The 19 Senators Who Voted To Censor The Internet
from the free-speech-isn't-free dept
This is hardly a surprise but, this morning (as previously announced), the lame duck Senate Judiciary Committee unanimously voted to move forward with censoring the internet via the COICA bill -- despite a bunch of law professors explaining to them how this law is a clear violation of the First Amendment. What's really amazing is that many of the same Senators have been speaking out against internet censorship in other countries, yet they happily vote to approve it here because it's seen as a way to make many of their largest campaign contributors happy. There's very little chance that the bill will actually get passed by the end of the term but, in the meantime, we figured it might be useful to highlight the 19 Senators who voted to censor the internet this morning:- Patrick J. Leahy -- Vermont
- Herb Kohl -- Wisconsin
- Jeff Sessions -- Alabama
- Dianne Feinstein -- California
- Orrin G. Hatch -- Utah
- Russ Feingold -- Wisconsin
- Chuck Grassley -- Iowa
- Arlen Specter -- Pennsylvania
- Jon Kyl -- Arizona
- Chuck Schumer -- New York
- Lindsey Graham -- South Carolina
- Dick Durbin -- Illinois
- John Cornyn -- Texas
- Benjamin L. Cardin -- Maryland
- Tom Coburn -- Oklahoma
- Sheldon Whitehouse -- Rhode Island
- Amy Klobuchar -- Minnesota
- Al Franken -- Minnesota
- Chris Coons -- Delaware
Update: Some people in the comments are claiming this is not about censorship, so I've put up a new post explaining in detail why this bill is all about censorship.
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Filed Under: censorship, coica, senators
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what, are you not capable of getting it yourself?
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208.53.48.33
:)
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http://tech.rawsignal.com
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PING techdirt.com (208.53.48.36) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from delta.techdirt.com (208.53.48.36): icmp_seq=1 ttl=38 time=133 ms
208.53.48.36 bookmark it now.
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[sorak:0]% nslookup techdirt.com
Server: 192.168.42.1
Address: 192.168.42.1#53
Non-authoritative answer:
Name: techdirt.com
Address: 208.53.48.33
Name: techdirt.com
Address: 208.53.48.36
Name: techdirt.com
Address: 208.53.48.129
Name: techdirt.com
Address: 208.53.48.153
[sorak:0]%
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BRILLIANT
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Serves me right for not believing in the rules of politics:
Rule 1 - All politicians are corrupt and/or negligent.
Rule 2 - If a politician does not appear to be corrupt and/or negligent, see Rule 1.
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I believe you failed to prove your point (you are.)
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Also, the list that really matters is the final vote IMHO.
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Geez, I can't believe he would want to protect the right of remuneration for himself and his fellow actor friends...
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You guys have simply failed all over the place here.
It's been a blast to watch.
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Fascist sides not what they used to be
Things have changed, and if you really look at what the liberals are doing and advocating right now, it fits the fascist ideology almost word for word.
Basically, the tables have begun to turn, and things are not what they have always been....Those who HAVE taken courses in pol science may need to scrap what they thought they learned and look more carefully at how things are moving today compared to how they used to be
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Re: Al Franklin
not that i support it, or not, i dont know enough, But Al isn't corrupt, i'm sure of that!
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Re: Internet censorship
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Re: MrWilson
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Coons isn't in the Senate yet?
Dianne Feinstein? No surprise there, she's never approved of free speech on the Internet.
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Re: Coons isn't in the Senate yet?
http://judiciary.senate.gov/about/members.cfm
He doesn't have an official Senate page yet, but WP indicates he took office on November 15.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Coons
It was a special election, not part of the normal midterms.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_special_election_in_Delaware,_2010
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Re: Coons isn't in the Senate yet?
http://judiciary.senate.gov/about/members.cfm
He doesn't have an official Senate page yet, but WP indicates he took office on November 15.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Coons
It was a special election, not part of the normal midterms.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_special_election_in_Delaware,_2010
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Re: Franken
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Re: Re: Franken
The internet is the last bastion of free speech on a mass scale--and the "muslims" wish to censor such speech as this:
http://ReDiscover911.com Who allowed muslims to place explosives in the Twin Towers and Building 7
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Government regulation of websites
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Rule #1
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3 - When you get tired of this cycle and apathy, see Ron Paul.
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But Mike, the Nazis want to keep you safe!
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In other words, not only is the bill an overreaching bill by the government, it's also a stupid ineffective one.
Also, I'm ashamed to be a part of a state that voted for this bill (California).
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I'm expecting Chicago's finest at my home today when I return from the gym....
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careful.
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I doubt she'll ever read it, but I did try and if it looks like she will continue to support it, I'll just have to give her a follow up call or two to make sure she understands that people will always abuse power that they are given. Not ever single person, but people in general.
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chalk it up as another one for transparency - not only is there not a way to track those emails, there's no guarantee you'll get a reply
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Re: Re: Anonymous Coward
Bennett was replaced this year, Hatch is next.
Philpot for Senate 2012
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Boxer kills her own
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Response to: Anonymous Coward on Nov 18th, 2010 @ 11:40am
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SAIC strikes again! It's amazing what a few thousand can buy.
Well, they were also the company that owned Network Solutions, the original domain registrar in 1995 before spinning it off to Verisign. Additionally, it looks like they maybe had their hands in the cookie jar with the AT&T wiretapping case, by working on the Trailblazer Project. I bet they have a shiny solution that they plan to install on the internet.
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Re: SAIC strikes again! It's amazing what a few thousand can buy.
http://www.cloudshield.com/
Acquired in Jan of this year, specializing in deep packet inspection gear.
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Arlen Specter -- Pennsylvania
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Re: Arlen Specter -- Pennsylvania
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Another Lame Duck
He also "looks forward to working with Rob Portman", who will take over his seat, to move this bill forward.
So you can probably add incoming Sen. Portman of Ohio too.
I also wrote to the other Ohio Senator, Sherrod Brown, who, while citing industry statistics, at least made mentioned the 1st amendment concerns in his response.
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?
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Re: ?
You'll notice that the news programs focus on the fighting, rather than the voting on this horrendous bill and its implications on personal liberty. You REALLY think that's a coincidence?
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Did I just hear a veil dropping? You might want to go on a safe bender and purge your brain to assist the reset.
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It's like you're pretending piracy isn't illegal and a massive problem.
Hilarious.
And how many Senators do you think give a damn about young people that rip off music and movies? They probably believe that if you're that lame and/or broke that you more than likely don't vote.
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The real problem here is that it prevents people from having a website that is free and open and allows people to post what they want in a manner that truly exemplifies free speech. If you want to punish the guy that uses those sites to post copies of video games, you can get his information and prosecute that one guy, individually, for his crime.
There's no need to pass a law that makes it difficult or impossible to create a forum for the exchange of ideas and data, and allows a very small group of people to decree that a website should no longer be accessible to the general public because some portion of the community of that website decided to infringe someone else's copyright.
Furthermore, virtually zero expertise or knowledge of copyrights are required for this kind of action. If a court isn't involved and copyright law isn't properly cited amongst LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS, you have someone making claims of wrongdoing against someone else, and people WHO DID NOTHING WRONG having a service denied to them that they may have been using 100% legitimately.
Example... rapidshare shows up on this list because someone posts a copy of Duke Nukem 3d on it (because you know, people still pay big bucks for games from 1995 )... Now Joe the teacher from Detroit who used Rapidshare to copy his student's work back and forth on occasion, or used it to make his life easier in other, non-harmful ways just lost access to a very valuable online resource.
It's plain stupidity. There are far more elegant ways to prevent piracy... and honestly, a large portion of piracy can simply be ignored.
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The idea that the internet should somehow be exempt from the same laws that exist in the real world is delusional.
It's why all the whining being done by the piracy apologists isn't going to mean squat.
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Wrong!
