Microsoft Reminds Everyone: You Do Not Own Your Software
from the don't-hit-the-nuke-button dept
With the proliferation of smartphones and other portable electronic devices such as tablet computers and e-readers, we are often left wondering, "Do we really own the books, games and other apps we pay money for?" Now that question has spread to your computer as well. PC World has revealed that Microsoft's terms of service for its Windows 8 app store gives it the right to not only disable but also remove apps Windows 8 device owners paid money to own. In Microsoft's own words:In cases where your security is at risk, or where we're required to do so for legal reasons, you may not be able to run apps or access content that you previously acquired or purchased a license for.This is probably nothing new to users of the Amazon Kindle who had their copies of the book 1984 remotely deleted or to people who bought music from Rhapsody who had their DRM'ed tracks reduced to nothing over night. Nor is this unique to these businesses. As PC World also notes, both Apple and Google retain the right to remove software users of their devices "bought". Businesses have been calling to question the ownership of digital products for quite some time. If we cannot prevent the loss of legally purchased products from those which sold these products to us, how can we really claim ownership?
If it is any consolation to you, Microsoft has told PC Mag that it will refund buyers of apps it deletes. However, any data you may have saved using the app will be completely lost. So not even the work that you put into this software is yours to claim ownership.
While Microsoft claims that it will primarily remove software in the case of security violations, it also retains this power for cases of "legal or contractual requirements." This is quite the broad opening left here. With the looming threat of increased enforcement of Copyright through SOPA and PIPA, the idea that an app can be removed via a "legal requirement" creates yet another question over ownership. If an app we purchase ends up infringing some company's copyright, patent or trademark, they could theoretically use that as a tool to remove that app from our devices.
We are moving further and further into a digital landscape for everything from movies, music, books, games and software. With this transition, companies that produce these products are working overtime to remind consumers that they are not owners of these products but merely licensees. We will not have the luxury of physical media on which we can claim ownership rights for much longer. Consumers for the last few years have been clamoring for more digital content. They have been the primary drivers of this transition. The only real question left is, do they realize the consequences that come with this change, and will they demand the right to claim ownership?
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Filed Under: deletions, ownership, software
Companies: microsoft
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What hypocrites!
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Re:
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The Scariest Part
Lately I've realized that I'm really, really lucky to be just old enough to have spent a few years with DOS and seen the emergence of Windows - because it means I actually understand what a computer is and how it works. What files are, and what programs (a word my brain still goes to before "apps") are.
So when I hear about a digital movie "rental", it's just insulting and condescending - and when I hear about the remote shutdown of an app or deletion of a file it's just seems like a total violation. And an app that won't even run without contacting a server is fucking stupid engineering.
But at least I know how stupid and wrong all that stuff is. Now most people who use a computer don't really know the difference between an application and a website. They don't really understand what a browser is.
And I guess it makes sense and is inevitable to some degree. Most people who drive don't know how a car works. But still, it freaks me out, because of stories like this one. I hope that people retain enough education about the machines they rely on to understand why digital information is infinite, and why remote management of their machines is a egregious, aggressive action.
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Re: The Scariest Part
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That's how I roll.
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http://www.stevenhumour.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/save-button.jpg
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By the by, remember 8 inch floppies?
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Yep, I do. I may even have one stuffed away somewhere in my closet.
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your mum does...
:p
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I think I've still got an 8" one somewhere...
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I dont know, kids are into all kinda freaky s**t these days....
:p
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Re: The Scariest Part
Most people today couldn't change their desktop resolution if their lives depended on it.
Pick anyone with a digital camera and I guarantee you that there are at least three copies of every photo sitting on the hard drive.
My friend needed my help to post an ad to Criagslist because they couldn't figure out how to upload photos. Technically they were doing everything right, it just didn't like their 2300x1700, 3MB files. Even if they knew the reason why it didn't work, they wouldn't have had any idea how to resize the images.
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Re: The Scariest Part
I know what utter crap that is but, as you say, there's a lot of people who don't know.
Nor do they know things like backup early and often and, in the case of data, synch to a place such deletions can't access.
It's true, literally speaking, that all I have is a license to my programs/apps whatever (let's just say executable files) but that data is MINE, created by me for my own use with said executable file.
Back up, export to something readable like a text file if necessary but get it the hell off the device. In some cases and situations I'll accept remote management as long as I'm fully aware of what it does and what I can do to bypass if I must.
At least Microsoft is being up front about this as opposed to a certain other iEverything company is.
Oh, and let's not forget what I consider malware no matter how it got there, CarrierIQ.
Ain't tech fun!
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Re: The Scariest Part
Unfortunately, most people are just to lazy to care about all that stuff.
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Re: The Scariest Part
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Back. It. Up.
Like preventing forest fires, only you can back up your data. Buy an external HDD (preferibly two) and mirror everything important - because when hardware fails or a company wants to delete what you purchased. Heck, a lot of people can keep their most important records on a couple of thumb drives. $20 can save a lot of money down the road if you just remember to Back It Up.
