, but I do feel that we only have so much capacity to bail out the willfully stupid. It is tempting/easy for me to feel that anti-vaxxers who get Covid, and freedom phone buyers who get scammed etc., are getting their just desserts, but I also can't help but feel that when the check is finally brought to the table that we going to be the only ones left to pay. Grim.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
Just like their America First hats, flags, shirts....
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: My strongest argument
And where's your evidence?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
You say that like it is a bad thing. News flash: we are living in a post-scarcity system running on capitalism. This is only sustainable by selling stuff to people that isn't matching actual needs but imaginary ones.
It's not "Market Failure" but the market working well doing what it's best at, matching manufacturers and buyers.
The good that is being manufactured and sold is not the Freedom Phone (that's just the medium) but the accompanying alternate reality. It's not really a seismic shift in marketing principles, if at all a bit of finetuning.
If you think there is more to it, I have a presidential reinstatement to sell you.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: A broken koby is right once a month
“This is precisely why Trump got elected. There is huge demand for this kind of product.”
An obsolete, barely functional shitbox, embedded with foreign government spy(ware), that actively promotes its flaws as advantages, and tows an entire fleet of low class grifters and con artists, is pretty on brand for Trump.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
bursts into laughter
I'm still waiting for the townsfolk to stop listening to the little boy who is crying wolf just to get them to pay him to save them.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
“Better watch out, or else Jen Psaki is going to have you censored for coronavirus misinformation!”
So do your get paid by the right wing hot topic or is it by keyword count?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: My strongest argument
I assume the AC to whom you're replying is being sarcastic.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Good for them…
My sister who is an emergency doctor living in Miami (don't worry, she's not a Florida Woman; she's one of the good ones) had this to say about the MAGA morons refusing a vaccine and getting infected:
I think that proverb best describes Anti-Vaxxers and MAGA folks.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
I suspect that barring some very rare exceptions anyone who is still in the cult at this point is in it for good with any bad things that happen to them as a result simply blamed on The Other just like always since their Dear Leader or his disciples would never lead them wrong.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Theres a sucker borne every minute, buying a cheap android phone is risky
as its vunerable to spyware or malware being installed without the users knowledge
other flagship phones ,samsung etc promise security updates for at least 2 years .
but then we have seen that right wing extremists seem to be easily duped
and are not very careful in taking basic security measures on phones
and what apps they use .
make america great by buying cheap phones made in china ?
as shown with the peagasus software theres some programs that are so dangerous they should be made illegal, it works on android and iphones and
is sold by a israeli company,
and its used to spy on politicans ,human rights activists and journalists
its being sold to government agencys in india ,hungary, and other countrys
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Critical Race
Ah. So not this Critical Race, https://s2.smu.edu/~mitch/ftp_dir/pubs/mwscas05.pdf
" A race is a situation in which two or more signals are changing simultaneously in a circuit. A critical race occurs when an incorrect state is assumed to be stable due to the race."
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Better watch out,
or else Jen Psaki,
is going to have you
censored for corona malarkey
Joseph Biden's comin' to town!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
"If it had been Trump vs Anyone but Hillary, I believe that Trump would have lost the election. "
Agreed. But OH NO!!! It just HAD to be Hilary.
Please pick the right person for the job.
If the Democrats really want to stick it to the Republicans, consider that it's possible that America's first FEMALE President is also likely to be BLACK!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: MAGA
Make America GRIFT Again
[ link to this | view in thread ]
"a ton of people wanted certain policy positions"
Trump got elected because a ton of people felt threatened by the growing diversity, and were too attracted to someone who expressed the white power sentiments by expressing the quiet parts loudly and blatantly. Trump wasn't trying to be unsubtle, he just can't help but blurt everything out.
He also got elected because of the Electoral Collage but that's a different problem.
Yes, early in Trump's election when the data wasn't in we were assuming people were voting for the monster to rebel against their hand being forced. No one wanted another neocon, so they voted for the Obvious Nazi.
But that turned out to be a tiny percentage of voters. It turns out most of them just liked being able to use the n-word openly and to suggest we should outright exterminate the underclasses.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Nobody believed Clinton was popular. But she was the better choice for president in comparison to Old 45. That she lost the Electoral College is less an indictment of Hillary and more an indictment of a system designed to favor landmass over people in terms of whose votes matter more.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: My strongest argument
I hope so. Because if that's the case, then my sarcasm detector needs a major overhaul due to the last 4 years or so.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Good for them…
I pretty much have to agree with your sentiments, but I'd change one thing, or one word, most of the time. Instead of stupid, I'd call them a pack of willfully-but-covertly racists. Remember, more than a few of our national business icons/tycoons/etc. were racist, many of them outright with their beliefs. Yet they are held in high esteem for their contributions to society. Stupid they were not.
Still, this ass-wipe has a market of over 73 million suckers (smart or stupid, sucker-ism knows no boundaries), so I'm making book that he'll be brought up short for either fraud (misrepresentation) or because Q will accuse him of being an under-cover "radical lib" who is secretly collecting info on "us true American patriots". Any takers?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
"Demands for uncensored communication."
You mean demands that someone else host their uncensored communication on a privately owned platform, for free, despite agreeing to follow a simple set of rules on behavior. Sounds perfectly reasonable...