It's over. You look like a fool.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: ?
Indeed. But that's a case where stores have control over what's being sold and pick and choose what's being sold. When it's an open platform -- such as eBay, we don't blame the store.
That's just common sense.
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So will every other site on the internet. Just like in the real world. Because the internet is now the same as the real world.
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Um. No. In both cases they will take down content if the rightsholder makes a request, but they do not "police themselves" as you claim.
So will every other site on the internet. Just like in the real world. Because the internet is now the same as the real world.
Cool. So, then every time you visit a foreign website, you get a visa, right?
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One problem with your argument... There IS a difference between 'stolen property' (what you call fenced goods) and 'copied intellectual property'. One is theft and the other is not.
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Right back at ya. After all it's you who thinks this law will change anything. It's only sad to know that after the law did fail you won't be coming back here and we have less to laugh about.
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I hope to "Ruin" your illusions about politics
Even moderate or "in the middle" is not a very meaningful term, either.
"Liberal" or "conservative" or "in the middle" ABOUT WHAT(?) is the necessary question.
This internet "neutrality" scam is about control, and both "liberals" nor "conservatives" have plenty of control freaks in Congress.
Why did the PATRIOT Act pass and was renewed, too, by Bush AND OBAMA with "wide bipartisan support"? That's also a head-scratcher for all the clueless folks who are suckered into the two party shell game.
Reject the false images and rhetoric and FOCUS on the voting records of these liars! While we still have internet freedom, spend some time doing some real research on Thomas.gov (or a host of sites that compile vote records) and after a while you'll see through the charade of these political charlatans.
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Re: senators closing down websites?
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Re: senators closing down websites?
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We Were Warned
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Re: We Were Warned
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Don't the Senators understand?
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Re: Don't the Senators understand?
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Re: Re: Don't the Senators understand?
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Problem
Politicians are people who crave power - and they are exactly the type of people who should be nowhere near any position of authority.
I am all for democracy, it is the least evil system of government, but it is definitely flawed.
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Re: Problem
(paraphrased)
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Re: Re: Problem
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Re: Problem
Term limits would be nice, too. At a glance, I think most of those names are 20+ year senators.
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Re: Re: Problem
We manage large numbers because on average the proxies are reset very infrequently. We wouldn't need to secure online voting. We could instead do the assignments and re-assignments via snail mail, on the web with a follow-up confirmation, through phone call, or, safest of all, at a local government office using picture ID or something similar.
The Constitution would have to be changed to do this at the federal level, but it would be nice to see this democracy in action locally.
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Re: Re: Problem
# the political orientation of those who favor government by the people or by their elected representatives
# a political system in which the supreme power lies in a body of citizens who can elect people to represent them
Indirect democracy is a broad term describing a means of governance by the people through elected representatives.
1. government by the people; a form of government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised directly by them or by their elected agents under a free electoral system.
3. a state of society characterized by formal equality of rights and privileges.
Looks to me like the US is both a democracy and a republic, by most definitions.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic
Perhaps the term you want to use is "facist plutocracy". I'm open to other options.
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Re: Problem
Cheers,
A son of the American Revolution
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See above - that depends on what definition of "democracy" you use.
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The politicians are real idiots and the industry is real selfish.
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Lots of people will be installing BIND if this goes through.
If you ask me, this is a complete waste of taxpayer money because it only adds administrative costs and does nothing to ask business to better leverage internet distribution capability, which is the core issue in play.
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Re: Lots of people will be installing BIND if this goes through.
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Of course, this is only the first step in the legislative process. It still has to pass the full Senate, the House Judiciary Committee, the full House, and then the President. At every step along the way there are opportunities presented for the introduction of amendments.
The professors referenced above would be well advised to stop their "academic ranting", focus on what amendments they believe should be made, and then find a sponsor for such amendments.
Contrary to much of the FUD that has been made about COCIA, there is much more to this bill than the perception by many that the bill is directed almost exclusively to stemming the tide of illegal downloading.
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I find it amusing that these distinguished professors raising very serious and legitimate concerns are reduced to "academic ranting" in your book. But when your beloved friends in Hollywood rant ridiculously about "piracy" and "theft" you rush to their support.
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In college dorm rooms across the country:
"Oh no! I have to use an IP address to look up my torrentz? That's just too hard for me...I should go find an engineer or comp sci major..."
5 minutes later...
"So just don't change any of the settings, and click that link on your desktop and you should be fine to download whatever you want"
Wait a minute...after my college put in place their blocks on certain piracy sites they stopped checking for illegal downloads. The IT team explained it to me as "since we can now say that we're blocking the sites, we aren't required to watch the traffic. Less work for us, and you can still download". If this bill means that they will stop worrying about piracy and trying to stop it, I hope it passes.
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You are speaking in generalities that I believe are incorrect. Do you have any specific example that I can address?
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Oh no, he's stealing your commenting style!
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Re: Re: Re:
It is impossible to go back through your previous statements on this site since you choose (for no clear reason) to post anonymously -- even though you make clear who you are via your tone and statements. I now recognize part of that is to make it impossible for us to call you on your blatant contradictions.
You regularly commented in favor of the MPAA and RIAA positions in various lawsuits and when they called infringement "theft." You also regularly mocked defendants in cases when the RIAA and MPAA threw "hissy fits" falsely suggesting they were costing the industry millions.
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"Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,
SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.
This Act may be cited as the ‘‘Combating Online In5
fringement and Counterfeits Act’’."
That's it. I wouldn't have a problem with that bill if that were the whole thing.
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No Georgians!
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Re: No Georgians!
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Re: Re: No Georgians!
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Re: Re: No Georgians!
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Re: Re: No Georgians!
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No Way!
And Al Franken did too? I thought he was the people's candidate?!?
(In case you couldn't tell, I was being sarcastic)
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Re: No Way!
You! Can't! Say! That! about our Big Entertainment Industry "Expatriate" turned Senator for The Little People Franken!
(In case you couldn't tell, I was being sarcastic)
(I lost the ability to give a shake about "either party" long long ago)
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The last several days have clearly shown that fear and greed are the choice America has made for the future.
I know most people think politics are boring and stupid. While in many respects, they are correct, ignoring that which places restraints on upon you, even a little, causes the democracy to die in equal parts.
I want corporations to get their fair due. However, the solutions that have been put in place, demanded to be in place, seem shortsighted and ultimately evil.
In the short term, those with money and power may get their way, reaping the rewards they so viciously desire. I'm just glad that their children and grandchildren will have to live with these various affronts to liberty, as my own will.
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Re:
Yea, you're gonna lose your "freedom" to visit websites "dedicated to infringing activities".
Poor widdle you...
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Re: Re:
Is youtube? how about 4chan? techdirt? slashdot? digg? bbc.co.uk? foxnews.com? the sundance film festivals page?
This is the issue, it's not that we disagree that "illegal"(criminally) sites should be shut down, but in almost all cases there are already ways to do this, injunctions, court orders, etc.
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Re: Re: Re:
Exactly. Remember, according to the entertainment industry, radio, YouTube, cable television, the photocopier, the DVR and the MP3 player were all "dedicated to infringing activity."
What's amazing is I have yet to see a single one of COICA's supporters explain that issue away. The entertainment industry *ALWAYS* insists new offerings are dedicated to infringing activities when they first show up.
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The industry doesn't have to insist anything at this point now. The illegal activity is flagrant and out in the open.
Why do you insist on defending illegal activity and the ripping off of artists, Mike?
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Yes, I'm bored. Deal with it.
Also, you've not seent he Creative accounting habits of the RIAA, have you? OR of a funny little company called soundexchange who couldn't find Kanye West. OR of the trillions (I shit you not, THAT was what was said) 'lost' to infringement. This, in spite of the fact that more money has been spent on music in the past five years year-on-year, even accounting for inflation. And that's the RIAA figures talking.