This has been a Public Service Announcement from someone who has been paid to recover data off dead computers. No, I do not like you screaming at me because you didn't back it up and now have to pay me to recover your missing files, which may not be possible. Screaming does not make recovery attempts cheaper or faster. There is no discount for complainting. Yelling louder does not help. No, I am not responsible for you not following my advice.
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Re: Back. It. Up.
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Re: Back. It. Up.
And by the cloud, I mean a file server sitting in my bedroom named cloud.
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So what happens when a DRM server is "broken" by the new SOPA/PIPA law if it passes? That's truely the scary part. I'm not a big fan of digital media. This is why I still buy CD's. You can't delete data off a CD. I get to keep all the music I pay for.
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Exactly. One of the many reasons it's stupid engineering.
This is why I still buy CD's. You can't delete data off a CD. I get to keep all the music I pay for.
Well, iTunes music is DRM free now, as are many other stores - so you're safe there.
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You do not own your software.
Do I own my personal details -such as birth date, browsing preferences etc? Can I force a Company eg Google to pay me for the right to collect and use my data? And if they don't pay me but do use my data can I sue them?
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Re: You do not own your software.
In summary, avoid entering into contracts where possible to keep your ownership rights over your own data, and the devices and software you buy.
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its called cracks and backups
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re
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Also by the way every major desktop environment has to be redesigned to run only with a touchscreen sorry about that.
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Hello, Gnome 3?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gnome_3.2_shell.png
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNOME_Shel l
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unity_%28user_interface%29
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx9FgLr9oTk
MS has a lot of catching up to do yet. Just to be 5 years behind!
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xC5uEe5OzNQ
"You'll notice that this scanner, Bill(Gates)...WHoooa"
What were you sorry about again? Oh, right! I find PCLinuxOS
is very easy for those new to Linux.
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Worth reading in this regard...
The way out is, of course, not to purchase anything from Microsoft or Apple or Google or Sony or any of the others that have already proven that they'll take it back without notice and without compensation whenever they feel like it. Everyone who buys anything from these companies is endorsing and supporting this practice by voting with their wallet. The only way to make it stop is to cut off their air supply: stop giving them money.
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This is why
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Re: This is why
Afters years of reading the abuses of MicroGates, XP is the last s/w I will ever buy from him.
I have said goodbye to Mr Softee, Sony, IApples and array of other companies, which have sought to control and manipulate their consumers...
For better or worse, Linux, should be the future for all...
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Anyway, this new to me game I've tried, I like. I went to buy it. Only the first thing I read on the outside of the box is that an internet connection is required to 'license' the game. At that point, I put the game back on the shelf and walked away without purchasing it. I've had it with DRM requirements that want an internet connection to game on single player.
Just because they want to spy on what is on your computer, control distribution, and do it on your dime doesn't encourage me to buy. The game was around $60 and for me a heft charge. Still I would have bought it, had it not have had this internet connection requirement.
I don't agree to that, will not agree to it, and purposely run a computer for gaming without net connection so it won't phone home. This is money the gaming house would have gotten except for the requirements that stick like a thorn in my craw.
That requirement does not stop pirates, only those that would actually spend the money to support good game programming. AS a pirate, you wouldn't have to put up with that for a minute.
So tell me who lost in that transaction that claims various rights in order to use the program?
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You and I and others like us are the last line of defense against loss yet we're the first offered up for cannon fodder.
Puts me right off, that does.
Signed,
Ex-customer.
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The Cloud, Apps, Remote License Management (DRM)
I'm a semi satisfied windows 7 customer, but it looks like I won't be participating in Windows 8. At the very least, I won't be touching their official app store. I gave up on Red Hat a while ago due to inconvenience. Maybe it's time to give Linux another go...
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Louis C.K. love-fest...
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Re: Louis C.K. love-fest...
All in all, I don't mind either. I got it now so change away. It works so change away. Just don't demand that I have an internet connection so it can call home. THAT, I'll block and then fake.
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Re: Louis C.K. love-fest...
So it's not great, but it's not terrible either...
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Re: Louis C.K. love-fest...
A copy of the digital file and the opportunity to stream it at this present moment.
The agreement has already been changed (you're allowed 3 downloads rather than the initial 2), but I think that clause was more regarding the streaming option and future support. i.e., at the time of launch, you could stream the video or download copies, but there will probably be an unspecified time in the future where neither service will be available, he might also decide to change the file formats, and so on.
Either way, you get to keep the file and Louis CK isn't going to be able to suddenly remove the file from you if he wished. I don't believe that the agreement would be changed in detriment to existing viewers, although I could be wrong. That's the difference here.
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You've never read an MS license before?
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amirite?
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Re: That was cool
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Second, welcome to the future. You didn't want to do it any other way, so things are moving rapidly in a direction you won't like. I find it endlessly amusing that Windows8 will work hard to stop security issues before they happen, and that includes getting rid of software that is at risk. I am laughing as more and more of you move onto "cloud based" solutions, including downloading software on the fly (see microsoft 365 as an example). What you seem to ignore is that it means that the providers can move your cheese at any time, they can change the product, and you have no recourse.