"Google or Apple could be charging hundreds of dollars per phone for such a product, but they choose not to."
Companies don't get anywhere near as successful as Google or Apple by selling a product that is a security and privacy dumpster fire. This phone will crash and burn.
"I'm saying people are willing to pay money and sacrifice their privacy..."
...and their bank account. And identity.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Good for them…
You can lead a MAGAt to facts, but you can't make them think.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re:
"And as for none of that shit being possible anywhere else, well if you believe that you really don't know much history. It is rather common."
Not at this scale. What history tells me is that even Germany in 1933 could only get 12% of the german voters to be blind enough to actually vote for the bohemian corporal. Mass hysteric cults like Aum Shinriko, the swiss sun cult, or the infamous potassium-flavored kool-aid congregation are small and localized.
So when I say "nowhere else" I'm saying that in no other nation would you find some 25-30% of the citizenry subscribing to this sort of deranged lunacy. Not, at least, post renaissance.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Critical Race
I foresee a number of republican electrical engineers suddenly failing their courses hard.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: My strongest argument
"...my sarcasm detector needs a major overhaul due to the last 4 years or so."
Because the social space of the US crowned Nathan Poe their undisputed king in that time period.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
"They would have to do the one thing that they hate above all else - actually think,"
Not even that. There are a hundred how-to guides for dummies online capable of teaching even challenged 8-year olds how set an android phone to accept apps from outside the app store in four easy steps or less.
Most of these benighted lackwits perform more complex operations every time they check the tire pressure on their truck.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re:
"I suspect that barring some very rare exceptions anyone who is still in the cult at this point is in it for good..."
...or until Dear Leader leaves the public eye for long enough for them to latch on to whatever next strongman or grifter replaces him at the head of the alt-right pyramid. It's like watching a GOP version of the phenomenon of the six-week wonder among teen idols.
I suspect the people following Trump are the same people who blindly followed GWB. It's the sort of cult where the actual leadership can be replaced with the same ease with which a teenager switches iPhone cases. As long as the core message remains - own the libs and fear the other - the identity of the bullhorn is less important, only providing a current face to aim the adulation at.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re:
"I suspect the people following Trump are the same people who blindly followed GWB"
I'm not so sure about that. W was popular as much because he had an R after his name, and because he happened to be president during a time where the binary "us vs them" narrative was popular, in terms of the US vs everyone else.
Trump, on the other hand, seems to have developed a cult that goes way beyond that, where if you're not the "MAGA" type of American then. you are also the enemy, including if you are a Republican. Witness their reaction to Liz Cheney. The outrage over Obama being elected followed by the "oh, we can say that stuff out loud now?" revelation that occurred during Trump's term have unleashed something different from the "I'll support anything with an R after the name" that kept W afloat. It's fairly clear that they've been recruiting.
I'm not sure there's a clear endgame here, but I think that you're missing something if you believe that it's the same thing as it was because when Chimpy McFlightsuit was the one doing failed photo ops instead of the guy who asked for peacefully assembling citizens to be gassed on his doorstep, they both resulted in controversial photoshoots..
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
Nah, checking the tire pressure is nothing but habit. Sideloading would require a change in habitual behaviour. Investigating. Doing new things - thinking enough to read and understand something they've never done before, no matter how easy.
Alien territory for these folks. Much easier to get angry and blame "Mexicans". Never mind that the number of Mexican born foreigners in the US is dropping and has been for a decade. Actual facts, after all, are "Fake News".
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
"Actual facts, after all, are "Fake News"."
I keep getting reminded that this "new" tactic by the US republicans is anything but new, but just a translation of the "Lügenpresse" of the old german and new american nazis...no good faith to be found in their arguments.
At some point I'm convinced the alt-right's refusal to learn will result in half of them dying from starvation because the standard packaging for frozen TV dinners will have changed, making them unable to open them, or something similar. They're at that point of willfully dumb by now.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Failing Republican Engineers
It's very similar to how red-state pre-meds end up re-taking high-school biology sans the heavy weigh-ins from the creationism sector.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Endgame
White Ethnostate Dictatorship with all the underclasses purged (probably into mass graves or up in smoke).
That's my guess. It's what the ones who say it aloud point at.
If this were a Hollywood movie, they'd make the thin-blue-line flag the new flag to show that the US has gone full evil.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
They are currently dying in droves because they refuse to take a free vaccine with extremely rare side effects.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Failing Republican Engineers
...didn't even know that was a thing, but...live and learn some new ugly fact of life every day, I guess.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
The idea of a Darwin Award being issued to hundreds of thousands of people for the same type of sheer, blistering stupidity is just unbelievable. You'd expect it in some dry Monty Python skit. And yet it's real.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re:
"Trump, on the other hand, seems to have developed a cult that goes way beyond that, where if you're not the "MAGA" type of American then. you are also the enemy, including if you are a Republican."
There has been a radicalization yes. But not that much more than already existed under GWB. Consider what happened to republicans daring to debate the neocon agenda under Bush where "with us or against us" was the norm and anyone, republican or not, who doubted the neocon agenda, got shelved or pushed aside.
Trump's part in this is mainly that of removing the veneer of respectability which still existed under GWB. Bear in mind the anti-terror hysteria. The war of aggression against Iraq. The no-fly lists and new shady intel organizations, including the department of Vaterland security.