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Woah
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Re: Woah
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Furthermore
The new version removes the public blacklist, but it keeps the immunity for 'voluntary' (non-judicial) service termination. And there's no process to get service re-instated. Now the government and/or entertainment industries won't have to bother going through those pesky courts that require evidence and what-not. They can just apply carrot/stick techniques to get service terminated.
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Re: Furthermore
By service termination, I wonder if they will mean physical termination (your phone company disconnects you,) or logical termination (as in, your ISP removes access to their network.)
I figure, if it is the later, what stops us from just starting Internet 2.0 and just not invite the government (or at least the part that kowtows to the entertainment industry,) and the entertainment industry to our new one? Of course, I am all for moving backwards to the internet we had pre-1994, where no commercial organizations were allowed to join. Seems like we came off the rail around that point.
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Re: Re: Furthermore
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Guh
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Mike, your tone harms your credibility.
Hmmm ... so no one that voted for the DMCA (or any other laws now abused for widespread censorship like that) counts as "voting in favor of censoring speech"?
Look, I totally agree with the content of your message (especially in this case), but you're making the argument against this look bad by making emotionally extreme statements like that. It might even be technically true by the definition you set up in the preceding sentence, but you're inciting an emotional argument that doesn't even need to exist.
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Re: Mike, your tone harms your credibility.
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I predict that one consequence of moving this forward will be that Obama's young voters will sit on their hands in 2012, leading to his failure to win re-election.
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There is too little competition for representatives of citizens (partly due to high costs to make yourself known and defend against attacks), and worse is that you have to pick one person to make a decision on hundreds or thousands of bills. That is very coarse-grained.
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SO, Mike, how will COICA and ACTA affect your "free" economy?
"many of the same Senators have been speaking out against internet censorship in other countries" -- Doing the opposite of words is a main feature of today's pols.
"these 19 US Senators are the first American politicians to publicly vote in favor of censoring speech in America" -- WW1 censorship was pretty severe. And we are "at war", right?
But seriously, whatta y'all gonna do about it? ... No, the IP # work-around won't last long, that's just a minor technical point: masking off any specific address requires only a large bitmap at most, though presumably would slow down servers; besides that, they'll soon just physically raid the premises, as most of these measures are for *domestic* use. -- Anyway, they've *crossed* the Rubicon of tyranny so many times that they've built a bridge.
So that's why I say we're doomed. This being Thursday, I lean toward chuckling over it, cause over the last couple of decades y'all wouldn't even look up from your empty entertainments to notice you're being caged in, step by step, not longer than to mutter "conspiracy theorist"...
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Re: SO, Mike, how will COICA and ACTA affect your "free" economy?
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COICA is not Censoring the internet
I think that concept of the law does not hurt free speech, the right to give away one's intellectual property, or true one on one sharing. - it should just prevent a massive downloading of your art without your permission. read about it here:
http://tinyurl.com/2a93hoc
No doubt the language should be specific to not allow Censorship of anything other than the description I copied above.
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Re: COICA is not Censoring the internet
Tell me, how long do you think the ideal of supporting creators and promoting innovation last if this bill passes?
The ideal will not even be attempted.
This bill needs to go down in flames if they refuse to cut the crap.
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Only after a judicial determination can the domain name be seized or an injunction be issued.
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There is due process *for some* parts of the bill, not for all. Furthermore, even the process you describe above almost certainly violates the First Amendment and the concept of "prior restraint" in that it takes down an entire website, rather than narrowly targeting specifically infringing works.
Only after a judicial determination can the domain name be seized or an injunction be issued.
Determination, not trial. I know you know that, but it's not clear from the way you stated it.
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I have not seen this raised before as an objection to the bill. Can you elaborate so I can better understand your point?
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WRONG - So far only the sites' users are being accused of violating the law, and often with useless evidence of any wrongdoing at that. This bill is using a Tsar Bomba nuke to kill a fly in the middle of Tokyo: everyone who could be there before, now can not. The intent of lawfully assigned liability is to assign said liability to the proper party before considering claims against said liable party. Taken to farcical extremes [ie. COICA included], this line of reasoning is sufficient for a me to be able to sue the US government for someone humming a tune to which I "own" the copyright; or better yet, to sue the RIAA. The simple fact of the matter is that this law allows for blatant censorship via failure to produce evidence for any actual unlawful activity otherwise.
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You're losing it. Sorry, but yes, they're already violating the law. Go read up on copyright and IP.
BTW, none of what Mike is trying to do is going to work. A book store in 1986 already tried Masnick's tact, and the Supreme Court laughed at them:
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=case&court=us&vol=478&in vol=697
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http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=case&court=us&vol=478&in vol=697
I already responded to this in another thread, but I'll repeat it here, since it's so laughably wrong:
'm glad you pointed out the Arcara v. Cloud Books case, because it actually demonstrates why you are wrong. In that case, the bookstore was shut down for prostitution -- which had nothing to do with expression at all. As is noted:
Copyright law, on the other hand, *is* about expressive activity, which is why the First Amendment applies, and any effort to take down speech must be narrowly tailored to take down the infringing speech only.
And, of course, we have cases that are much closer to the situation here. The CDT v. Pappert case involved a law that required ISPs to block URLs named by the state (sound familiar...) and was rejected as an unconstitutional restriction on free speech due to prior restraint.
More importantly, the Supreme Court in Near v. Minnesota is again quite similar. It was about a law that tried to shut down "scandalous" or "malicious" newspapers (sort of like "dedicated to infringement," right?) But it was struck down as a violation of the First Amendment.
Of course, I pointed these cases (and a few more) out to you in the past. Funny that you would ignore them.
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Neither of your examples works with regard to COICA.
And the Arcara case is exactly what will be used. Infringement isn't "expression".
You're trying exactly what they did: cloak yourself with the 1st Amendment to excuse illegal behavior.
And it won't work. Sorry. :)
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Again, you are falsely focused on the infringement. I'm talking about the non-infringing content. Why do you ignore that?
Anyway, we shall see which the courts actually rely on, won't we?
How about this: if it turns out we are right, you will (a) reveal who you are and (b) publicly admit that you were wrong.
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Since I won't expect people to go look up previous responses, I'll address them again here.
CDT v Pappert required ISPs to filter child porn websites. It failed for two reasons:
1. It was a lawsuit brought on by the state of Pennsylvania; since the filter might have an effect on other states that the ISPs served, the lawsuit failed due to interstate commerce laws.
2. Because of the random nature of the filtering used by the ISPs, they claimed that both legal and illegal sites might be affected. Legitimate websites were blocked.
The PA AG's case was a clumsy one, and deserved to fail.
COICA, with due process, looks to block the DNS names used by sites that are "dedicated to infringing" practices.
The second case Masnick cites, Near v Minnesota is a classic example of prior restraint. I suspect that's why he uses it, but the problem is that there aren't any parallels with it and any of the current situations discussed here on Techdirt. Especially the 1st Amendment. The Supreme Court based their decision in Near v Minnesota on the 14th Amendment, and how freedom of the press was being impugned. Rightfully so. Besides, libel laws are already in place to take care of such matters should someone care to dispute something written in scenarios like the above.
But there was no illegal activity already occurring in the above case, and obviously, there is no freedom of the press issue involved with intellectual property theft. Fear-mongers like to bring up wikileaks, however that site is protected by the above ruling, just as the Pentagon Papers were in 1971.
As the internet has evolved, it has become quite clear that it is about more than the exchange of information and opinions. Goods, both tangible and intangible, are now bought and sold. Legally and illegally.
The closest case to what you all are discussing is Arcara v. Cloud Books.
