Ex-Prenda Lawyer Wonders If Team Prenda Believes Their Own Lies After Laughable Hearing

from the keep-trying dept

Fri, Aug 30th 2013 2:51am — Mike Masnick

Earlier this week, there was yet another hearing dealing with one of the many courts investigating the actions of Team Prenda. This was in the Navasca case up in San Francisco, where some sanctions have already been issued, and more may await. Judge Edward Chen handed off this stage of the case to Magistrate Judge Nador Vadas, who recently demanded some actual answers, telling "AF Holdings" (one of the many Prenda shell corporations) to show up ready to answer some very specific questions. That's not quite what happened.

The day started off with a laughable declaration from John Steele, in which he stuck with his plan of deny absolutely everything. This focused on denying every bit of Delvan Neville's expert analysis showing a high likelihood that John Steele and Paul Hansmeier were themselves seeding the files they later sued over, via The Pirate Bay. Neville's analysis is detailed, thorough and hard to argue against. Steele and Hansmeier, along with Paul Duffy (the official "named" partner of Prenda) have been insisting that there is nothing to Neville's filing, and keep insisting that he's a nobody, rather than an expert.

I note initially that Mr. Neville is a graduate student; that he has not disclosed why he prepared his declaration.... whether he will successfully complete whatever course of study he is now engaged upon as a "graduate student;" whether he meets any of the rigorous standards applicable to an expert witness in a Federal court proceeding in a Federal court proceeding. (sic)

Upon my review of Mr. Neville's declaration, I find the claims contained therein pertaining to me to be completely untrue and without any basis in fact.

Mr. Neville asserts I may have acted to "seed" a BitTorrent "swarm" involved in the digital piracy of copyrighted works. Those assertions (perhaps better described as suspicions) are categorically false. I have never acted to "seed" a BitTorrent "swarm," and would not know how to do so if for some reason I would desire to try.

It goes on like that. Of course, this is all pretty laughable, given the mountains of evidence that connect Steele to the seeding, including Comcast revealing that the IP address associated with the seeding belonged to Steele Hansmeier, and the information provided by GoDaddy involving John Steele impersonating Alan Cooper and Mark Lutz. Those both came out in a different Prenda case, but showed up in this particular hearing.

Only Paul Duffy from Team Prenda showed up to the hearing (though he showed up late) and while it was promised that Mark Lutz was "in town" and would be there, he never showed up at all. The star of the show was former Prenda team player Brett Gibbs, who, after realizing that Hansmeier and Steele had thrown him under the bus, started finally revealing the truth. Hansmeier and Steele have continued to insist they had little oversight over Gibbs, but at the hearing he produced phone records showing somewhere around 4,500 minutes of phone calls with Hansmeier. He was later asked to identify the recordings on those calls, and said they were John Steele's voice -- which Duffy weakly objected to.

After Neville testified about the inner workings of BitTorrent, it was Duffy's turn, and many people expected a full cross-examination of Neville. Given that Duffy, Hansmeier and Steele have been insisting that Neville's claims are a complete joke and wouldn't stand up to any scrutiny, you'd think they'd relish a chance to have him on the stand. But they more or less ignored him. Instead, Duffy spent a ridiculous amount of time tying himself into knots with an astoundingly weak attempt to pin the blame on Gibbs himself, focusing mainly on procedural issues. The two points he seemed to focus on: that Gibbs never actually saw the infamous "Salt Marsh" signature and that Gibbs never officially checked to see if the Steele Hansmeier law firm was dissolved or purchased after Steele and Hansmeier told Gibbs they'd be doing business as Prenda going forward.

Neither point makes much sense, nor does it really matter. On the signature front, Gibbs has already stated, repeatedly, that he'd asked about Salt Marsh and Hansmeier insisted it was legit. If there was a procedural error, it was trusting his boss (and friend and former roommate). Either way, this could only come back to bite Duffy, since it was Duffy's law firm that Gibbs supposedly worked for, and sooner or later this comes around to lawyers technically working for Duffy's law firm violating procedures. As for the status of Steele Hansmeier, that seems like a pointless tangent.