"...but I think that you're missing something if you believe that it's the same thing as it was because when Chimpy McFlightsuit was the one doing failed photo ops instead of the guy who asked for peacefully assembling citizens to be gassed on his doorstep, they both resulted in controversial photoshoots..."
I probably am. What I am asserting is that it's the same general model. It's just that the masks came off. The bullhorns towards racists and bigots today are the dogwhistles back then. The "fake news" today is the "liberal media" back then. Back then Cheney forced the CIA to rewrite their reports until they included the falsehoods he wanted then published that and forced Colin Powell to lie blatantly in front of the UN. Today that's just tuesday for most of the GOP.
The GOP doesn't actually need Trump. They need someone who makes the same noises and can activate the same base, bearing the same message - Own the libs, fear the other, defend the white race. Trump's full role in this is simple. He tore out the brakes, saying the quiet part out loud, breaking open the musty closet the alt-right had been hiding in. They'll give him their adulation and kiss his ring forever. But in the end they'll vote for anyone who won't try to make them go back into that musty closet.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
"Currently"... maybe that's changing.
Numerous prominent right-wingers have in the last few days been changing their tune. They've come under fire for it, but I suspect that either the lawyers have been explaining that they could have some liability for essentially telling their audience to kill themselves and/or others, or they're realising that with the way hospitalisations for the delta variant are skewing toward the unvaccinated that they really can't keep up the charade for long. Better to pretend they have always supported the vaccine and attack Biden for not stopping the new wave of deaths than be openly complicit in ways that not even their audience can deny.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mass stupidity.
When people sometimes do weird, illogical things (such as dancing themselves to death) we have to assume it's not a question of individual character so much as a psychological disorder or a human bias.
It's then up to the society to compensate for that bias so that they aren't trapped by it.
I'd also qualify wealthy people who hoard their assets well, well beyond what they and their families might need, to the detriment of all of society around them. We have a billionaire space race, when they could be feeding the world or looking to provide global healthcare in their name, and can't be bothered to part with a hundredth of their assets to do good.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Own the libs
It's now kill the libs and kill the other, though the transnational effort to create a white ethnostate seems to have been the intention all this time (though initially to exclude white others like Italians and Irish).
Trump is now unapologetically GEOTUS, which smacks a bit of Dune.
I've been pointing a lot to #4 of Umberto Ecco's list: Disagreement is betrayal Anyone who challenges the talking points is ostracized and attacked.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Capitalism
Hey? So what. If people want a product and will pay for it, then sell it.
You don’t have to buy it.
So what harm will it do to you?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Porn?
“ “99% of the apps will be porn!”
Excerpt From
Tech Dirt [Wed, 21 Jul 2021]
calibre
This material may be protected by copyright.”
Oh, great. Everyone already drives with their phone in their face. Just what we need, more mobile porn. With in app purchases.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Capitalism
What a shock - you're for con artists profiting from the vulnerable in ways that makes everyone less safe. You're OK with people being fleeced, monitored, hacked, robbed and worse, just so long as you don't think you'll be personally affected by it at that moment. Truly, truly shocking...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Porn?
Another shock - you ignore the salient points of the article and focus on a pithy joke from a linked tweet as if that's all that the article is saying..
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Capitalism
Don’t be such an idiot on this! Not on a tech site. Android 1 still gets community updates.
Linux is as secure as the maintainers want it to be.
I won’t be giving up my iPhone X for this. My vastly superior to all other current non-Apple phones.
But why do you care if Republicans buy a phone without censorship.l?
How does that in any way hurt you? !!??!!??
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Porn?
The article points out a product that conforms to what the target audience is asking for.
Any concerns of security made in the article totally ignore reality. Community based reporting and updates.
Concerns about the source? No American manufacturer of cellphones exists.
Concerns about content.
Isn’t this a web site that pushes make your own?
Well, that’s what we have, a Republican platform.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Capitalism
"Android 1 still gets community updates"
OK, what type of person applies them? I'm guessing the venn diagram of people competent and motivated enough to do such a thing and the people dumb enough to buy a Chinese phone at a 350% markup because of branding looks like this: O O
"Linux is as secure as the maintainers want it to be"
Guess how much I trust these particular maintainers? They're releasing the phones with Android 7 and making claims that there will be zero moderation of the apps installed through their store. The image applied before being put in the box might be the last trustworthy code installed on the device - and that's assuming they have no malware out of the box, which is extraordinarily unlikely.
"I won’t be giving up my iPhone X for this"
Then you're not the person I'm worried about.
"But why do you care if Republicans buy a phone without censorship.l?"
Because botnets, the financial costs of fraud, the increased risks to everyone is greatly increased by such things. It's hard enough already to deal with mainstream issues without directing the stupidest people to criminal honeypots, people who have already been trained to believe that basic technical and medical standards are part of some conspiracy against them.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"The article points out a product that conforms to what the target audience is asking for."
No, it points out a product with a label slapped on it to fool the ignorant and get them to pay huge premiums for a worthless product. Ask those people what specs they want in a phone, what security update schedule, which ecosystem, or anything outside of the "freedumb" bullshit, they won't be able to understand how to answer your question.