The Supreme Court, with my adds:
"The First Amendment does not bar enforcement of the closure statute against respondents' bookstore (website). United States v. O'Brien, supra, has no relevance to a statute directed at imposing sanctions on nonexpressive activity (infringement), and the sexual activities (infringement) carried on in this case manifest absolutely no element of protected expression. The closure statute is directed at unlawful conduct having nothing to do with books (non-infringing files) or other expressive activity. Bookselling (legal files) on premises used for prostitution (infringement) does not confer First Amendment coverage to defeat a statute aimed at penalizing and terminating illegal uses of premises."
An entity can not engage in illegal activity and expect to excuse themselves for such behavior because they also engage in legal activity and free expression.
I suggest you all get familiar with this case.
http://supreme.justia.com/us/478/697/
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He points out that it was rejected for two reasons, but does not note that the second reason was due to First Amendment violations. He's right that it's for blocking legitimate content, but does not seem to recognize (even though we've already pointed it out) that this is exactly what we're concerned about here. The issue is not about blocking infringing content, for which laws already exist, but how COICA does not just target infringing content, but entire sites that have much more than just infringing content.
That's why Pappert is absolutely relevant, despite JPJ's confusion about it.
As for the Near case, there are actually quite a lot of parallels to COICA, despite JPJ's confusion. It involved a state law blocking newspapers deemed "malicious." Basically the same thing as being deemed "dedicated to infringing," rather than focusing on the actual infringing content.
As for Acara, I've already pointed out why JPJ is (again) wrong. Note that he ignores what's actually in the quote there, in which the court specifically says Acara only applies to *NON-EXPRESSIVE ACTIVITY*. Yet, in the case of websites -- which are recognized as speech -- it is, quite clearly expressive activity. JPJs willful ignorance on this is pretty funny if it weren't so sad.
An entity can not engage in illegal activity and expect to excuse themselves for such behavior because they also engage in legal activity and free expression.
Again, no one has argued otherwise, which is what makes JPJ's complaining so funny. No one is saying that these sites are not liable for any infringement they actually do (the problem, of course, being that most of them don't actually do any infringing). The problem is how this law blocks the non-infringing stuff.
In the meantime, funny (and amazingly TELLING) that you refuse to even respond to the offer I made. Apparently JPJ knows his side on this is weak. I'll ask again, though, just for kicks: will you reveal who you are and admit you were wrong (and, apologize for bogus attacks on me) if the court agrees with me?
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Funny, you pretend to be such an advocate for individual rights, especially on the internet, yet all of the sudden you're obsessed with who I am...
You know you're diving headfirst into the trap I've set for you, don't you? Exposing you for the hypocrite that you so genuinely are?
Tsk, tsk, Mike.
Anyway, while I'm sure anyone can see the holes in your lame rebuttal, I'll just go ahead and point them out for those that need some guidance. :)
Regarding Pappert- indeed I purposely pointed out the blocking of sites; it's fait accompli that there would be a 1st amendment issue there. I respected the intelligence of your readers when I wrote that. Too bad you didn't.
And with regard to sites "that have much more than just infringing content", did you not understand what I wrote about Arcara v. Cloud Books?
a state law blocking newspapers deemed "malicious." Basically the same thing as being deemed "dedicated to infringing,"
hmm, except it's not the same thing, Mike. First of all, once again, Near v MN was a freedom of the press decision. Music piracy isn't. : )
Being deemed malicious is an opinion or accusation open to interpretation, for which there are libel laws.
COICA addresses sites which are already clearly illegally infringing. It's right out there in the open at this very moment. Go look some up. The evidence is conveniently already displayed for us. You already know this. And so does everyone else. You're not fooling anyone with this approach.
You keep referring to websites as being speech. As I noted, the internet has matured and websites are no longer just speech. Let me know what speech I am supposed to derive from the Bed, Bath and Beyond website.
I'm not quite sure if you're being pedantic when you try to equate infringement with expression. At this point all I can do is reiterate that infringement isn't expression. You really should stop trying to link the two. For real. It's not working.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: COICA is not Censoring the internet
COICA addresses sites which are already clearly illegally infringing. It's right out there in the open at this very moment. Go look some up. The evidence is conveniently already displayed for us. You already know this. And so does everyone else. You're not fooling anyone with this approach."
And there you're wrong... by whose estimation are those sites "clearly illegally infringing"? The main problem that Mike has been pointing out is that this law will allow the 'powers that be' to shut down whole websites without the due process of accusation and defense. All a 'wronged party' has to do is point the DOJ at the offending website and it's shut down in its entirety.
To show why this is bad, look at a political site... one that says something the political majority doesn't like. All they have to do is abuse the COICA (just like many entities do with DMCA) and accuse that site of infringement. It's removed from the internet. And while this site is jumping through the hoops and cutting the red tape to get their legal and legitimate contact back online, their opponents have successfully (and illegally) silenced them. But since there's a law in place that allows this process, it's cloaked in the sheep's clothing of law.
And here's another problem... you tried a grocery store selling illegal substances as a parallel to a website who is hosting content. And that analogy is flawed in one major point... a grocery store selling goods is not expression. A website's legitimate content IS. So by removing a website in whole is blocking the free expression of that legitimate content.
You make a lot of noise to debunk what Mike is trying to say, but you don't seem to listen to what he's saying the first place. You take side points and misquotes and ignore the main point just to sound right... as though you being right automatically makes Mike wrong. There's a logical fallacy for that, but I'm too lazy at the moment to Google it.
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As per usual JPJ is pretty good at demonstrating ignorance of the law.
The law is actually pretty clear on this subject: if you are a *platform* provider (as many of the sites targeted by COICA are) the situation is *VERY* different than if you were a store proprietor. JPJ is either totally misinformed or just lying. I'm not sure which is worse.
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What parts are lacking due process?
Furthermore, even the process you describe above almost certainly violates the First Amendment and the concept of "prior restraint" in that it takes down an entire website, rather than narrowly targeting specifically infringing works.
You may want to look up the meaning of "prior." A "prior restraint" stops speech before it is made. And copyright infringement is not protected by the First Amendment. This bill is limited to domains where the entire site is dedicated to infringement.
Determination, not trial. I know you know that, but it's not clear from the way you stated it.
A determination as a result of a trial.
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By the tenor of the article and most comments, it seems most here labor under the impression that an In Rem action is more akin to Traffic Court where the word of the police officer is almost universally accepted as the "Gospel Truth".
It also seems that most here have very little, if any, appreciation of the extent to which judges insist upon exercising independent judgment and authority, as by law they are required to do. It is disheartening to read comment after comment that fundamentally misapprehend the role of the judiciary.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: COICA is not Censoring the internet
In the initial bill there was a plan for a list to put together a "recommended" list.
In the current bill ISPs and other service providers are encouraged to block sites without judicial review.
You may want to look up the meaning of "prior." A "prior restraint" stops speech before it is made. And copyright infringement is not protected by the First Amendment. This bill is limited to domains where the entire site is dedicated to infringement.
You may want to look up the case law on prior restraint. And this is absolutely a situation of prior restraint. The issue is not the past content, but the future content that is blocked due to the takedown. By your ridiculous argument above, Near v. Minnesota would have gone the other way because it was all about newspapers that were already published, rather than those that weren't yet published.
Separately, surely you're aware of the Bantam Books ruling, which found prior restraint in already published works.
And, yes, infringement is not protected by the First Amendment (though, there's some debate there -- you should be fair on that). But we're not talking about infringement. Don't play semantic games. The point is that many of these sites do not have infringing content directly on them, but merely links and discussion forums, some of which may be infringing, much of which may not be. That's the concern. When you are taking down non-infringing speech.
There are existing laws to deal with infringing speech.
A determination as a result of a trial.
Um. No. The content is taken down *PRIOR* to an adversarial trial. You know that. It does not require the owner of the website be informed of the action or give them a meaningful chance to be notified of the hearing.
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Huh? There certainly are notice provisions in the bill: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s111-3804&version=is&nid=t0:is:29
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Notic e provisions to the registrant. Not the owner/operator. The two are often not the same.