Thankfully, it appeared that Judge Vadas was pretty aware of what was going on. While not as outspoken as Judge Wright, he made it clear that he wasn't buying what Duffy was selling:

At this point, Magistrate Judge Vadas broke in to ask Duffy a question. "Counsel, where are we going with this?"

"Counsel has the obligation under federal and local rules to maintain the original signature and he [Gibbs] didn't do it!" said Duffy. "He's trying to blame other people who weren't on the case. Any liability should fall upon him, as the filer."

Duffy went on. A minute later, Vadas broke in again, with the same question, asking where the line of questioning was going. Duffy was trying to show that Gibbs had changed his story as a result of a "deal" with another defense attorney in Florida, to drop sanctions against him.

"It strikes me from what I have heard so far that there's a chain of command here, and that Mr. Steele and Mr. Hansmeier were managing partners of the firm that became Prenda Law," said Vadas. "This counsel and other counsels were contract lawyers doing the heavy lifting in whatever states these lawsuits were being filed... Isn't that a fair analysis?"

Some have argued that from Duffy's performance, he appears like he's in way over his head. Of course, given all of the evidence piling up against him and his colleagues, I'm not sure how he could do any better.

Still, the best line of the day may have come after the hearing was over, when reporter Joe Mullin from Ars Technica chased down Gibbs in the hall and asked for an interview:

"I'm just trying to get on with my life," he said. "I'm pretty overwhelmed by this. There just needs to be some truth in this, in the whole matter, and that's why I came today. I don't know if they believe their own lies, at this point."

To be fair, Gibbs was a big part of that lying machine at some point, even if he was just taking orders from Steele and Hansmeier, but kudos to him for finally coming clean.

John steele declaration in navasca (PDF)John steele declaration in navasca (Text)

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Filed Under: alan cooper, brett gibbs, delvan neville, edward chen, john steele, mark lutz, nador vadas, paul duffy, paul hansmeier
Companies: af holdings, ingenuity 13, prenda, prenda law

56 Comments

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Reader Comments

The First Word

“

Telethon Time

If you enjoyed the downfall of Pretenda, now is a good time to show your appreciation.
The downfall did not start with a court or a lawyer.
It started on a couple little websites...
http://fightcopyrighttrolls.com and http://dietrolldie.com
It took a long time for these blogs to be taken seriously, all the while more people were being targeted by copyright trolls.
Now its your turn to help the community that helped bring everyone's favorite asshats to the forefront.
You can donate time, money, knowledge, or just an ear willing to listen to a Doe scared out of their mind.

You can help answer peoples questions and concerns about these cases. You can gather information on how some trolls operate and share with all. You could verify copyrights exist and were issued before or after cases were filed.

Accessing documents from PACER costs real money, and many of these costs were paid by just a few. For a small amount sent to those checking dockets, you can unlock another filing to be examined and explained to Does.

You could just post a message of support to someone feeling terrified and alone, fearing they are being sued for $150,000.

Won't you take a moment today to show your appreciation to the community who brought you the comedy stylings of these assclowns?

We now return you to your regularly scheduled Pretenda Coverage.

—That Anonymous Coward

”

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S. T. Stone, 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:32am

I don�t know who to feel worse for: Gibbs for getting tossed under the bus or Judge Vadas for having to sit through that load of horseshit offered up by what remains of Prenda Law.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- That One Guy (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:43am
  
  Re:
  That would be the judge, Gibbs may be playing nice now, but never forget that for a good while there he was in the thick of it along with the rest of them, making countless lives miserable via extortion letters, and only changed his tune when he suddenly realized just how screwed he was going to be.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:59am
    
    Re: Re:
    As I said over on Ars.
    http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/08/in-3-hour-hearing-prenda-attacks-its-former-lawyer/ ?comments=1&post=25194759#comment-25194759
    
    @Chuckstar - that feeling does pass after a while. This isn't the first time he was aware their were issues in the litigation, and not even the first time he played the 'butbutbut cancer' card.
    He needs to atone for a multitude of sins he committed and facilitated.
    I have slightly more respect for him than I previously had, but 1 drop in an empty bucket is merely a start.
    