"Isn’t this a web site that pushes make your own"
It's a better alternative than just whining that successful people aren't catering to you personally, but there's also limits. I don't care how much a MAGA idiot demands he has access to Freedom Burgers - if they're just ground up rats stored in a way that guarantees salmonella poisoning, that's not a good alternative for anyone.
"Well, that’s what we have, a Republican platform."
It's not really an argument in your favour when that's your argument against criticisms that a badly produced, highly dangerous product set up specifically to fleece the most stupid is what you want to associate with there. But, you do seem to love con artists, so...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Capitalism
"So what harm will it do to you?"
Picture, if you will, the shady used car dealer selling a rent-a-wreck held together by duct tape and markets it for going so fast the speed cameras only get blurry pictures.
Imagine the drawbacks it has no brakes and handles like a bludgeoned cow.
What threat does it pose to other drivers?
From a tech perspective anyone who introduces badly secured technology poisons the well; and if performed at scale that poisoned well water will end up in your own drinking glass at some point.
It's essentially for the same reason that liquid mercury thermometers were banned under various hazardous chemicals acts. Alternatives exist which do the job better and aren't actively hazardous to yourself and your surroundings.
Now if your model of culture is "Fuck you, got mine" then perhaps you won't care. Until or if some elderly relative or friend of yours get one of these phones in hand and some time later end up fleeced. At which point shit suddenly gets real.
No one really owes other people active help, but we are certainly beholden to not fuck them up. Hence shit like this is a concern.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"The article points out a product that conforms to what the target audience is asking for."
The target audience asked for a cheap chinese knock-off sold at three times the retail price, running an insecure OS accepting every install from malware-riddled sources?
When the truth is that the very same functionality can be achieved by going into your existing phone and changing the setting to "accept sources outside app store"?
That's like saying the guy owning a good pickup truck asked to have it replaced by a twenty year old Zil with busted locks.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
Hey, I’m still laughing.
‘Go make your own’
Ok here’s our own
‘How dare you have your own: think of my security, think of the children’
Hey, they asked for it, they got it.
Move on.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Capitalism
“ anyone who introduces badly secured technology poisons the well”
I’ll wait for a legitimate review.
I don’t pass judgement on a product because of who it caters to.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
Again, when "their own" consists of "let's rebrand someone else's platform, mark it up by 350% and promise that we won't do anything to stop rampant fraud, cyberattacks and general abuse to the country", it deserves criticism.
If that's the best those people have, that's their problem.
You do seem to live in a weird fantasy world where nobody's individual action has a negative impact on others. While I'm sure it's comforting, it doesn't resemble the real world the rest of us occupy.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
I fail to see how ‘your’ insecure phone is going to harm my properly secure phone. Yes.
The largest cause of security breaches is user stupidity or ignorance, not the bad actors.
I also see zero evidence that these are malware infested phones.
As for markups, Samsung phones cost less than $300 to make. And sell over $1000. iPhones cost a bit more to manufacture but the markup is there. All flagship phones have major markup.
In fact, markup is part of capitalism. Nearly everything you buy has a profit markup.
Things like cars border on obscene.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"I fail to see how ‘your’ insecure phone is going to harm my properly secure phone. Yes."
Nobody's saying it will directly harm your phone. But, if you don't think people overextending credit to sign up for a server that will almost certainly result in fraud, botnets and many other widespread security and infrastructure issues will cost you nothing, you probably don't understand the problem I'm talking about.
"The largest cause of security breaches is user stupidity or ignorance, not the bad actors."
Such as the stupidity of someone who will sign up for a cheap phone without any security in the app store because it has a word printed on it?
"In fact, markup is part of capitalism"
It is, but there's a limit to where it's reasonable. You might make out like a bandit when you sell a barely repaired wreck as if it was new to some rube, but it's a problem when it causes a pile up a few miles down the road.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
“ almost certainly result in…”
Stuff. Lol.
Again, I’ll wait to see what the phone actually is and does.
Didn’t read any of the site info yet so not sure what the App Store is they have in mind.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"Again, I’ll wait to see what the phone actually is and does."
This seems to be a fair breakdown:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/07/the-maga-targeted-freedom-phone-has-a-breathtakin g-amount-of-red-flags/
It seems that ultimately they won't deliver on their promises... which is actually a good thing since the originally promised "no moderation or censorship on apps" version would have been an obvious disaster.
At the end of the day it's your typical "fleece the Trump voting rubes because they're too dumb to notice they're being ripped off", with a side serving of relief when the danger they actually promised looks to have been avoided. Not because the targets wised up, but because they fell for promises that wouldn't be met.
"Didn’t read any of the site info yet so not sure what the App Store is they have in mind."
Site info? One of the big red flags when this was announced was that they refused to detail what the specs of the phone actually were. They seem to have partially rectified that, but I suspect now that the grift has been exposed they'll just move on to another one. See also: the same type of idiot falling for the MAGA cryptocoin.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
Hey, if the same scam worked for Cambridge Analytica 2.0 aka Parler...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
That’s an interesting read on fluffing out a massive story about… nothing.
I generally like the coverage of Ars when they stick to tech.
They problem here is it’s all 100% conjecture.