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All this due process and not a single trial.
You'd think before taking down an entire website for copyright infringement the state would first have to prove that the website's owners are in fact guilty of copyright infringement, but not under COICA. Under COICA, if the US Attorney General thinks it's infringement and can find the support of a judge, the website is taken down exactly as if it were infringing. Even with the opportunity for an administrative appeal, whatever due process is granted doesn't make up for the lack of a trial.
Indeed, what you call due process is a joke compared to what it ought to be like. If a website is truly infringing the government should have no problem proving it in court so it can then have the website taken down. Too bad you COICA supporters have your heads stuck so far up your asses that you're unable to see that.
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Are you aware of the duties the AG is charged with?
Do you know what a judge is? Or what due process is?
They could send every instance to the Supreme Court and you would still bitch about it.
It's hilarious how you people actually think you're fooling anybody with all this "censorship" BS.
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Hate to break the news, but most lawsuits never make it to trial. They are either settled beforehand, or they are decided during the pre-trial phase, based upon either the pleadings or what turns up during discovery. This is why we have things like "judgment on the pleadings" and "summary judgment".
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: COICA is not Censoring the internet
Hate to break the news, but most lawsuits never make it to trial. They are either settled beforehand, or they are decided during the pre-trial phase, based upon either the pleadings or what turns up during discovery. This is why we have things like "judgment on the pleadings" and "summary judgment".
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Re: COICA is not Censoring the internet
Of course, it should be noted that the MPAA argued that the VCR, YouTube and many other similar technologies in the past were "primarily designed" for pirating, "dedicated to infringing activities" and had "no demonstrable, commercially significant purpose or use besides distributing pirated or counterfeited files."
The music industry said the same thing about radio and MP3 players.
I think that concept of the law does not hurt free speech, the right to give away one's intellectual property, or true one on one sharing. - it should just prevent a massive downloading of your art without your permission.
And by that argument there would be no VCRs, photocopiers, radio, MP3 players or DVRs -- all of which were declared "pirate tools" by various industries.
read about it here:
The link you sent is to a letter generation engine set up by Universal Music -- a company that clearly would stand to benefit from less competition in terms of alternative distribution.
I find it quite telling that the form that Universal set up DOES NOT ALLOW those who use it to edit the message at all.
No doubt the language should be specific to not allow Censorship of anything other than the description I copied above.
But the language is not that specific. It takes down *entire web sites* rather than specific infringing content (for which we already have laws that allow takedowns).
That's the big problem here. The law targets entire websites, most of which don't actually have *any* infringing content at all.
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ah, more disingenuous BS from Mike Masnick.
Sites "dedicated to infringing activities".
IOW, not just servers with content, but those that exist to skirt the law and direct and enable people to break the law.
And you support that Mike. What an upstanding person you are.
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That's what you're saying?
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hmm..
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LoL
Are there ways to evade taxes legally?
The entertainment industry I know will never see a penny from me ever again, now I just need to figure it out how to live without the federal government us much as possible.
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You Motherfuckers!
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The Real Sponsor Of This Bill
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shame
We need to stop censorship like this bill as it's anti-American. We also need to stop TSAbuse as it's also anti-American. The government is really batting 1000 these days. :(
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Re: shame
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California
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Re: California
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Re: California
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Re: California
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19 Senators
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Liberals at work.
Does it really surprise ANYONE that guys like Spector and Franklin who think that we're to dumb to even take care of ourselves, think that we need to have a babysitter for our internet ramblings as well? These are the guys who think that we need to all let them tell us what to do, how to live, and what is right for us, because we can't decide for ourselves. Not to mention that this gives them more power over the information at hand.
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Re: Liberals at work.
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Re: Liberals at work.
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How come party affiliation
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Re: How come party affiliation
•Patrick J. Leahy -- Vermont (D)
•Herb Kohl -- Wisconsin (D)
•Dianne Feinstein -- California (D)
•Russ Feingold -- Wisconsin (D)
•Arlen Specter -- Pennsylvania (D)
•Chuck Schumer -- New York (D)
•Dick Durbin -- Illinois (D)
•Benjamin L. Cardin -- Maryland (D)
•Sheldon Whitehouse -- Rhode Island (D)
•Amy Klobuchar -- Minnesota (D)
•Al Franken -- Minnesota (D)
•Chris Coons -- Delaware (D)
•Tom Coburn -- Oklahoma (R)
•John Cornyn -- Texas (R)
•Lindsey Graham -- South Carolina (R)
•Jon Kyl -- Arizona (R)
•Chuck Grassley -- Iowa (R)
•Orrin G. Hatch -- Utah (R)
•Jeff Sessions -- Alabama (R)
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http://www.mygov365.com/legislation/view/id/42005
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Parties
http://judiciary.senate.gov/about/members.cfm
Jefprice, you don't recognize any of the Republicans on that list? Or you consider them hardline left-wingers?
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Re:
Obviously.
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It's not the artists who have an issue with these sites, it's the industry that labels them. It's easy to go online and find artists who are balking at the greedy recording industry because they readily make their music available to download. Even they are rebelling against the greedy music executives.
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Surprising names
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http://www.newsmeat.com/campaign_contributions_to_politicians/donor_list.php?candidate_id=S 8MN00438
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Senator Feinstein responded to my letter about COICA.
I posted the letter here:
http://bit.ly/aloQ8c
What do you think about her letter?
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Re:
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Add that one to the long list of wars that will never be won and are simply a big waste of resources. I'm sure some fat cats will get rich off it, as always. At what point do we invade in order to impose our "rights" upon other sovereign nations?
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How about a huge belly laugh?
As your constitutional rights get voted out of existence, don't say you weren't warned by sites like this. I do not care what you think about infringement cases against the moneychangers and the gatekeepers. The only infringement I care about are the infringements against the Bill of Rights. And who is protecting them? It certainly isn't the US government at this point.
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Internet censorship
So - what's wrong with this again?
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sickening
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very disappointed in Franken
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THEY SHOULD BE CHALLENGED IN THE PRIMARY ELECTIONS, AND IF THEY SURVIVE THE PRIMARY, THEY SHOULD LOSE THE GENERAL ELECTION.
WE NEED TO ELECT ONLY ONLY ONLY CONSERVATIVES TO OFFICE !
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Re:
Because they're all about protecting free speech?
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Banning the Internet
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All the ususal suspects
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Re: All the ususal suspects
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Thomas Jefferson
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VPN, IPSec, P2P encryption, Neighbor's pipes...
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FFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
Knew there was a reason I hated that woman. Heck, all politicians from Minnesota (yes, I'm in MN) can't do their jobs and realize what the people want (as of right now, we just want a bloody governor!).
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First Amendment
" YA THINK!?."
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Re:
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Internet Censor Bill.
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Morals
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censorship
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Of course
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Really! It's really our leaders working together on something for a change...
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I no longer trust any legislator, neither federal nor state!
My goal for 2011 is for me to become politically neutral!
Hopefully by going neutral and NOT voting for anybody running for public office will change my luck for good!
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Re:
>>>I think it is time to fire everyone in congress and start over with people that actually understand what being poor or what it is like to have the government run our very lives.
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Re:
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IT IS TIME TO HUNT AND CUT HEADS OFF FRENCH STYLE
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Unconsitutional Sillyness
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IS THIS WHOLE WORLD THIS STUPID,IGNORANT , UN EDUCATED
1 illegals have a voice to and is destroying our rights ,not their rights, they are criminals working for legislators etc.