    I hope that the Judge subpoena's a copy of Lutz's airline ticket/reservation and confirm he actually made the flight. I mean its not like anyone at Pretenda EVER lied to a court before. o_O
    
    Like that time they told a Judge subscriber information was all they needed to make the case, then demanded the right to search a targets home and all computing devices... There was a young lawyer handling that case for them... what was his name again? Oh yeah... Brett Gibbs.
    http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2011/09/p2p-lawyer-ip-address-not-enough-let-me-search-al l-pcs-in-the-house/
    This is from a S|H case, and somehow he managed to keep working for them after he was involved in clearly misleading a court and being berated by a Judge.
    
    His self preservation is his motivation, not truth, justice and the american way.
    There are more to go down for this, but never consider what Gibbs does is for anything but his own ass.
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Trails (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:43am
  
  Re:
  I don't feel an ounce of pity for Gibbs. He helped propagate the Prenda nonsense knowingly, he only turned on them after they burned him. While I'm glad Prenda is starting to fall apart, and Gibbs is finally being less untruthful, it's motivated by self-interest, there's nothing altruistic or noble about what he's doing.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:39am

"I have never used software that monitored or detected digital piracy." - John Steele

"Steele said he and a partner spent about $250,000 to develop software that tracks illegal BitTorrent sharing from an office in Minneapolis." - John Steele to Chicago Tribune Reporter.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2010-11-15/news/ct-met-porn-attorney-20101115_1_face-l awsuit-anti-piracy-campaign-copyright-violators

So other than legal hairsplitting, wouldn't this statement imply he never used such software and that many of the cases where they claim to have detected infringing downloads would then be false?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:33am
  
  Re:
  It was actually a $250,000 random number generator.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Ben (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 6:46am
  
  Re:
  Well, one statement was under oath to a judge. The other was a statement to a reporter. I wonder which one he lied to?
  
  Popcorn! I need popcorn!
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:59am
    
    Re: Re:
    He might have just forgot.
    He likes to say things in affidavits because he isn't under oath to a Judge when he writes them.
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
Ninja (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:41am

No! They are secretly comedians working for our amusement. When this ends they'll release the DVD "Prenda Stooges" and it'll also be available on Netflix!
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Rabbit80 (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 4:00am
  
  Re:
  Don't be silly.. they'll release it on The Pirate Bay then send extortion letters to anyone who downloads it! And they'll change their names and send the letters from AssClowns Law.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
That One Guy (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:51am

Two rather telling points...
First is that while Steele continues to claim that Delvan Neville's analysis is bogus, he does so entirely via personal attacks, trying to attack the credibility of Neville, rather than attacking the methodology and evidence presented and showing where it was flawed.

Also rather telling is that he appears to have avoided and/or refused signing any legally-binding documents refuting the claims that he was involved with seeding the files that he then went on to sue for, which, given his continued protesting of innocence, is rather odd to say the least, unless he was afraid of potential perjury charges down the road, should such a declaration be proven false.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 4:00am
  
  Re: Two rather telling points...
  it allows his stories to adapt...
  We never seeded anything.
  Well even if we HAD, it wouldn't matter.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - Anonymous Howard (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:38am
    
    Re: Re: Two rather telling points...
    In that, he's smarter than the NSA
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- nic42 (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:55pm
  
  Re: Two rather telling points...
  Seems that he filed an affidavit with the court where he declares under penalty of perjury that he had never used such software or was involved in the seeding of files.
  
  Actually, the arguments he uses to say he was not seeding files at all would be the same arguments that the respondents (read victims) to his suits would also use.
  