As for what they call copying:
As a former android developer (now Apple) and long time Linux and BSD tinkerer, Google’s api and app kit is not exactly hard to get. Pay a fee, follow the rules, and you have access.
There’s o requirements to make anything be on the Home Screen. You just must preinstall everything.
I’ve played with a line of Korean tablets, translated as Or, that generally hide all of Google’s stuff in exchange for their own skins, shells, and alt access methods.
The entire line of Boox readers do this as well.
So it’s not like this is some bait and switch. Neither of those two are bad products. The Onyx brand is generally very highly rated.
So, once more, I’ll make my judgements when someone has the actual phone in their hands.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
Well, at least Parler is only attractive to one set of the population whereas CA manipulated people who wouldn't normally be that stupid... To my understanding anyway.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"That’s an interesting read on fluffing out a massive story about… nothing."
It reacts to the same story you are reacting to by giving a considered evaluation of the known facts and updating where necessary after publication, even removing the most damning accusation (it's an obvious 350 - 400% markup) in the light of new evidence. I'm not sure what you think is wrong with it. The basis of the story (there's a lot of red flags that anyone knowledgable about tech would take as a reason to bail immediately) is fine.
"So it’s not like this is some bait and switch"
It's advertised as a phone that gives you freedom from all the normal tech outlets with a pro-US slant, and the product that's delivered is a rebranded Chinese phone that still apparently depends on Google (or, if that's not the case, piracy and/or malware) to some degree. What else would you call it?
"So, once more, I’ll make my judgements when someone has the actual phone in their hands."
That's fair, I just wish you'd make the same judgements on some other stories we've been discussing.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
“ I'm not sure what you think is wrong with it. ”
Nothing. It’s just considerably longer than it needs to be for an ‘I don’t know’ piece.
“ there's a lot of red flags that anyone knowledgable about tech would take as a reason to bail immediately”
See, that’s not what I see at all.
I see just another independent product trying to grab a selected market.
You say red flags, I say potential hazards.
I find the site lacking but consistent with most startups.
The article makes quotes but they’re not on the current website.
There a difference between censorship and moderation. I see nothing on the site itself that says it won’t block malware.
“(or, if that's not the case, piracy and/or malware)”
Interesting and hat you think anything not Google is piracy and malware.
Do you feel the same about Cydia? Or the dozens of no-jailbreak terminal to screen stores? Or the Amazon App Store?
It looks like decent mid-level specs. On par with the Samsung J series had it continued it’s upgrade path.
Keep in in mind that was a $99-$399 series, the price is a bit high but not out of the park.
My opinion on the phone is people are jumping to conclusions on a product based on the target market.
If it’s bad and a bunch of people get raked so be it.
If it’s good I prefer Competition
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"Nothing. It’s just considerably longer than it needs to be for an ‘I don’t know’ piece."
It's an opinion piece based on way more evidence than we've ever seen with Hunter's laptop.
"I see just another independent product trying to grab a selected market."
That market being people who are easily conned into buying a product that might materially affect them and others negatively, in the false assumption that it contains something not available elsewhere.
"The article makes quotes but they’re not on the current website."
Did you check the Wayback Machine? A source changing their copy after it's been quoted by people pointing out the problems with it does not invalidate the original criticism.
"There a difference between censorship and moderation. I see nothing on the site itself that says it won’t block malware."
They literally said "If an app you love has been banned from the mainstream app stores, you can still download it on ours because we don't ban apps, period."
Guess what? Political disagreement isn't the only reason apps are banned. Sometimes it's because they're malware. There's no way that promise can be kept unless they're also promising to keep malware. If they have caveats to that statement, they should list them when making the statement.
"Interesting and hat you think anything not Google is piracy and malware."
Interesting that you think the things that I stated as options if they don't use Google is a statement about Google.
"Do you feel the same about Cydia? Or the dozens of no-jailbreak terminal to screen stores? Or the Amazon App Store?"
I feel that (apart from Amazon) they're unlikely to be used by the people this phone was aimed at.
"It looks like decent mid-level specs"
Which have recently been changed as far as we can see. But, apart from the hideous apparent markup, the hardware was not the main objection here to begin with.
"My opinion on the phone is people are jumping to conclusions on a product based on the target market."
My opinion is that you were faced with the same information everyone else had and leapt to a different conclusion. We'll see what come out at the end, but right now it seems to fit the observer effect - but watching the process and commenting upon it we have potentially changed the outcome. That doesn't invalidate the original observations, it just makes it so that we can't measure them unless we get hold of someone who obtained a pre-criticism phone.
"If it’s bad and a bunch of people get raked so be it."
Then, I hope you're OK with the inevitable indirect costs to you if this becomes significantly successful, based on the information we have right now.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
“Did you check the Wayback Machine? A source changing their copy after it's been quoted by people pointing out the problems with it does not invalidate the original criticism.
No, but like the 1619 project it shows that the author reconsidered statements.
“ said”
Yes. And it’s not there now. Quite obviously was a statement that wasn’t thought through.
“ Interesting that you think the things that I stated as options if they don't use Google is a statement about Google.”
I don’t. What did I say to make you think that?
“ Which have recently been changed as far as we can see. But, apart from the hideous apparent markup, the hardware was not the main objection here to begin with.”
No. It was content choice aimed at people looking for that content. Lol.