2 Regulations have stopped any and all business of manufacturing in Most states, hmmmm , HINT FUK ED UP CALIFORMEXICO, LAND OF FREE LOADERS OF TAX PAYER MONEY
3 Rigged voting on candidates who can never loose their stinking seats for the wills of them, not FOR our benifts !
4 Does anyone remember the BILL OF RIGHTS , CONSTITUTION, IF NOT READ THE DAMN THING AMERICANS !
5 YOU know it is time for declaring war on government , the question is not why but when they take your rights away to protect against the SCUM SOMEONE , NOT ME , ELECTED !
6 If the FREELOADERS KEEP THINKING ALL IS WELL, give me freebee's THINK AGAIN !
7 LAST RANT FROM ME ! WENT TO COLLEGE: DIPLOMACY :
DEFINITON : DIPLOMACY, to work out in a compromise , give on both sides, come to mutual agreement, both sides agree and balance issues, NOT LET DUMB AZZ GOVERNMENT , GREEDY , IGNORANT , OLD BASTARDS DEAL WITH CORPORATIONS TO MAKE MONEY ELSEWHERE AND KEEP ALL THE PROFITS, EXEMPTING TAXES OWED, TAKE OUR JOBS OVERSEA'S DUE TO EPA, AQMD, REGULATION , THE GOVERNMENT CREATED !
WAKE UP AMERICA, WAR IS COMING , I JUST HOPE TO HELL YOU KNOW WHO IS THE CORRUPT PROBLEMS, HELP EACH OTHER , THROUGHT CHURCH , GODLY NEIGHBOR FRIENDSHIP, WHATEVER, BUT WHEN THE DAY COMES , DON'T WAIT , GET THE ADDRESSES OF ELECTED OFFICIALS WHILE YOU CAN , AND EXTERMINATE THEM ALL !
DON'T WAIT, TEACHERS ARE TOO CORRUPT, GOV. TELLS THESE EDUCATED BABOONS WHAT TO TEACH YOU , IGNORANCE IS ONE OF THEIR HIGHLIGHTED PROGRAMS
GOD HELP US ALL, CAUSE THE RATS IN CONGRESS SUCK TO HIGH HELL
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Your amendments and constitution are falling apart and will cease to exsist when they join your country to Canada and Mexico and take down your borders,no more dollar either,they have a new currency planned the almero.Soon the armed forces will be knocking on your door to collect your firearms, when you hand in your guns its game over. Illuminate win.
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Re:
LIVE IN FEAR OR ARM AND FIGHT BACK WHEN THE TIME COMES!
YOU THINK I AM KIDDING , GUNS AND AMMO IS YOUR ONLY DEFENSE, DIPLOMACY IS A JOKE , A WORD ,
ANARCHY IS UNFORTUNATE, IT WILL COME AND HELL IS GONNA RUN IN THE STREETS, EUROPE HAS JUST STARTED !
WAIT TILL YOU SEE THE TAX AGENDA THEY ARE GONNA SMACK ALL US WITH, VAT , CALL IT CONSUPTION TAX, WHATEVER, WE HAVE A UNSUSTAINABLE SYSTEM AND THE VIRUS IS BIG GOVERNMENT !
YOU VOTED FOR CHANGE, SUCK IT UP AND EAT THE SHIT YOU ASKED FOR !
REMEMBER: WHO THE LITTLE HITLER'S ARE NOW !
THEY LIVE HERE IN AMERICA NOW AND UNTIL EXTERMINATED , COCKROACHES IN WASHINGTON !
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This is only a committee vote
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Read this and you'll have a better idea what it's all about.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-20023238-38.html?tag=cnetRiver
Then will you understand why these guys are for it.
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Re:
Because of the "flurry of last-minute lobbying from representatives of content providers including the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) and the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA)"? Or were you talking about something else?
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censorship
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19 senators, not one Hoosier
He is a Georgetown boy, so no big suprise.
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It's about piracy, not censoring the internet u dolts
It's not free speech to aid online piracy, and that's what this bill is about.
Idiots.
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Re: It's about piracy, not censoring the internet u dolts
U VOTED FOR CHANGE, GO COMMUNISM, HITLER'S REICH , YOU BABLING FUK N FOOL, FREE SPEECH MEANS FREE SPEECH, YOU GIVE IN YOU TOO MUST ME A VIRUS NEEDING ERADICATED !
WHAT COLLEGE DID YOU GO TO MIT, YALE , HARVARD, YEA YOU FUKED UP OUR SYSTEM AND HERE IS YOUR GO PAST GO, AND GET YOUR STAY OUT OF JAIL CARD, YOU MUST BE PART OF THE BIG PROBLEM ! WHAT A STUPID, ILLITERATE DICK HED YOU ARE!
SENSOR, MEANS YOU CAN'T GET INFORMATION , AND THAT IS WHAT OUR FOR FATHERS FOUGHT FOR , DUH DUMB ASS READ HISTORY AND HOW GOVERNMENT TAXED AND LAWED US TOO DEATH!
SENSOR, SENSOR YOUR IGNORANT SORRY ASS FOOL!
SE
FREE CARD
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Internet Censoring
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Re: Internet Censoring
You know the 7 Republicans on the committee voted for it too, right?
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Free Speech
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ahem...
This article is trying to paint a picture that copyrighted material on the net should not be protected. Thus, by adding a new layer of protection for those who actually put out a creative effort is somehow a bad thing.
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Re: ahem...
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Censor
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internet sensorship
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Re: internet sensorship
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Hmmm
Hmm usually u see an (R) or a (D) in front of their names..
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Internet Censorship
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OUTLAW LYING
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Cesnorship
That list contains an honor roll of liberal senators: Leahy, Feingold, Franken, Durbin, Whitehouse, Klobuchar.
So what was their objection? Not a word here of explanation.
Was this "censorship" a restriction of depictions of explicit sex to young children? Or child porn? Or "snuff films"?
I'd vote for that. Who wouldn't?
Maybe the alleged "censorhip" was bundled in legislation with a bunch of essential items.
Again, no explanation in this clip.
Unlike most respondents to this note, I choose to withhold judgment until I get more information.
gadfly
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Re: Cesnorship
http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/threatlevel/2010/09/CombatingOnlineInfringementAndCou nterfeitsAct1.pdf
It's not about child porn (amazingly), showing porn to children, snuff films, or puppies. It's a standalone bill that isn't included with a bunch of other stuff like fixing bridges or sending body armor to Afghanistan.
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internet censorship
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Vote to report
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Re: Vote to report
* I don't care if it "happens all the time" or is "the way things are done", it's still corrupt.
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The real victims
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Wow, hyperbole much?
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Re: Wow, hyperbole much?
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senators
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19 Scumbags
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Pay attention to real story
Please, people, educate yourselves before you go off on a rant.
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Re: Pay attention to real story
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list
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Let's look at what this vote was about, before condemning it!
Read more: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-20023238-38.html#ixzz15sV4Ra00
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Re: Let's look at what this vote was about, before condemning it!
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THE RUINATION OF AMERICA BY RADICAL LEFT
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Please fact check...
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internet voting
the other republicans that voted shame on you shame on you
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time to look for a new job!
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bottom line
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Freedom to dissent or Freedom to do what we are told?
Now when they say they have picked up bad guys that deserve to be tortured the UK may need to go to war to get them back. This time they were complicit and as of this week they were considering paying millions of dollars for their part in the UK citizens who were kidnaped by US to secret prisons & Guantanamo then tortured. Though the UK had to made a deal to get them home and even though their Foreign Secretary Hague has BEGGED Hilary Clinton yesterday for the last UK father, SHAKER AAMER, TO BE RETURNED FROM Guantanamo after being kept in solitaire for a year & incarcerated at Guantanamo for now almost 10 yrs. without a sgl charge & in-fact he has been confirmed along with his friend who has already been returned to the UK as innocent, which may be part of the reason the US wants to block the internet.
We need the internet to know who is being targeted just like during the American Revolution, because the 14 secret service agencies & the 185,000 secret servicemen, the pentagon, and the Blackwater or Xe & other Hit gang organizations now work for the Pres. & over half(more than 250) of the legislators who are now millionaires connected to corporations.