  I wish I could eat my cake and have it too. Why isn't this joker in jail facing perjury charges based on his Chi Tribune statements and signed affidavit? Or if we are to believe his affidavit on its face, why is he not facing sanctions for filing suits he does not believe can hold up in the first place?
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 4:03am

Telethon Time
If you enjoyed the downfall of Pretenda, now is a good time to show your appreciation.
The downfall did not start with a court or a lawyer.
It started on a couple little websites...
http://fightcopyrighttrolls.com and http://dietrolldie.com
It took a long time for these blogs to be taken seriously, all the while more people were being targeted by copyright trolls.
Now its your turn to help the community that helped bring everyone's favorite asshats to the forefront.
You can donate time, money, knowledge, or just an ear willing to listen to a Doe scared out of their mind.

You can help answer peoples questions and concerns about these cases. You can gather information on how some trolls operate and share with all. You could verify copyrights exist and were issued before or after cases were filed.

Accessing documents from PACER costs real money, and many of these costs were paid by just a few. For a small amount sent to those checking dockets, you can unlock another filing to be examined and explained to Does.

You could just post a message of support to someone feeling terrified and alone, fearing they are being sued for $150,000.

Won't you take a moment today to show your appreciation to the community who brought you the comedy stylings of these assclowns?

We now return you to your regularly scheduled Pretenda Coverage.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- simality (profile), 31 Aug 2013 @ 11:04pm
  
  Re: Telethon Time
  > we now return you to your regularly schedule Pretenda Coverage
  
  Wait! Not so fast!
  
  Getting back to TAC's telethon:
  
  If you have been following me on Twitter (@simality) for the past two months then you know I've been pretty diligent in my recapping efforts.
  
  Even if you haven't been following me on Twitter, you've probably benefitted none the less. A number of the documents mentioned in Tech Dirt and Ars Technica were recapped by yours truly.
  
  My PACER bill for the past two months: http://www.scribd.com/doc/164410160/My-Pacer-Bill-for-the-last-2-months
  
  I can't keep this up. I don't mind helping, but I'm not going to bankrupt myself for the Cause. If you would like to help me keep going please consider sending a donation to simality@gmail.com.
  
  Thanks,
  Katherine
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - That Anonymous Coward (profile), 1 Sep 2013 @ 12:18am
    
    Re: Re: Telethon Time
    Katherine has been handling the PACER and doing quite well.
    So if your looking to help and you have a few bucks, this is where it should go.
    PACER might "only" be 10 cents a page, you can see how fast these things add up. Even $5 would get 50 more pages. It doesn't take a lot to help the community, just a little effort.
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it

horse with no name, 30 Aug 2013 @ 4:09am

I'd point out how you're all missing the point, but it'd probably get censored again. Mike Masnick obviously doesn't dare answer my questions and would rather censor my posts, along with the only civilized, righteous people that dare to say anything different. What a joke this site has become.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- That One Guy (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 4:22am
  
  Re:
  For someone constantly being 'censored', your whining posts sure seem to show up often...
  
  Kinda getting AJ flashbacks here with the 'Masnick would never dare debate me!' attitude, so I'm guessing either you are him, or you for some reason thought his 'argument' style of 'make claims, have claims soundly debunked, shift-goalposts, try again and pretend first two steps never happened' was more than the joke everyone else saw it as.
  
  Also 'civilized', 'righteous', 'defender of extortionists and fraudsters'... one of these things does not belong with the other two, can anyone spot the odd one out?
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 4:59am
  
  Re:
  did it hurt when you came up out of the ground from hell?
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:08am
  
  Re:
  "What a joke this site has become."
  
  The only joke here is you and your kind. You haven't changed a single mind here with your nonsense, nor will you ever. Find another site to troll or create your own.
  
  Don't let the door hit you in the ass...
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:18am
  
  Re:
  OH the irony.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - a norse with no brain, 3 Sep 2013 @ 12:42pm
    
    Re: Re:
    "OH the irony."
    
    What does hydroxide have to do with anything and why is it ironic? :)
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 6:08am
  
  Re:
  I'd like to point out that any point you're likely to make is probably bullshit at best.
  