It's a brave new world, welcome to it. You are the ones who shaped it, so enjoy it.
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You are spinning so hard, you can't even tell the difference between Knight and Mike!
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It might as well by Mike writing it, because it's pretty much exactly what he would say.
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It's a corporate targeted solution anyway, and more power to them if they can find a market there.
One of the annoyances of Win7 is that it tries to "stop security issues before they happen" just as Win8 will but it's as leaky as it ever was and Win8 will be too.
There are very good reasons for that but I doubt you're all that interested in wandering in the halls of techie stuff as you have neither interest in it or ability to understand it.
Nor am I moving to "cloud" based solutions. For example every picture I upload to Flickr is there to share not to store. I keep my own copies safely here, thank you.
Even moreso now given the insanity of SOPA and ICE I'm not about to trust my data to a cloud based solution based in the United States. (Or anywhere should it come to that.)
Anyway, I'm glad you're amused, even if you're mostly amused by fantasy of your own making and not reality.
They've always had the ability to change product and save files in incompatible ways. Hell, MS Office is infamous for it. And no, I don't have any recourse, except to switch which I did long ago.
If I were you, though, I'd watch things like your last sentence. If we shaped the world, WE have the power to change it.
So, thank you very much, we'll enjoy it as you freak out over fake issues like endless piracy, how poor and destitute the RIAA and MPAA are and several other things you get excited over.
I actually look forward to your posts, as illogical as they are and as full of untruths as they are (see, I even used Parliamentary language there to call you a liar) and how cowardly you are.
Reading you and imagining the foaming at the mouth as you type lightens up my day hugely.
The place won't be the same without you once you get bored of being alternately ignored or insulted. Never worry though. We know another troll will come along.
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I can only assume you're referring to Windows 8 not allowing dual boot solutions? As in, if you install 8, you can't install Linux as well. If so...then apparently, you know sweet fuck all about computers, if you're actually saying that Linux is "software that is at risk". Linux is not risky, at least not compared to Windows.
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Re: “Windows8 will work hard to stop security issues before they happen”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHOOHOOHOOHOOHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
OHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOOHOOHAHAHAHAHA!
AHHHHOOHOOHAHAHAHAHA!
</wipes tears from eyes>
</linux>
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I ran into this issue on steam and my games two years ago
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Re: I ran into this issue on steam and my games two years ago
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basic plan
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Re: basic plan
There is no difference except expiration date.
Digital = their whim
Physical = when damaged
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""That's the beauty of software these days. You purchased the hardware, which you have in your possession. You didn't purchase the software. You purchased a "license" to the software. Sony is still providing you with software, albeit in updated form. They fixed a bunch of bugs, and added new "features." What's not to like?
This is the fundamental problem with software "sales" as they currently exist. They're a hybrid sale/license, such that the laws associated with sales and licenses don't really apply well. The software industry hops to the side that benefits them the most. Oh, you want to sell your copy of SuperMetalHaloBrothers ? Sorry, you *licensed* the software, and the license is non-transferrable. Oh, your kid munged your CD for SuperMetalHaloBrothers and, since it's licensed, you'd like to just get replacement media? Sorry, you *purchased* the item and you'll need to re-purchase it because the original item was destroyed.""
Posted by Migraineman (632203)
http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2572668&cid=38363364
http://www.techdir t.com/articles/20111213/18342917073/judge-says-otheros-removal-was-bad-business-decision-not-illegal .shtml#c286
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The Whole Concep of "Sale" is Under Attack
Unfortunately, those (content creators) who scream the loudest about their so-called property rights being abused are hypocrites concern the property rights of others. They refuse to accept that anyone else can have a property right.
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Another sign I'm old...
Sigh... ;)
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I was expecting them to continue the model (namely "sell-it-by-whatever-way-you-please") we have before.
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2) Large companies get to write the laws.
3) People download illegal copies of software.
4) Combine 2 & 3 and that seems pretty fair to me.
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Why All The Fuss?
Any system where software is updated be it on-line or by DVD or whatever gives the vendor a potential kill switch. So "kill switches" have always been there. They're nothing new.
Microsoft have always maintained as most software companies have done, that you are purchasing a license to use the software within the scope of their EULA. And indeed technically speaking it's the same situation with open source software. Even though OSS licences do tend to be a lot more liberal, the original developer holds on to their copyright. Why would that change just because Windows 8 is just around the corner?
Frankly it's all a load of fuss over nothing to get people talking about Windows 8. Which Microsoft really needs. And sadly it's working.
The current view in the industry is Windows 8 will flop. Which has Microsoft already talking about changes before the final launch. As with Windows Vista and Windows 7, the only people buying Windows 8 will be Microsoft die hards and consumers who aren't offered a choice when they buy a new PC with the OS pre-installed.
Could it be 3 strike and Ballmer's out!?!
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Misunderstanding
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