Most of us need to fire (if possible impeach the legislators. In Colo. I would love to see the Green Candidate Bob Kinsey and a peace activist Carolyn Bninski be our Senators.
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READ the BILL!
From the link in the article :
"
In the last week, support for the bill known as COICA, for Combating Online Infringement and Counterfeits Act, broadened beyond groups traditionally active in online copyright disputes to include the Newspaper Association of America, which said the legislation was needed because online piracy "undermines the investments that newspapers make in journalism." Labor unions, including the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, argued that American workers "have suffered significant harm due to theft of copyrighted and trademarked goods."
An ad appeared in a newspaper targeting Capitol Hill yesterday signed by groups including Major League Baseball, the NFL, Nintendo, and Viacom. The U.S. Chamber of Commerce pressed Congress to move quickly, and even Rob McKenna, Washington state attorney general, signed on to the effort."
Read more: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-20023238-38.html#ixzz15tDJwRYk
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Re: READ the BILL!
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Libssuck
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Re: Libssuck
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Shame on them
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So, if I were to go steal people's cars and built a website to market and sell those cars you are saying that the Gov would be censoring the internet by going after those who own the website?
I don't really see how the text in the law shown below is in any way a violation of the 1st Amendment.
any domain name "dedicated to infringing activities" could find itself in the U.S. Department of Justice's prosecutorial crosshairs
I haven't read the rest of the law but this doesn't equal censorship!
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Re: 1st Amendment
COICA goes way too far. There are already sufficient laws on the books. DMCA for example already goes too far. Copyright holders can send e-mail to your ISP and get pages of your site removed VERY quickly pending litigation if someone claim infringement.
The mere fact than any government official would suggest or support COICA makes me very suspicious and is downright scary!
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De-evolution of our culture...
http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2010,1034.html
The Reporters Without Borders website has the info on how the index was calculated. Their byline is "
"As of today, more than 200 bloggers and reporters are in jail".
http://en.rsf.org/
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Al Franken voted it but is against it?????
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censorship of internet
I expected nothing less from Chuck Schumer. He is a two-faced politician and unfortunatelyI live in New York State. This state is, and has always been for as long as I can remember, a heavily left liberal state. Once in a blue moon we get to put a Republican Governor in office and he turns out as bad as the Dem.
We in Western New York financially support Metropolitan New York and all her surroundings. They heavily tax us and Buffalo is slowly becoming a "GHOST TOWN".
AOL has already been censoring us in their comments and mine rarely get through. They did censor one of my e-mails sending me a notice that it was too controversial to allow. It was about OBAMA. My friends will attest to this since I sent them each a copy of the e-mail warning me to be more careful in the future what I send.
So these politicians are an excuse for what they are already doing on the internet....watching everything we do and eventually you will get a notice like I did and if you continue to p*ss them off, they will take away your e-mail privileges.
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Re: censorship of internet
The irony is strong with this one. Or is it cognitive dissonance?
Once in a blue moon we get to put a Republican Governor in office and he turns out as bad as the Dem.
And yet... you still believe the Democrats are worse. Yeah, cognitive dissonance. Or troll maybe.
AOL has already been censoring us in their comments and mine rarely get through. They did censor one of my e-mails sending me a notice that it was too controversial to allow.
This is very hard to believe, but if this actually happened, why in the name of all that's holy are you still using AOL?? You choose to use a service provider that you know will censor you, rather than finding a different one? Do you just need something to complain about, or what?
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Squash Antisemitic internet
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Re: Squash Antisemitic internet
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19 senators who voted for censorship on the Internet
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The 19 Senators Who Voted To Censor The Internet
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Crappy "journalism"
http://leahy.senate.gov/press/press_releases/release/?id=45b5a544-0f49-46d8-9782-ab7a3fe43a1 f
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Re: Crappy "journalism"
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well...
It's sad that so many people replied the way they did about so many great senators.
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Internet Censorship
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So nutty...
This is a nice theory, but to think it can be implemented in this way is simply retarded.
1. Blacklisting of words prevents the legitimate study of content including those terms
2. Removing the DNS entry only removes the domain name. The servers are still available if you know the IP address
3. Removing the DNS entries implies that the US owns the internet ... so much for the global internet
4. The technology isn't there to do it in a way that can't be bypassed easily.
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congrats
Seriously though... how did this manage to happen?
Why is it that there are so many sites like TechDirt, but do ANY of you companies actually do anything?
No, you twitter and prattle like it matters, publishing articles, taking comments, trafficking information, and selling ads.
Never once did I hear of a TechDirt or Gizmodo lobbyist, or writer acting as lobbyist.
Never once did I hear of a voice making a stand against the senate.
But hey, I'm sure Jay-Z is just as important as anything, right?
Disgusting.
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Not Censorship - Online Infringment
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=s111-3804&tab=summary
Here is another link with the actual bill.
http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/threatlevel/2010/09/CombatingOnlineInfringementAndCounterfe itsAct1.pdf
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They work for Israel, not America. That's why they voted as they did
Why are you so surprised these people would vote to censor the American internet?
After all 12 of the 15 are loyal to the country of Israel. They are voting for what Israelis want, not what Americans want.
* Herb Kohl -- Wisconsin
* Dianne Feinstein -- California
* Russ Feingold -- Wisconsin
* Arlen Specter -- Pennsylvania
* Chuck Schumer -- New York
* Amy Klobuchar -- Minnesota
* Al Franken -- Minnesota
* John Cornyn -- Texas
* Dick Durbin -- Illinois
* Benjamin L. Cardin -- Maryland
* Sheldon Whitehouse
* Tom Coburn -- Oklahoma
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Re: They work for Israel, not America. That's why they voted as they did
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In other words, everyone has voted yes so far
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Exposing their crimes and corruption is what they seek to limit.
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hmmm
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For those still claiming this is not about censorship...
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20101121/23584311958/why-voting-coica-is-vote-censorsh ip.shtml
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this is about censorship
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wi
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Mass Media
Quote from Edward Zehr
"I wouldn't call it fascism exactly,
but a political system nominally controlled
by an irresponsible, dumbed down electorate
who are manipulated by dishonest, cynical, controlled mass media
that dispense the propaganda of a corrupt political establishment
can hardly be described as democracy either."
Welcome to National Socialism. That is what I see coming for us.
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Senators trying to censor Internet
They can't even clean up their own talk, much less assuring someone else does.
Enough Congress/Senate, get off this mighteir than thou kick you have been on.
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Re: Senators trying to censor Internet
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Treason
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Re:
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Zionist Bolshevik Scum GO AWAY!!!
My 5 Cents from equally bolshevik-undermined Germany in the equally fascist EU (did you hear JARUZELSKI of all scumbags has made it back to Polish politics? What a bummer!!!)
People of the world, RISE UP!!!!
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It'd almost be better if they were just ignorant.
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stuart smally sucks
Joe R
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Kidnapped websites
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Most, if not all, are Jewish
Obama's Czars--mostly Jewish
Obama's cabinet--mostly Jewish
Federal Reserve member banks--mostly Jewish
Hollywood--controlled by Jews
Wall Street--controlled by Jews
Three Zionist judges now on the Supreme Court
There is a pattern here.
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Go'mint takeover of web sites
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censor
Everyone needs to be run out!
Our politicians have turned on us!
I tell you if you want to remain free you need to start voting for real Christians ! they are the only ones who
Integrity means something!
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The 19 Senators Who Voted To Censor The Internet
First you must understand, what phase 4 of this Boycott is about, it is a 10x10 posting into issues we face as a People. 2nd, that the People Of The United States have outgrown Government Officials and they seek a change, it was noted and shown by the movement of the Tea Party, and the voice of the people against this Health Care Bill.