  Go feel sorry for yourself somewhere else, John. As if you have any basis to call someone out on not answering questions...
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:26am
  
  Re:
  horse with no name just hates it when due process is enforced.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Joe Dirt, 30 Aug 2013 @ 9:28am
  
  Re:
  Every post I have read from you on this site has no point at all.. It's simply a name-calling rant with nothing to contribute to the discussion.
  
  How is it possible that not one person who disagrees with the posts on this blog can have a civil debate without reducing themselves to name-calling trolls? How can you go through life responding to everyone who disagrees with you with a derogatory statement? If the views provided by the blogger or commenter are so stupendously wrong, I would think it would be easy top refute them. Instead what you get is something like... 'assertion from Blogger: "Up is Down." Response by OOTB or Horse: "Masnick is a doo-doo head!"'
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - Anonymous Coward, 1 Sep 2013 @ 4:31pm
    
    Re: Re:
    Oh, we've had a few detractors. In fact, a good few of the regulars have, at times, had reason to disagree with a post themselves. We welcome debate that is done in a civil, respectful manner. Sadly, we do get too much of the ad hom and misdirection you see from this particular horse.
    
    The reason it has no name is it's dead, and he just keeps beating it.
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 10:44pm
  
  Re:
  Hi john
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 11:31pm
  
  Re:
  Have you considered a new career in stand-up comedy? It might be a nice change of pace from your current sit-down comedy.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it

out_of_the_blue, 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:10am

Mike spent at least an hour of his "busy day" writing this.
Yet doesn't affect him personally, nor have any wider application or implications. Sure, we all like to see lawyers thrown into woodchippers -- for actual crimes of their own making -- but his continual fascination with this -- even though new readers won't know its basis -- his fascination with Prenda is just amazing. That's time Mike could spend working on fixes for the "broken" copyright and patent systems, or at least writing responses here when questions arise about his notions.

ZOMG! Yet another item on Prenda Law! A staple in the soporific "At The Bench" series. Mike sez (short version): "Wow. Wow. Wow. ... The story is gripping."
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130303/23353022182/prenda-law-sues-critics-defamation .shtml
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:16am
  
  Re: Mike spent at least an hour of his "busy day" writing this.
  doesn't affect him...
  huh, his website was named in motions before the court, his comment sections were submitted as evidence... sorry you didn't make the cut.
  Wider implications, you mean like posters being sued for defamation for reporting the truth?
  New readers, who might click on those little blue words to find more stories tagged prenda and get informed.
  Lawyers who created their own cottage industry of extorting cash from people, guilty or not, because they put porn online and encouraged the infringement they sought to profit from?
  Questions, do you think yours or horse's blather actually are questions? You didn't manage to ask a single one.
  
  In closing Mr. Dodd, your old just dry up and blow away. The future belongs to the young.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:49am
  
  Re: Mike spent at least an hour of his "busy day" writing this.
  Which does raise the question... what the hell do you spend all of your time doing? Stalking Mike?
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Anonymous Coward, 8 Dec 2013 @ 7:43pm
  
  Re:
  out_of_the_blue greatly dislikes it when due process is enforced.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
RyanNerd (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 5:26am

nom nom nom ....
popcorn... nom nom nom
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 6:53am

4,500 minutes of phone calls with Hansmeier.

Meta-data strikes again.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- Vanye (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:33am
  
  Re:
  I think it's more likely "phone bill" rather than "meta-data".
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - Baldaur Regis (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 8:08am
    
    Re: Re:
    Your phone bill IS a record of the metadata associated with your physical phoneline. For each call made from your line, there is is typically a record of: date of call, number called, length of call.
    
    Steele et al asserted (in some depo or other, I disremember which one) that Gibbs had minimal supervision, the implication being that he was a bad doggie what with all the suing and everything. 4,500 minutes of documented evidence casts a likelihood of doubt that Gibbs was acting without orders.
    
    Metadata, like any other information, is neutral in and of itself and has value only when put in context.
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
Mr. Applegate, 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:35am

"I have never acted to "seed" a BitTorrent "swarm," and would not know how to do so if for some reason I would desire to try."
Oh, really. If you have no knowledge how to do this, how do you know you did not do it? How do you know others did? How many others have access to your email account? How many others have access to your internet connection? It is obvious to this court that you uploaded the porn because the IP address point to you, a middle aged male.