Half the country is the target. How many buy it? Unknown.
But it’s a valid market.
“ My opinion is that you were faced with the same information everyone else had and leapt to a different conclusion.”
I made no conclusion at all.
“ Then, I hope you're OK with the inevitable indirect costs to you if this becomes significantly successful, based on the information we have right now.”
Hey, I hope it’s a good phone! We need more competition.
I don’t think it’s a that big an idea. If you want to spend $100 on an internet connected Biden clock you can. This is the same category.
If it works out good.
If not, they tried. And if it’s a scam from the beginning… the fall out isn’t likely going to be as apocalyptic as the current knee-jerk reaction says.
This isn’t even the first “freedom phone”!
I hope they have their trademark issues out of the way. For their sake.
There been at least 4 now.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Failing Republican Engineers
They use the term 'Intelligent design' when trying to get around 1st amendment restrictions on establishment of religion, when they try to mandate its teaching in schools..
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Failing Republican Engineers
It’s still bull. Evolution may be a theory but CID is based on zero evidence.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
"Only a theory"
Evolution is a theory the way quantum mechanics is a theory or aerodynamics is a theory, the last of which we use practically, in that we fling cans of peoplr up into the sky and use aerodynamics to guide getting them back down safely again.
We actually apply evolution practically as well, to cultivate food crops, to respond to infectious disease and to develop advanced medicines.
Premeds who failed to learn evolution in high school wind up having to take a cram course in freshman college in order to catch up with the rest of the students.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Market Failure
News flash, the reason that people weren’t getting those policy positions from either party is because those policy positions were not well thought out, unworkable and objectively awful. The same is true as to why reputable tech companies aren’t providing these “features” on their phones.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Market Failure
Yes, it is the reason Trump got elected, it is also the reason he was not -re-elected- and the reason that “Freedom Phones” will go the way of the hydrogen filled airship.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Good for them…
Except these MAGA horses shit and piss in the water supply, lap it up, bacteria and all then complain someone else is to blame when they get sick......
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Guilt-free scams, gotta love 'em
don't need app store for viruses and malware.
this baby comes with them pre-installed and waits for the phone to go idle, before sending every document, password and message straight to Bejing.
Unremoveable "edited" apps...even the play store I suspect has keylogging right underneath it.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re:
This little MAGA boy is claiming when you arrived to save him, that YOU'RE the wolf he's yelling about.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Capitalism
Due to idiots using these type of phones to do their banking, Virgin Money changed from website-based to a specific app ONLY.
So now you can't do your online banking on a PC, only an android phone.
All because trump supporters happily install anything and everything that promises to re-elect trump.
I bet if there was a browser called Geegle Chrame, they'd install it if it said "will help with the election recount".
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Porn?
99%?
So LESS porn than the average?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn?
"No, but like the 1619 project it shows that the author reconsidered statements."
Yes, after being called out for the failures of his con, the con artist adjusted his website to be less openly fraudulent.
This isn't surprising, but your attempt to redirect to another right-wing boogeyman is noted.
"Half the country is the target"
Half the country isn't this stupid. Even the far less than half of the US population that voted for Trump aren't so obsessed over meaningless buzzwords that they'd even consider buying a phone of unknown specs and quality just for the "freedumb" branding. That's a very specific small market of cultists that don't even include you.
"We need more competition"
We do. Knocking off a brand identity in a couple of hours to plaster over a bunch of existing phones using existing FOSS tools then selling the result at a 400% mark-up to people dumb enough to fall for it does not count as meaningful competition.
"And if it’s a scam from the beginning… the fall out isn’t likely going to be as apocalyptic as the current knee-jerk reaction says."
I'd rather the rubes remain unfleeced and everyone else not have to pay for their failures. Nobody except people like you who love to misrepresent the arguments being made are saying anything remotely apocalyptic, just that people who have to put up with the problems that your favoured con artists cause are tired of it, and it makes everyone worse off, if even by a small amount.
I'd explain why, but you are immune to basic concepts of society and business.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: "a ton of people wanted certain policy positions"
Trump got elected for the same reason Obama got elected. People are tired of the system.
2 Parties, 2 promises: 1 result.
Neither party ever gets around to the “good” stuff.
Obama had no National presence.
Then trump, a long time Dem, running as a Republican?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Guilt-free scams, gotta love 'em
Evidence?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Hydrogen filled airship
To be fair, the additional boyancy of hydrogen allows for engineering we can't do with helium filled blimps. The explosion risk is considered by some as a problem to solve rather than a logistical dealbreaker.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Porn
Ohkay.
I follow your thought that this could unless some bot-bag-virus thing.
We still have zero proof.
Unlike you I won’t jump on a product for branding without evidence of issue.
I would support any phone that is safe (competitively) to use out of the box; regardless of branding.
I fully supported the green phone movement that sadly died due to “progressive millennials” who couldn’t stream videos on an eink screen.
Unlike some: I’ll reserve judgement until there’s a product to judge.
Mainly because of the bad press eink green phones for. The onyx prototype, for instance, did 32fps. XRS, gofundme, I think, did 40fps.
But the bull was out. No 108060. No high fr games. Evil.
Lots of Chinese top to bottom phones exist. Some are quite safe. Some are not.