One issue not seen to you is the International Boycott Of The Arabic Drug Empire Phase 4, in a goal to interface with the voices of the people to bring forward a change in Government to vote out every last man and woman in Office because of their failures in a lot of different issues.
The Freedom Of Speech is a God Given Right and it is the voice of the People that guides this Country and not Government Officials.
So I am going to go ahead and pick a fight. The line has been drawn in Tennessee, made a line at the top of Tennessee from East to West, this area below all the way to Florida is the area covered by Fasc Concepts.
Now these 19 Senators who wish to silence a People in what is now being called The New World Order movement. You 19 Senators and all your muscle, you have entered into the Matrix of the net and if you wish to leave this battle filed, and maintain your life within Government, we will allow you to leave, but first you must go on live TV and withdraw your insult to the American People, then put your heads between your legs and kiss your on ass.
Join us, unite with us in....
The International Boycott Of The Arabic Drug Empire
Henry Massingale / FASC Concepts in and for Pay It Forward covers the web post on google Drop by and see why we built a anti crime / war form in a Health Care Reform Concept. To strategically Rebuild America www.fascmovement.mysite.com on google look for page 1 american dream official site
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Re: senators closing down websites?
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Re: Re: senators closing down websites?
I don't recall any judges saying that. Do you have any references?
your Gov't has no obligation to function within the Constitution - and it is ALL legal!!!
Isn't that kind of a contradiction in terms? The Constitution says it's the supreme law of the land, so how can the government operate in contravention of it without that being illegal?
Probably a highly organised revolution as time is running very short.
If a violent revolution is only "probably" the best option, then keep looking for a better one.
America, the PTB have been conspiring for decades while YOU paved THEIR way in your labour.
Who is the PTB?
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Re: Re: Re: senators closing down websites?
The dumbing down of Amerika has been a total success.
“A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.”
Marcus Tullius Cicero
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I believe this. Google shut down my website.
Here is what happened. The reporter was upset that the newspaper allowed the SHARE icon on his story. The reporter then reported that ALL the websites where his article appeared (or that were subscribing to the feed) was stealing his content. They shut down my website and I couldn't find the content because it was in an RSS feed that had to be LIVE ON THE INTERNET to remove.
Shutting down websites should not be allowed without WARNING. If I could sue Google for doing this, I would.
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zio censorship
9/11 was only partly successful for the zio's, they got their wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and bogus war on terror or war against Islam into full swing, they got their multi $billion a year poppy crop flooding the world, they got us stripped of alot more of our rights, etc but they didnt get martial law imposed upon us, because Mossad stuffed up with the 5 dancing Israelis and by causing police to close all bridges after receiving a call saying "a certain bridge had Palestinian terrorists in it and police should investigate"
the police pulled over a van on the George Washington Bridge with 2 Mossad agents and full of explosives
the actions of the policeman who decided to question the occupants saved the bridge from coming down, with a bit of help with thermite
this stuffed up Mossads plans of future terrorist actions and martial law
this could also be used to shut down all conspiracy sites immediately after the next big round of inside jobs, just let the zionist mass media tell us their version of the news
our health is against the zio agenda, so our Health Rangers site would be at grave risk - these parasites make me so ANGRY
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internet censorship
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What they are hiding with internet censorship...
http://911missinglinks.com
http://ReDiscover911.com
http://whodidit.org/cocon.html
"They" already control and censor mainstream media "news". "They" are threatened by the internet exposure of rampant criminality--lies of Biblical proportions on which the foundations of domestic and foreign policies are based.
Orwellian--Brave New World
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19 Senators
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Re: 19 Senators
Jeff Sessions
Ranking Member, R-Alabama
Orrin G. Hatch
R-Utah
Chuck Grassley
R-Iowa
Jon Kyl
R-Arizona
Lindsey Graham
R-South Carolina
John Cornyn
R-Texas
Tom Coburn
R-Oklahoma
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Re: Re: 19 Senators
Dear Friend: Thank you for taking the time to write me. I have received your letter and I value your input, which is why I will personally read your letter. Please allow me time to review your correspondence to ensure you receive an accurate, detailed and thoughtful response to your inquiry. It may take at least 30 days or as many as 60 days to reply due to the heavy volume of mail that I receive. I appreciate your patience as you await my response. If this matter is time sensitive matters, please contact my office at (202)224-5754 and my staff is ready and happy to assist you. Sincerely, Tom Coburn, M.D. U.S. Senator
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Re:
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Like a who's who
Take for example, John Cornyn. When I lived in Texas, he was my senator. Every time I signed a petition, it was sent to him. His office always, ALWAYS, sent back a reply about how they valued my opinion, but he was against such and such. Such and such = helping the environment, women's right to choose, food safety and any other rational right you would think a human being was naturally entitled too. And Lindsey Graham?!?! I needn't say more. The name alone has become a brand, a personification of the persona.
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internet seizure
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RE: What can BE said ...
http://ning.it/ffrtbV
Is this the "beginning or the end" as we know it?
And besides, this is really in our best interest after. You know you can't handle the "POWER!"
I send love & light ... everything else is just in between!
~deZengo
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Re: RE: What can BE said ...
Aren't you the optimist? :-)
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First Amendment
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Huh
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But why on earth would conservatives vote for it? The further right you go, the more the people are in control.
I smell liberals in conservative clothing.
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But why on earth would conservatives vote for it? The further right you go, the more the people are in control.
I smell liberals in conservative clothing.
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Re:
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what was the number of the SB bill?
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dumb senators
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yup
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figures
wonder if they'll let me hold the Declaration of Independence so i can wipe my DIRTY ASS.....
one a side note where'd my PORN go lol...jk
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Internet Rights and Infringement
2. How do we know these 19 Senators are not part of a bigger plot to destroy our Freedom of Speech/Constitutional Rights and have placed this storyline on here to rid the Country of these (us) freedom fighters? They have us by the nads if they have our names.
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It's a stupid idea to even think about censoring the internet. Seriously, if they do manage to do it, the government will be under so much shit. Not just by average citizens, but by Anonymous as well. And judging by what Anonymous can do, they wouldn't be too pleased at the outcome.
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This is Utter Childish Nonsense
There are websites and applications that already have censoring means to prevent illegal download and/or mature content. Another move has been made to even push adult sites to a new domain extension via .xxx.
Their just impatient fools who aren't fully aware of the repercussions that this bill may cause if it passes. Here's a view: It's no fun playing a video game if all of the fun is taken out of it in the next version; it dies off like a bad idea because nobody is interested in it any more. Many folks will lose interest and/or perform a massive move to encourage folks not to use the internet. Like a national hunger-strike of internet access. I'm not really throwing ideas out there, just making a prediction. This isn’t like television to where the FCC can take off content and you’ll have to purchase a special channel, tape, or dvd -- the internet is different…and much more powerful to how information is handled and a nation’s citizens psychological disposition. If they really want to help remove illegal content (with only good intentions) in such as piracy they’ll need to do it gradually (redundant statement). Ah now a good example is that: You can’t rip off a damaged arm of a person and tell them to adjust, it has to be gradually prepared for the removal with the proper and easy-to-adjust-to care.
Overall I do not support this move. It's abrupt and is a childish decision to handle something.
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Is it any wonder
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internet censorship
It is a crime against my rights to censor the internet.
This is outrageous and I will educate myself about it and do as much as needed to oppose this vote. How dare the government try to take away Americans rights. Stop gearing towards communisum. We have fought and lost millions of great men in wars to avoid this tradegy.
I am a an American, a voter, a mother, an aunt, a sister, a daughter, a cousin, etc....and I speak for them and all the other billion of people in America and around the world to declare that this is an injustice to us.
I served in this country, for things like this. Was that a waste of my life when I signed the dotted line?
Sincerly,
Dina M.
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D vs R - Not Quite
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Re: D vs R - Not Quite
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