Is that the same logic you used on your extortion attempts? Have you repeatably stated that was enough evidence to at least require payment? Why should the rules be different for you?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 8:02am
  
  Re:
  He ran a firm(s) that explained BT in every complaint they filed, developed software to catch them...
  and he has NO idea how it is done.
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
Baldaur Regis (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 8:34am

Quote o' the day
Affidavit of John Steele re CV-12-2396 EMC paragraph 10:
Since I have had at least two different Internet Service Providers during the time in question, and given that my accounts have always had dynamic IP addresses, I believe it would be impossible for me to have the same IP address during the timeframe of Mr. Neville's analysis.
Even though a close reading shows this says absolutely nothing, this is a COMPLETE repudiation of the basis of every single BT copyright infringement case, written by an expert in the art. Lawyers, take note, and govern yourself accordingly.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 8:34am

Next strategy....Duffy claims to have never seen Gibbs before in his life.

Steel claims he's never practised law and it must have been a different Steel...possibly one that lives near a salt marsh.

Steel phones the court to say he can't make the next hearing because he killed himself earlier that morning and will send photos later to prove it.....

Hell that strategy isn't actually any worse that the current ones they're trying (and failing) with....
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 10:31am

Simply, ootb has no creditability. Obvious troll is easy to spot. His hypocrisy isn't very limited in that he'll demand that Mike debate him (which requires two way responses) but some how can't be bothered to respond when anyone questions one of his way out ideas. He can't even stay in the kitchen as it's too hot for him and then he thinks he's some of of masturbater entitled in his head to special treatments.

All of this comes down to pure ego; a hallmark of someone else in this article, namely Steele. Ootb isn't smart enough to be Steele. In fact he's not smart enough to be a practicing lawyer.

He's just a sad little troll with too much time on his hands and not enough skill to back up his assertions.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
- AzureSky (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:42pm
  
  Re:
  reported(so you dont think mike is why this is hidden from view...mind i would hit "stupid" if that where an option but its not)
  
  i duno, i have met some pretty stupid laywers.....specially public defenders and persecutors/prosecutors....
  [ link to this | view in chronology ]
  - AzureSky (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:42pm
    
    Re: Re:
    sorry didnt report this post, stupid copypasta got in there :S
    [ link to this | view in chronology ]
anonymouse, 30 Aug 2013 @ 11:37am

Drumm roll !!!!
Just a bunch of fools playing the game in the way the courts allow it to be played.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Anon E. Mous (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 11:50am

With every hearing that happens, Team Prenda goes deeper and deeper in to the abyss.

Duffy didn't want to go near Neville because there would have been more dirt exposed by the defense team on Prenda and their seeding of the files they sued alleged infringers over.

This isn't the first hearing that Lutz the mastermind CEO of AF Holding and it's subsidiaries and LLC entities has failed to appear at.

Now why would Lutz who is so involved in his companies operation and in managing these lawsuits not wan't to disprove all these allegations against himself and Prenda?

Wouldn't have anything to do with that hearing in the Sunlust case in Florida where the Judge started Questioning Lutz who was trying to pass himself off as an officer of Sunlust when it turns out Lutz knew absolutely nothing about anyone associated with Sunlust.

Lutz had to have Steele (who has nothing to do with Prenda Law but just happened to be in the court room for a Prenda case) feed him answers about being a 1099 contractor before the Judge noticed Steele feeding Lutz answers and busted them on it.

I don't blame Steele, Hansmeier and Duffy for not wanting Lutz in a court room, Lutz isn't bright enough to survive any questioning, and would cave much like he did in the Judges questioning in the Sunlust case, how could they trust him.

Steele's fragile ego cqn't seem to keep anything straight, on what he has told in interviews and in prior court filings. Duffy shouldn't even be let near the court room as his skills in trying to break someone boarder on laughable in my mind.