The point is don’t crap on a product before we have it based on who it supports.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"We still have zero proof"
They promised no moderation of apps. Since moderation of apps naturally includes apps that are removed for being buggy, not working, containing malware or other things apart from any political content, the assumption has to be that either they overstated things, or that would literally allow anything - which would be carte blanche for any virus, malware, etc. This isn't hard.
"Unlike you I won’t jump on a product for branding without evidence of issue"
The issue originally was that it appeared to be a 400% markup just for the brand. I don't care what product that is, it's obscene. Illegal ? maybe not, but if someone buys it because it has a label on it I question their life choices, especially when it's apparently to make a political point not supported by the way the product operates. If I buy some child labour Nikes and I rebrand them with "no child slavery", there's a problem no matter who I convince to buy them.
"The point is don’t crap on a product before we have it based on who it supports."
I'm sure that anyone writing about this will be happy to apologise if we're wrong. But, the evidence o far suggests not, that it's yet another grift of people whose grasp on reality is as weak as their grasp on their wallets. Which is a group most would prefer not have power in the market.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
The same reason Obama got elected
Obama got elected for not being George W. Bush. It was a very popular platform considering Bush turned the US into a torture state and a surveillance state (and also hired mercenaries to e̶n̶g̶a̶g̶e̶ i̶n̶ g̶e̶n̶o̶c̶i̶d̶e̶ sweep and clear civilians from combat zones.
It was popular even internationally and Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize for the feat of not being Bush.
I suppose you could argue that a black man in the White House was too much for the transnational white power movement in the US to handle, so Trump got elected by mobilized racists for not being a black guy, but also for openly resenting non-whites in the US.
Essentially Trump took the Southern Strategy and cranked it up to 22, and went on the purge the nonwhites platform. Looking at news from the time the plan was to purge all the Latins (whether citizens or not) and then replace all the lost workers with black felons. Also to build a wall and to imprison rival politicians.
Most of the people who actually voted for Trump did so in order to purge the nonwhites. That still seems to be the MAGA ticket, to this day, except also to criminalize dissent.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
“ They promised ”
And apparently have reconsidered wording.
We’ll see when it’s released.
“ The issue originally was that it appeared to be a 400%”
The two leading phone companies, Apple and Samsung, have similar flagship markup.
“ If I buy some child labour Nikes …”
I thought the premise of the phone is no -censored communication?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: "a ton of people wanted certain policy positions"
Wow… your a bit out there. What’s your source? The Daily Worker? The Hammer?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"We’ll see when it’s released."
You keep saying this, but are you aware they're already on sale, and have been since before this article was written? It is mentioned quite clearly in that Ars article.
"The two leading phone companies, Apple and Samsung, have similar flagship markup."
Not on a phone already manufactured and sold b y someone else at the lower price, they don't.
"I thought the premise of the phone is no -censored communication?"
A feat that either guarantees malware or cannot be honoured.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
They’re not on sale, they’re available for ore order.
And if you think not censoring speech guarantees malware your idea of censorship is much broader than mine.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Pre order
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"And if you think not censoring speech guarantees malware your idea of censorship is much broader than mine."
The promise is that they will not restrict apps. Apps are restricted for many reasons from the Google store, one of which is because they contain malware. This isn't complicated.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
If you really jump from allowing Infowars and whatever, to allowing iloveyou, what a sad view of humanity.
Possible? Sure. Not likely.
We’ll know when it’s released. Won’t we.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
"[You're] a bit out there."
Yeah, I get that a lot.
My source is watching it bloody unfold. I was there when it happened, when Trump or his spokesgoons were talking about blue-sky ideas like they were policy.
I think the article I read that corrected the polls, revealing that mostly racists voted for Trump was in FiveThirtyEight but that was in 2018 or 2019. A while ago. I bet it's still up if you want to utilize a search engine.
I doubt it, though. Your predilection for arguing in bad faith, Lostinlodos precedes you.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: "[You're] a bit out there."
I can’t find an exact article, though There’s lots covering such topics.
One thing I’ll remind you is poll sourcing has an effect on results. So keep that in mind.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"allowing iloveyou,"
Funny how you picked that example. It was a virus that disguised itself as something legitimate, packaged in a way that demanded to be opened by the credulous and uneducated. I dare say that's exactly the type of app that would be problematic here.
"Possible? Sure. Not likely"
OK, explain to me then - by what mechanism can the store guarantee that no "censorship" can happen, without also guaranteeing that apps that would be removed for other reasons won't get through? Bear in mind that weak will right-wingers will cry about censorship no matter the reason given for an app's removal.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Choice of example was intentional.
Someone somewhere will always complain.
But I take the intent at face value.
Republicans are demanding every piece of malware be platformed. They’re demanding freedom of access.
This is exactly what was declared when talking heads said ‘go make your own’.
What I see is: ‘wow, that’s actually did it, let’s find something wrong’.
I’ll gladly point out issues as they come up. I’m not going to invent them in my head.
This is an over priced look at me phone.
But, it is filling a market spot that considers itself left out. We’ll see what the final product is when we have it.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Btw: I don’t mean when I have it. You’ll be hard pressed to find something to motivate me to move from the vastly superior Apple ecosystem running on top of the BSD platform.