Did Steele, Hansmeier and Duffy really think Gibbs wouldn't have phone records to prove contact with who he was speaking with at Prenda regarding these lawsuits? I mean how stupid are they.

I would bet that Gibbs has more than this, I would believe he has e-mails, voice mails, landline based phone call records, mobile based records as well as faxes, and courier slips.

It should be interesting when the Prenda gang goes to the hearing for the bar complaint against Gibbs everything in that hearing will be on the record and under oath so it should be a hoot to hear the Prenda gang complain and Gibbs coming back at them with all of his trail of records for the various items mentioned above, plus the various rulings against Team Prenda from the various court rooms around the country.

Steele I believe made a very calculated gamble at trying to throw Gibbs under the bus for all this, and it would seem Steele thought he could cow Gibbs into taking the rap and stay quiet.

It should be very very interesting to see if a Grand Jury is looking at RICO where the Prenda gang would be concerned. If a Grand jury is looking at RICO, Steele has just gave it a powerful Allie in Gibbs and documentation and inside knowledge of the scheme.

The above would apply to the IRS Criminal investigation as well as where settlement money went, how monies were used, and who monies where distributed to.

Steele's ego has led to a blunder of colossal proportions in trying to crucify Gibbs in taking the fall, if anything it shows the desperation in Team Prenda to try and stay out of the light that is being shone on it's operations.

This has had the opposite effect and the light is being cast brighter and all the dark spots are being examined. It will be interesting to see what is going to transpire out of the cases Prenda has been trying to get itself out from under, but can do to all their miscues.

Should be interesting to see, I am sure there are many more sleepness nights ahead for old John Steele wondering when the US Marshall's are going to drag him away to a cold jail cell
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- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 31 Aug 2013 @ 3:32am
  
  Re:
  OHAI! 1 tiny little quibble.
  Lutz was attempting, poorly, to pass himself off as the corporate representative of SunLust, not sure that is an officer position. Just someone appointed and authorized to act on their behalf in a matter.
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George Vandelay, 30 Aug 2013 @ 1:15pm

It's not a lie, if you believe it!
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Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 1:18pm

Seeder, seeder, pumpkin eater!
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Anonymous Coward, 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:08pm

"I'm just trying to get on with my life,"

Said everyone threatened by these scammers. Why would anyone have any pity or sympathy for this crook is beyond me.
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- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 31 Aug 2013 @ 3:34am
  
  Re:
  in order...
  
  butbutbut cancer.
  butbutbut I'm just a dupe.
  butbutbut they hung me out to dry.
  butbutbut I've wisely decided to start telling the truth.
  
  He has quite a bit to make up for, this is just but 1 step on a really long journey.
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AzureSky (profile), 30 Aug 2013 @ 3:43pm

we need access to the NSA data on these guys...:P
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Mom, 30 Aug 2013 @ 7:45pm

Kind of ironic that you steele, arguing a dynamic IP and trying to use that as a fact. Also, I would doubt comcast would have released that info without checking ___ triple checking that it was really on his account. Can't imagine they would have risked a law suit over this being who they found on the other end of that ip.
Sure the comcast legal department loved that....
John your busted . and if I can say very stupid to think that you wouldn't get fingered. Everything on the internet is saved somewhere. For you to do this and not use a vpn or use another connection shows me that you think you are above it all. That your immune> you are truly a piece of work.
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- That Anonymous Coward (profile), 31 Aug 2013 @ 3:36am
  
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  Comcast is still dragging their feet producing information, one wonders about the reasons.
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  - Anonymous, 31 Aug 2013 @ 2:21pm
    
    Re: Re:
    According to Comcast's latest filing, they're not producing the info until there has been a decision by the court on AF Holding's motion for a protective order.
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    - That Anonymous Coward (profile), 31 Aug 2013 @ 8:29pm
      
      Re: Re: Re:
      is this the 'ZOMG THEY ARE MAKING FUN OF US MOTION' or another one?
      The lame legal paperwork ghostwritten out of Pretenda is getting confusing.
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