Not for yet another Android mod.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"Choice of example was intentional."
Clearly. Because you prefer to deal with strrawmen rather than the argument other people are actually making.
"Republicans are demanding every piece of malware be platformed. They’re demanding freedom of access."
Freedom isn't free. There are restrictions - which include when your "freedom" reduces the freedom of others. In this case, not to be attacked by known malware because the smooth brained people who get told that basic security is a violation of their rights.
"This is exactly what was declared when talking heads said ‘go make your own’."
No, it's the dumbest possible solution for people who were told to stop trying to force themselves on to other peoples' private property instead of using their own. That's fine, but if your solution to being told that you need to stop punching people at the liquor store is to start making bathtub gin, you shouldn't be surprised when people also object to that.
"I’ll gladly point out issues as they come up. I’m not going to invent them in my head."
Except, again, that's not what's happening. People are pointing out the obvious, predictable, consequences of the promises that have been made, and the fact that the whole thing is clearly a scam to fleece people who care more about branding than the actual product. This is not invented from whole cloth, it's predictions made from experience.
Those predictions could be wrong, but with the full view of experience and knowledge this isn't a valuable path to go down on the face of the claims being made.
"But, it is filling a market spot that considers itself left out"
Yes, and they're being left out because they're adolescent-minded people who can't take responsibility for their own actions and claim that consequences of those actions are a conspiracy against them. I'd be happy to let them stew in their own juices and get mercilessly ripped off, but unfortunately the promises being made place others at risk.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Well, they can't exactly use iOS and they're also not the types to create their own OS from scratch so that's the best you're going to get.
I'm all for someone coming up with a proper and well supported mobile Linux distro that gets a foothold in the mainstream market, but the target audience for this particular phone are not exactly the tech savvy kind. I'd be surprised if half of them know what an OS is, let alone base a purchase on its selection.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
I’ll just stick with the idea that they want to talk to each other. Not host malware.
I have nothing against that.
I hope it works out for them.
Whilst you look at all the potential negatives: I’m looking at the major positive.
Maybe they’ll be so self consumed in their own app world they’ll stop bitching about the App Store and Play?
Because I don’t want one button side loading on iOS/iPad OS.
Competent users can easily side load on an iPhone via a terminal emulator.
I use iSH.
I don’t want iOS to become another android where stability and security are tossed out the window for interoperability and open warfare, er app use.
For me, I see a quick way to have Republicans take their ball and go home. And stop demanding I give up mine.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
I prefer BSD myself but it’s a flavour choice.
And way off topic.
This is just another Android Linux with an alt App Store.
It it makes them happy maybe they’ll leave me alone.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"I’ll just stick with the idea that they want to talk to each other."
Maybe, but that wasn't the promise made.
"Whilst you look at all the potential negatives: I’m looking at the major positive."
Which only really exists if you believe that this is an honest attempt to create a new system, and not to just con the kind of people who would fall for such labelling. We will see how it pans out, but the evidence so far suggests that this is a cash grab to entice people who will fall for anything as long as they're pandered to, as we're seeing a lot recently with "magacoin" and so forth.
"I don’t want iOS to become another android where stability and security are tossed out the window for interoperability and open warfare, er app use."
That's fine, but where is this even being suggested? Virtually every non-Apple device uses Android, and all the features afforded by this "new" phone already exists. The only real difference is the branding, which is clearly targeted at a non-tech savvy audience.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
“ Which only really exists”
If they really do walk away.
“That's fine, but where is this even being suggested”
You miss my entire premise, if the Republicans have their own platform maybe they’ll give on on fighting other ones. That’s exactly what they’re doing by suggesting breakups and mandates on App and Play.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
"if the Republicans have their own platform maybe they’ll give on on fighting other ones"
Doubtful. They already have their own platforms, some of which predate the current mainstream options. The whining usually comes from people who want the wider audience, and you won't get that by trying to compete with platforms that are not fundamentally political, with those that are expressly political in favour of a party that rarely wins the popular vote. No matter how successful they are, they will still be complaining because they are not the majority.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Market Failure
That is only when it is working. Right now, it is stuck on telling me
We are checking your browser to make sure you aren't a bot or DDos attack. This process is completely automatic and will only take a moment. Once it is completed, you will be forwarded immediately.DDOS protection by BitMitigateIt has been stuck on that for a while.
Good thing I do not have $500 burning a hole in my pocket, or I would be out of luck. Well, at least I still have the ``free'' phone from my service provider, so I should be able to get by until the web site is working, maybe longer.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Right now, that next looks like Ron DeSantis. As gov of Florida, his most recent highest priority was getting HB1 through the legislature. That piece of work, inspired by the protests following the Floyd killing, essentially criminalizes protests which the police dislike. Tthe expectation is that the police will dislike protests by darker-complected folks, many of whom were included in the Floyd protests. There was little effort to put lipstick on the pig that was the impetus for HB1.
Not to worry if you are adequately white and republican: the bill is subject to selective enforcement. The first opportunity, republican protesters blocking the 826 in Dade, showed that it will not be used if the protesters are of the correct political leaning.
Wise guys recalling the `\826 parking lot'' should be reminded that parking was not the intent, and that republican protests blocking traffic do not help things.
[ link to this | view in thread ]